Why I Hate my Prius Prime

Horrible car. The MPG readout can't display beyond 199.9? What if it is really 300, or 500 MPG? I have to do the maths? I have only 175 miles on the thing so far and @199.9 I may have won the game, but the real score is hidden somewhere in the computer? C'mon, Toyota! Give me readout!

 

Well it is twice as good as the Hyundai Ioniq that won't go over 99.9 MPG.

Bob Wilson

 

Don't forget the ultimate accessory so you can shine on all those Prius haters. TruckNutz

 

Yeah, you've got it right, I meant minutes. I deduce that in US the apex sign is commonly used to indicate a lenght in feet. I didn' t know..

 

Mine are for sale lol. So loud!


iPhone ?

 

Regarding the OP where the prime is hated because it only teases you fir a full EV vehicle. ...

A plugin hybrid is a diferent animal from a pure EV car. I certainly specifically chose not to buy a pure EV car because i would then need yet another car that uses gas for trips or be forced to rent a gas car when i have to travel.

The charging infrastructure is just not there to make EV cars practical and neither is charging and battery technology. Furthermore heating the cabin in north east winters significantly reduces the range of an pure ev vehicle.

Mainly i need a car to get from point a to pont b without me being concerned for provisioning for the car. Gas stations are pleantiful on my long trips, charging stations are absent. the prime fits that bill were it is easy to charge at home for gas free local use but its a super efficient on gas regular car for distances.

 

Absolutely - my eclipse viewing trip this weekend didn't come close to stressing out the Prime's range, despite long distances, horrible traffic and rural roads, but it would have been a catastrophe in a 300 mile Ev because of the rural locations, the time required to charge, the number of people on the roads (~5000x normal), and the distance between chargers.

 

Imagine the people clogging the roads trying to get away from the hurricane coming to the Texas coast.

 

I would not feel safe with just an electric car. I want the ability to go on gas when needed.

 

Our room bookings are way up even in OKC from the people coming north. Gas prices here jumped 10 cents this morning.

 

I worked for 2 months as a Red Cross volunteer during Katrina. The coastal area of Texas is in for a nightmare and a long recovery. Even possible for an environmental disaster with the oil refineries there as 35+ inches of rain and 130 mph winds work the area for days.

 

Hey everyone,

I recently filmed a video about some of the things I don't like about my Prime (had it since January with 22,000 miles driven so far), seems pretty applicable to the original post here. I also just created my priuschat.com account and look forward to using the forum and filming more videos about my car.

 

I read faster than you talk and don't have 11 free minutes.

In the morning I'll purchase my custom tag "199 MPG". I'm taking the Prime tonight because the distance fits and I don't need the BMW i3-REx for every trip. You see, I have two plug-in hybrids which gives a sense of perspective.

Bob Wilson

 

Just in case it wasn't mentioned, there are innumerable problems with "Hydrogen" or fuel cell vehicles. They have been the next big thing for decades. The problem is that Hydrogen has to be "produced" from somewhere; while hydrogen may be super-abundant in the universe, there’s very little pure hydrogen on Earth or in our atmosphere. That means it needs to be "produced" somehow...the cheapest and easiest method of producing hydrogen is to extract it from methane! Yep! All that zero emissions talk is bunk, just like it is for EV's. They best way to reduce emissions is to drive less. See Tesla car battery production releases as much CO2 as 8 years of gasoline driving | Watts Up With That? or When Used Cars Are More Ecofriendly Than New Cars - Scientific American

As to the range issue, this should have been thoroughly researched and considered before purchase! This is the reason I got my PHEV so cheap--people didn't do due diligence and HAD TO HAVE the latest technology and maybe the rebate. Then they became disenchanted and sold! The largest cost (in fossil fuels, emissions as well as money) comes in the PRODUCTION (and sale) of a NEW VEHICLE. Look up the price of a used Leaf!

I love that I can take off on a road trip with no worry about finding a charging location and can refuel in 5 minutes. (And when I can I use EV chargers as I did on a recent road trip, where often they are free!) I have done many of these and the WORST MPG I have averaged (with 4 people + luggage on a 7500 mile cross country) was 50 MPG! ON my east coast road trips (600-1500 miles) I have averaged 54 MPG. When I drive it locally only, I get from 76-176 MPG. Pretty good if you ask me, without having to worry about range or how long I have to wait to charge if I can find a station--assuming the EV station is not being used, blocked by a ICE or just down.

And keep in mind I do this with the older PHEV Prius! I am waiting until I get the right price and all the issues are known, before I spend my $$.

 

Just like electricity!

The advantage to a fuel cell is that a fuel-cell + tank has about 3-4 times the energy density of the very best lithium batteries. A fuel-cell is basically a battery that can be re-charged at an equivalent power of 10 times that of a battery and which has the energy density of a gasoline engine + tank, but which has a lower efficiency than a battery (by about a factor of 3).

 

Unlike electricity, hydrogen doesn't have an existing distribution network. The cost of building that is what will prevent it and such FCEVs from succeeding in the US.

Give the FCEV a plug, and the public might stomach to price for a smaller network.

Offer a FCEV that runs on gasoline, diesel, or alcohol, and they might take off.

 

This has always been my preferred approach, and my problem with the existing FC cars. They should all be plug-in hybrids, and H2 stations should be like the supercharger network - relatively few, widely dispersed. But they would have a major advantage over the supercharger network - you can slowly generate H2 day and night, store it, and refuel in a few minutes. So they don't need 6 or 8 or 16 stations at each location, just one or two (since cars will be in and out in minutes). And they don't need a powerful grid connection - just 75kW or so (versus 1000kW for a supercharger station) because they are going to store H2 for later use.

This also means you only need a 1/10th (or so) sized fuel cell in each car - just enough for average power, not for peak.

 

That is how I envision Hydrogen having a chance, but transferring a gas from pump to car will never be as easy, or as cheap, as pumping a liquid. The SAE standard that makes a 3 minute refill of @ 5kg of hydrogen possible considers 15 minute fills acceptable.

An hydrogen station along an interstate is going to require as many pumps as a gasoline station now has. In addition to the fuel storage tanks, the station requires pressure tanks for filling cars. The hydrogen is pressurized to an amount over the 10k psi the car tanks fill too. For a 3 minute fill, the hydrogen in that tank also needs to be chilled to -40C. If the tank isn't full or fully chilled, then the fill will take longer. It's like pneumatic tools, you need a tank of pressurized air to run them. Pressure drops too low, the tools don't work, and you have to wait. Then there is the added variable of it being hot out slowing down the fill time for hydrogen.

If you are unlucky enough to pull into a hydrogen station when the fill tank is empty, then you are looking at waiting as long as you would for BEV. Which isn't an unsurmountable problem, just one that takes more cash to reduce the impact of.

Making hydrogen on site is the least efficient way of doing do so. Reformation plants get more efficient with size. Electrolysis is just of piss poor efficiency; a BEV will be able to cover 3 to 4 times the distance that a hydrogen FCEV does with the same amount of electricity. If the grid supply is too low for fast chargers, build capacitor banks.

 

This is only true if all vehicles are hydrogen.

No, it's really not, unless you consider reformation just as poor.

But have to tote around a battery weighing 3 to 4 times as much to do so, and that will be the case until batteries don't suck anymore.

Really, we're talking about the difference between 200Wh/kg usable and 900Wh/kg usable. So "3 to 4 times" is conservative.