Why is the Hummer hated?!

BTW, just to show I feel your pain....

Despite all the concerns voiced above, if LR ever got off their rear ends and reintroduced the Defender tdi over hear, I'd have a _really_ hard time not buying one and running it on biodiesel.

http://www.landrover.co.uk/gb/en/Vehicles/...er_overview.htm

There were serious rumors going around about a 2008 relaunch, but I have a feeling the new diesel requirements may have killed it (although it looks like the new model does have a crd vs tdi.....).

Rob

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MegansPrius @ Sep 13 2007, 01:42 PM) [snapback]512013[/snapback]</div>

Excellent article. Thanks!

If you want some more Gladwell goodness you can check out his Poptech

https://www.poptech.org/popcasts/PopCasts.aspx?viewcastid=49

and TED lectures.

http://tedblog.typepad.com/tedblog/2006/09...lm_gladwel.html

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MegansPrius @ Sep 13 2007, 01:42 PM) [snapback]512013[/snapback]</div>

Excellent article. Thanks!

If you want some more Gladwell goodness you can check out his Poptech

https://www.poptech.org/popcasts/PopCasts.aspx?viewcastid=49

and TED lectures.

http://tedblog.typepad.com/tedblog/2006/09...lm_gladwel.html

 

Best quote from the Gladwell article:

"According to Bradsher, internal industry market research concluded that S.U.V.s tend to be bought by people who are insecure, vain, self-centered, and self-absorbed, who are frequently nervous about their marriages, and who lack confidence in their driving skills."

Regarding the diesel Vs gas conversation. Do the experiment. Go to this website and compare a few gas with diesel counterparts:

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/sbs.htm

You will see the oil consumption of diesels is just a bit less than their gasoline counterparts. With regards to biodiesel or biofuels in general the advantages are also minimal because of the oil and natural gas used for fertilizer and energy production. You are just moving carbon around. The only way to improve energy consumption is unfortunately, reducing it.

 

Best quote from the Gladwell article:

"According to Bradsher, internal industry market research concluded that S.U.V.s tend to be bought by people who are insecure, vain, self-centered, and self-absorbed, who are frequently nervous about their marriages, and who lack confidence in their driving skills."

Regarding the diesel Vs gas conversation. Do the experiment. Go to this website and compare a few gas with diesel counterparts:

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/sbs.htm

You will see the oil consumption of diesels is just a bit less than their gasoline counterparts. With regards to biodiesel or biofuels in general the advantages are also minimal because of the oil and natural gas used for fertilizer and energy production. You are just moving carbon around. The only way to improve energy consumption is unfortunately, reducing it.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(PriusOwner004 @ Sep 13 2007, 04:02 PM) [snapback]512130[/snapback]</div>

Can't agree more. Its a very big step in the right direction. My point was only that while biofuels can be cleanish, its not a given. Same argument for EVs. I really want an EV, but recognize they are only as clean as their power source and not the mythical answer to all transportation problems. Now hydrogen, that is the holy grail Just kidding btw, don't get me started on Hydrogen :lol:

Ok, its scaring me a bit that we're agreeing

Rob

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(PriusOwner004 @ Sep 13 2007, 04:02 PM) [snapback]512130[/snapback]</div>

Can't agree more. Its a very big step in the right direction. My point was only that while biofuels can be cleanish, its not a given. Same argument for EVs. I really want an EV, but recognize they are only as clean as their power source and not the mythical answer to all transportation problems. Now hydrogen, that is the holy grail Just kidding btw, don't get me started on Hydrogen :lol:

Ok, its scaring me a bit that we're agreeing

Rob

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Alric @ Sep 13 2007, 04:40 PM) [snapback]512159[/snapback]</div>

Well, sort of. Most of them here do, as most of our diesels are vastly oversized. When the size of the diesel is scaled back to accomidate for its greater efficiency / torque output the results are a little more reasonable. In the case of the UK version of the Land Rover Discovery 3, the 4.4L gas v8 gets 18.8 mp(i)g while the 2.7L tdi version gets 30.7mp(i)g. CO2 generation is 354g/km gas, vs. 244g/km diesel. Thats pretty impressive in my book, but still diminished by its excessive smog emissions.

UK data: http://www.vcacarfueldata.org.uk/

Trying to find a reasonable sized US diesel for a mid-size truck/SUV is almost impossible. Most all are in the 6-7L range and produce 500+ ft-lbs of torque. Not surprisingly they don't produce very impressive mpg numbers. Even the little 2.8L Italian cdi Jeep tried in the Liberty was tuned for 295 ft-lbs of torque, with the resulting lackluster mpg numbers.

Rob

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Alric @ Sep 13 2007, 04:40 PM) [snapback]512159[/snapback]</div>

Well, sort of. Most of them here do, as most of our diesels are vastly oversized. When the size of the diesel is scaled back to accomidate for its greater efficiency / torque output the results are a little more reasonable. In the case of the UK version of the Land Rover Discovery 3, the 4.4L gas v8 gets 18.8 mp(i)g while the 2.7L tdi version gets 30.7mp(i)g. CO2 generation is 354g/km gas, vs. 244g/km diesel. Thats pretty impressive in my book, but still diminished by its excessive smog emissions.

UK data: http://www.vcacarfueldata.org.uk/

Trying to find a reasonable sized US diesel for a mid-size truck/SUV is almost impossible. Most all are in the 6-7L range and produce 500+ ft-lbs of torque. Not surprisingly they don't produce very impressive mpg numbers. Even the little 2.8L Italian cdi Jeep tried in the Liberty was tuned for 295 ft-lbs of torque, with the resulting lackluster mpg numbers.

Rob

 

I'm not really that bugged by the H1; it does what it's supposed to do. The H2 and H3 are just dumb in my opinion: the classic example of looking tough without actually being tough.

BTW, for those that find an Hummer too small, check out the International XT series. These are semi truck cabs transformed into SUVs.

 

I'm not really that bugged by the H1; it does what it's supposed to do. The H2 and H3 are just dumb in my opinion: the classic example of looking tough without actually being tough.

BTW, for those that find an Hummer too small, check out the International XT series. These are semi truck cabs transformed into SUVs.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(PriusOwner004 @ Sep 13 2007, 06:06 PM) [snapback]512198[/snapback]</div>

I do have to disagree with the statement.

We shouldn't be WAITING a few hundred years. If we were serious we could start tomorrow. Solar power is attainable and competitive. I just isn't subsidized like fossil fuels are.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(PriusOwner004 @ Sep 13 2007, 06:06 PM) [snapback]512198[/snapback]</div>

I do have to disagree with the statement.

We shouldn't be WAITING a few hundred years. If we were serious we could start tomorrow. Solar power is attainable and competitive. I just isn't subsidized like fossil fuels are.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(PriusOwner004 @ Sep 13 2007, 01:45 AM) [snapback]511809[/snapback]</div>

I learned that word from the hair and makeup guy at the Mark Taper Forum in Los Angeles when I was in a show there some years ago. He also told me what a "fluffer" was.... [blush!] You can get a real education in the performing arts!!!

About the video.....gee, do you think every schoolteacher in South Carolina was moaning in incredulity and disgust at her comments? Gal's a rocket scientist for sure!!! :lol: