Two Large publicly traded Solar companies are booming

That is good news that more people are installing solar. My reply was merely intended to note that the rise in stock price looks like it could be merely a transitional spike, and that the companies mentioned have very significantly under-performed the market in the most recent two-year period. Maybe they're just slower to recover, due to the relation of solar panels to housing.

I think that in the long term sustainable energy is a good investment, but that one cannot predict which specific companies will succeed, and which will go by the wayside.

 

I have been a share holder (very small) in Energy Conversion Devices since ~1980. ECD is the inventor of Amorphous PV panels if memory serves, as well as the lithium Ion battery, that we are all so familiar with. In that time, the company has never paid a dividend, and has mostly been forced to license it's technology just to keep working capital. It has never made any money to speak of.

I did see a study of RE companies performance over the last few years, and on balance,, it sucks as a financial investment compared to others. There are other reasons to invest however than just the bottom line.

Just for example.

 

That they are, and if you look at the analyst reports growth of solar panels will still be good going forward, and prices to the customer will keep coming down.

Can you and Daniel tell me more about what stocks your buying so I can short them ENER have some patents on Nimh batteries not lithium.

Price pressure should be on that company from competing silicon from Chinese companies like JA Solar. In the thin film area First Solar looks to be a much higher quality stock. That is if you really want to invest in thin film technologies. All of these are high risk and Energy conversion devices looks to be exceedingly low reward, so much so that S&P has given it the rare sell recommendation. The good news is these are risky investments because prices for solar are expected to keep on coming down.

 

I don't think you can short mutual funds. All my investments are mutual funds. (I don't own ETFs.) And no, I won't list my funds, though I will say that I have a diversity of types and styles.

I don't play the market for short-term speculative gain. I invest for long-term stability and income.

 

First you, are correct about Nimh and ENER. I confess to sort of forgetting about ENER over the years.


I am not sure why the slam about what stock I or Daniel own so you can short them?

For the record, I own virtually no mutual funds because A: I can't control the distributions and timing of those distributions, B: Because I think managers manipulate those distributions to make a given quarter or year look better (or less bad) C: Because I think the fees are stacked against the small investor.

All that said, I think the market in general is stacked against the small investor. I happen to have a fee based adviser who I think is very good, and whose interest in taking care of our stuff. We manage the account with input from him, as well as our opinions. I don't think the average investor can possibly have the kind of insight to effectively buy and sell individual stocks, unless one is very dedicated to paying attention.

What has been critical to our strategy is a long term time horizon, avoiding panic buys and sells, using simple strategies of dollar cost averaging, stop losses, covered calls etc to protect the gains.

PS. We have, over the years done quite well, doing better than broad base indexes nearly every year, and certainly in 3-5 year windows. We came through the meltdown +5% net/net, but we also strategically sold some stuff in the Spring of '08 to protect some gains, and used that money to pay off some rental properties.

 

First there was a smiley. Second, it was because of the choices. Normally people just sell their dogs and take their losses instead of touting them on the internet. I pulled up the stock report on ENER to see if I had missed a company in my green portfolio. I don't really think they are going to solve their cost problems by moving some manufacturing to Tijuana. The chinese semiconductors mentioned by the OP should keep pricing pressures on the company. That is just a 5 minute analysis. I do not own any of these
stocks, although I do own mutual funds that invest in china and may own some of the Chinese semiconductor players.

I'll let you and Daniel argue about that one.

I try not to give financial advice. And will continue here. It was only a comment. Each of us has their own maturity when it comes to investing analyzing and understanding markets. If you believe the world is going to get greener and follow what companies will participate, you may be able to do some socially responsibility investing and make money at the same time.

 

I get it.

I am not touting Ener, it is just that I bought 10 shares in the late 70's or early 80's thinking that we were going to wake up and do the right thing regarding energy back then. You can see how that has worked out, both as an investment as well as as a society. The bottom line is that I have largely forgotten that I know them over the years, and it is only when the annual report comes that I remember!

The concept of "ethical" or "green" investing is one that is an ongoing conversation, a conversation that has no real answers and indeed lot's of pitfalls.

The reality is that unless you have enough money to VC new companies and get in before the IPO you are not really helping capitalize the company.

Use this for example. If you are against GMOs for example do you own Monsanto? The cons are clear, Monsanto engages in products and behavior that I don't like and don't wish to support. By owning shares of their stock, and using those shares you have access to the annual meeting and can voice you opinion (not that it will do much good!). You can also take the dividend and spend it on causes that fight GMOs. What is the right choice?

One can follow this logic for any company and come up with a thousand ethical answers. To think that a small investor is going to have any net effect on how a public company is run is dreaming. You are better off worrying about where you spend your money in that regard!