Who killed the electric car? Who cares?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(FloridaWen @ Jun 18 2007, 01:49 PM) [snapback]464154[/snapback]</div>

EV'saren't service-free, just 'cause they're electric. Honestly, I don't know...but I wonder if driving a pure electric would really lower maintenance costs that much...?

This sounds a little like a blacksmith saying that horseless carriages would crush the trade...so buggy manufacturers would never allow it.

The maintenance items which you mentioned don't really amount to the majority of gasoline-powered car maintenance costs, as I see it.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Godiva @ Jun 16 2007, 04:21 PM) [snapback]463155[/snapback]</div>

THAT's the BIG issue! Detroit has focused on the quick profit to the detriment of the entire industry. Their idea of "improvement" has been to add flashier hubcaps or bigger tail fins (in the 50's). Meanwhile, Japan, Inc. kept IMPROVING their products. Sadly, many consumers are still fooled by the Detroit get-rich-quick schemes.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinto Girl @ Jun 18 2007, 07:27 PM) [snapback]464351[/snapback]</div>

Don't think so? Take a look at the "scheduled maintenance" pricing at your local dealership. They rape you for hundreds EVERY several thousand miles mostly for inspections and small replacements of the items listed in that post... I think dealerships would miss that money a lot.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinto Girl @ Jun 18 2007, 07:27 PM) [snapback]464351[/snapback]</div>

Believe me, as an ex-Service Manager at a Chrysler Dealership (many year ago) customers were "pouring in the money for the old man (owner)" with brake jobs, oil changes, belts, tune-ups (which included spark plugs, air & fuel filters), radiators and heater cores, etc. and the big money makers.... transmissions, clutches and exhaust systems, and let us NOT forget Vehicle Emissions Testing !! These will not be needed on the electric vehicle.
I am NOT saying that electric vehicles will not need things like tires, wheel alignments, tire rotations, replacement windshields and body parts due to accident, light bulbs, wiper blades, washer fluid, maybe some sort of rubber belt?, etc. but NOT the big, money grabbing items that we are so used to paying out for at the local Dealer with our 100% ICE vehicles.
My Wife thinks that as the EV's become more popular that the majority of mechanics will be out of a job !!
This is hogwash !! Now remember when carbs. were replaced by fuel injection systems and leaf springs by McPherson struts, and remember the old points, condensor, distributor cap and rotor that had to be replaced every 12,000 miles (or less) and a mechanic set timing with a timing light and that was all replaced by the electronic ignition, or even those "old" spark plugs that had to be replaced every 12K miles or so and now we have plugs which outlast the life of some vehicles (100K+ miles).... and think about today, we currently have a SHORTAGE of mechanics !!
For the electric vehicle to "infiltrate" and work their way into the mainstream of the modern ICE automobile will take decades, and by then the "new generation" of mechanics will be learning how to maintain EV's in addition to the "older" ICE vehicles. At that same time more and more "EV charging stations" will be installed in shopping malls, movie theaters, commuter parking lots, train station parking lots, etc. Wouldn't this be nice.... park your EV, then get out of your EV, put a few quarters in the charging machine, plug in the charging paddle and walk into the mall for a couple of hours ??
Imagine NO more oil/filter changes, NO antifreeze to get rid of, NO more trips to the gas station, etc., etc.


Just another crazy thought.... think of the internet and what EMAIL did to the US Postal system.... when was the last time you wrote letters to friends, probably sent email instead, and guess what, NO Postal employees are laid off just the opposite, price of postage is increasing like crazy.... and WE are paying it !!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinto Girl @ Jun 18 2007, 05:27 PM) [snapback]464351[/snapback]</div>

The cost of maintenance for an ICE vs EV is very noticable, We replaced a MAF sensor on car before the prius cost was 145.00, then a tune up 56.00 o2 sensor in exhaust 48.00 not to mention the extra 26.00 emissions test fee. oil changes 29.00 , antifreeze drain and flush 100.00 water pump 120.00 , etc...

Lets see the electric motor I have needs brushes replaced in 500k miles cost 30.00 ( many years of driving before needed)
batteries every 4 yrs 720.00 and the best part no oil leak from the motor no seals to wear out in the motor.

just my .02 cents cause I count pennies now

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priussoris @ Jun 19 2007, 02:02 PM) [snapback]464781[/snapback]</div>

Shame on you.... you forgot windshield wiper blade refills ~$6.00 pair, every year !! :lol:

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priussoris @ Jun 19 2007, 02:02 PM) [snapback]464781[/snapback]</div>

So now who will make those gigantic puddles of dripped motor oil in the parking lots of shopping malls and supermarkets ??
Don't you just love 'em on a rainy day....... slip, slide, skid

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JackDodge @ Jun 19 2007, 12:58 PM) [snapback]464748[/snapback]</div>

Why certainly.... we still will need 3,000 WATT sub-sub-woofer sound systems in the EV's
Also 22" "spinner" wheels and 30 series tires !! Wouldn't the EV look "cool" with light tubes under it so it can light up at night !! Oh yeah !! B) B)

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priussoris @ Jun 19 2007, 02:02 PM) [snapback]464781[/snapback]</div>

Another former VW owner, eh? Been there done that!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(FloridaWen @ Jun 19 2007, 12:18 PM) [snapback]464787[/snapback]</div>

I was just thinking of the stuff the ice has only , the ev still has wipers, Oh and it does have a tranny so there is a chance for gear oil to get on the ground

I had one of those oil leakers well many as a kid growing up thats all I could afford to buy, was someone elses troubles

I would like it to sound like the Jetsons...

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priussoris @ Jun 19 2007, 03:59 PM) [snapback]464843[/snapback]</div>

So did I . and many of them also. One thing that was worse than oil leaking down "low" near the oil pan (like a rear main seal) was the oil leak "above" the exhaust manifold (usually from the valve cover gasket that was cracked) that would drip on the hot exhaust manifold and stink, stink, stink........ :lol:

 

:angry: <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinto Girl @ Jun 18 2007, 07:27 PM) [snapback]464351[/snapback]</div>

You obviously never spoke w/ a Rav4- EV owner that has over 100,000 miles Sickening to say, because they are out there, anD BECAUSE i don't have one !!

Seriously, besides wheel bearings? You have a bearing in the motor, and regenerative breaks that have caliper wear. Oh, and tires, and windshield wipers. Maybe I forgot a hand full of other things. whooptiedoo. That's LESS than 1% of the wearable parts on an ICE.

Maintenance free? not in the literal sence ... or unless you're trying to get REALLY pickie-younie.
Close enough for government work!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JackDodge @ Jun 19 2007, 01:40 PM) [snapback]464805[/snapback]</div>

The reason for the EV1 demise may have been the 1200 pounds of batteries that were lead acid. They needed complete replacement in about 3 years.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hawaiiguide @ Sep 25 2007, 08:09 PM) [snapback]517738[/snapback]</div>

I'm pretty sure that GM finally broke down and put NiMH batteries in the 1999 cars.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco @ Sep 25 2007, 08:15 PM) [snapback]517741[/snapback]</div>

LOL, you got there before me Evan. I was typing and then realized I could be wrong so I went to double check and you hit submit.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JackDodge @ Jun 18 2007, 11:08 AM) [snapback]463968[/snapback]</div>

Promising for who? The problem is the mfg's seem to think they can't make their business model work with EV's. Everything goes back to the buck.

 

The EV-1 was never for sale--they coould only be leased, and several car magazines had articles on them.
A pure electric car could not totally replace internal combustion engines. Even if recharging station were built all over the place, who would go on a trip where you had to stop every 2-300 miles to recharge and have to wait a minimum of 1/2 hour? All-electric cars would just be practical for in-town commuting.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Per @ Sep 26 2007, 12:17 PM) [snapback]517926[/snapback]</div>

And what if in stead of Gas, the 'Service Stations' had several dozen "battery trays" that could slip in and out of a rack near the bottom of your car. You go in and out of the station in maybe 10 minutes. The spent tray gets recharged over the next few hours. That is, if you absolutly couldn't get home on 100 or 100 miles of driving (the Tesla report came out today and will be certified w/ a range of around 250 miles) Whoops, there I go again, trying to simplify things. Just an idea. I'm sure some nay sayer can darken it up
Yea, the Ev1 was in a few mags ... not near the exposure of Hummers ... with Regis Zooming them all over the world. I think GM bought Hummer just as they began crushing the EV's. Of COURSE GM never sold the EV1's ... which says exactly what they had in mind all the time ... even as they sued to overturn CARB rules that forced them to be built. $1.5 billion on the EV1 project? Sure, if you include the legal costs of overturning the laws that forced their creation.
The most tragic thing about the EV1 (imo) was that a permanent injunction was never sought against GM for crushing cars that were built in part w/ public research dollars. Under that theory, GM never had a legal right to crush that which they didn't totally own.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Godiva @ Jun 16 2007, 06:21 PM) [snapback]463155[/snapback]</div>

Well, I wouldn't be too sure about that. My understanding is that most of the people who worked on the EV1 program are no longer with the company. As many companies fail to appreciate, in tech when the people who designed something are gone, 90% of the learning from that design is gone. GM sold off their interest in batteries, the engineers who designed the electronics and controls have largely gone off and started their own companies. GM managed to turn a 2-3 year lead in this field into at least a 2-3 year deficit. They have certainly paid the price for their lack of foresight.

Toyota and the others are certainly not blameless, but I'd say Toyota at least has done a pretty good job capitalizing on their understanding of electric vehicle drive systems.

Rob

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(FloridaWen @ Jun 19 2007, 09:34 AM) [snapback]464606[/snapback]</div>

This one always hits a nerve with me, thought I might just get the facts out there:

The inflation-adjusted price of a first-class stamp has not changed appreciably in the last 30 years.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Un...l_Service_rates


US first-class rates are nearly the lowest in the civilized world, excluding countries with subsidized mail:
http://www.usps.com/history/plife/pl091096/rates.htm
http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a3_184.html

The international comparisons are old, but as the dollar slowly turns to wastepaper (currently 70 cents worth of Euro will buy you a dollar), our rates should look even cheaper/foreign rates should look more expensive.

The real question is how the USPS manages to survive at all, having transformed themselves from primarily a monopoly carrier of good-paying first-class mail 30 years ago to primarily a delivery service for low-paying junk mail today. Without raising the inflation-adjusted cost of first-class mail.