Featured Toyota's thoughts on EV adoption

This is saying a trip from Boston to Orlando in a Model 3 Long Range will take 24hrs. 4hrs of that time is charging. For your trip schedule, it will add 2.5 to 3 hours to those 2 1/2 days.
Go Anywhere | Tesla

 

I don’t think so

 

The Model 3 RWD range is about 75 miles shorter; about a 20% reduction from the long range. The shorter range adds 2 hours to the 1,295 mile trip.

Oh, why not?
Your quick stops already add up to 1.5 hours over that trip. The need to charge is mostly just going to increase the time of those already happening stops.

 

If you ever had a friend or loved one that lost their battle to heroin addiction, it's the same model, the same tragedy.

If you think about it, the only real challenge we face to ensure the survival of life on earth long in the long term is the corporate model/capitalism that puts short term profits above everything else.

Much like a junkie that gets more and more wretched as their ability to live continues to deteriorate at some point there is an intervention or they hit rock bottom and realize that either they give up their habit or life ends. And we got a long ways to go for that intervention to happen because of the way we glorify rich people who are creating poverty for so many.

But at some point we need to realize the near limitless capacity of what humans are capable of if they're living in a loving home and are healthy and well-fed and given access to as much education as they're capable of handling. At some point that has to be more important than short term profits. When that finally happens the flowering of humanity will transform the world! For example, look at what this little kid is capable of because he had so much love and support: https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTRs7DhAF/

 

The stops don’t always have charging stations, or they’re busy

 

How do you travel 2,800 miles in an EV that uses .438 kWh per mile, and only spend $76.82 for electricity? Isn't that around 6 cents per kWh?

I pay at least 25 cents per kWh to charge at home. During prime time it's over 50 cents per kWh. I don't see how electrify america can sell energy for 6 cents a kWh after all the costs of an AC to DC conversions, administrative costs, insurance, maintenance, etc. Without subsidies and grants, I don't think it's viable long term.

 

The charging stations I see most often don't have their own bathroom facilities. A lot of people just sit in their car, waiting. Are there any that do supply their own restrooms?

 

Well he got considerably better milage - he said the taycan was about 0.25 kwh/mile at 55 mph, he didn't document his speed but I assume he as going slightly slower than the speed limit. These L3 EA chargers that he used charge by the minute, and vary in price, but since his car charged so fast, some of them charged only about $0.07/kwh. If you put a slower charging bolt on the system it would likely pay 5x more, so slower charging vehicles are subsidizing faster charging ones. My guess like my local utility, they can buy power for about $0.03/kwh in some places, while california charges much more $1/minute which would probably supply this taycan for about $0.31/kwh. The tesla network is more reliable but also more expensive. It looks like he might have also charged for free at hotels he slept at, he was not trying to be the fastest as guiness won't keep that record because in encourages speeding. To get in the guiness book he did need to document his trip in a precise fashion which is documented on the thread below.

https://www.cleanmpg.com//community/index.php?threads/56827/

 

not that i've seen, maybe elon has built a few?

 

The infrastructure is a work in progress. It is improving.

The Superchargers I've spotted along the I95 corridor have been at rest stops or gas stations with restrooms.

Porsche under rated the Taycan greater than Toyota does the Prius. Gerdes was doing 26% better than EPA highway at 78mph.
https://www.cleanmpg.com/community/index.php?threads/56827/

 

understood, but i think the poster asked about the current time to cross the country. i could only offer north to south

 

hmmm - looks like someone needs to install solar & get a longer range plug-in. Our 8kW PV system not only ran energy for the home's cooking/temperatures/lighting ($225/month - 2007/8 valued dollers), but it ran our 2 plugins as well. The PV cost original outlay paid for itself in roughly 6 years due to us counting gasoline NOT PURCHASED.
.

 

And it was answered, but they missed the post, or it was ignored for some reason. The 2.5hrs spent charging is best case. It is also a trip most people would do over multiple days. If short travel time is important, the person isn't going to use any car for the trip.

 

I just read through that cleanmpg.com thread. They are very careful with their claims. They only included the number of minutes that the car was actually plugged in an being charged by the EA charge point. They did not include the extra time expended as part of getting off the highway and driving to the charging station, then back on the road. They did not include the time wasted when they had to move from one cabinet to the next or switching cables around in order to find one that works.

If you read that thread, start at the top, where he explains that they used the same Porsche with the high performance battery pack to optimize the EA chargers based on the needs of the Porsche. That's cool, but it's kind of cheating. It's similar to (AustinGreen suggested a few posts back) driving at 55 MPH to maximize miles per charge, despite the fact that driving so slow would add ~11 hours driving time to the 2800 mile trip.

His claim as to the cost is suspicious. I noticed that on one station the EA charger provided 65.86 kWh of energy in less than 22 minutes, at the cost of 31 cents per kWh. Then it showed a discount that brought him to zero cost. He was not charged the $7.50 session charge either. It would have presented a different cost if he included the normal costs of $7.50 per charging session and 31 cents per kWh as shown on screen. Just the session charges comes to almost twice what he lists as his total energy costs.

To those of us who are not BEV enthusiasts, all of those extra minutes add up as negatives when we look at the current state of the BEV experience. To those interested in a BEV, it provides a false view of the true costs of driving one of these beasts.

 

Sorry, but you can't assume that everyone has the same preferences. My wife and I drive every year for a week vacation in Florida (from CT). The 900 mile trip (one way) takes about 20 hours of driving/breaks and my $30k Prius comfortably handles the trip in under two days. We don't have to do any planning to ensure access to chargers (There is gasoline at almost every exit on the Interstate) and our stops last at most 15 minutes each (except for the overnight in South Carolina which doesn't provide an EV charging station).

JeffD

 

Not true. There are many people who will not fly, and trains are a disaster in many ways. The great, late author Issac Asimov would not fly. My uncle has a heart condition. His doctor told him that he can not fly. I'm not flying these days; Driving is often cheaper and just about as quick once you add on all the secondary costs like parking, renting a car, etc. I could make the trip that the Porsche made at the cost of only $160 in gas.

 

I didn't answer because you can't get the fastest results without speeding excessively, so I gave a ball park. The fastest, and we don't have the rigors of the guiness record keepers, so it may not be accurate was a rented tesla model S in 42 hours 17 minutes in 2021. They did swap the 21" wheels for the more aerodynamic 19" wheels, but no modifications. Not really anything you would want to do. The time they wasted going 3 mph in LA traffic got made up by going up to 155 mph, which is reckless enough to lose your license in many states. It looks like they took 7 hours and 12 minutes charging in 24 stops in the non stop run. Going 5 mph over the speed limit would have required a lot less time charging, but this is about as fast as you could go back then. Now the tesla and EA networks are much faster charging especially with the newer tesla model 3 long range, porsche taycan with bigger battery, and hyundai ioniq 5 with the larger battery.

 

How often do you make 5,700 mile round trips. If its a couple times a year then a bev is definitely not a car for you. I am not sure why this is a use case. For me it would take 10 days there and back and I would lose far more income than savings on airfare to take that time. You do you, but this is not a very bad case when you would take 100 hours round trip in a fast charging ev, but 88 hours in a prius prime.

 

That really differs per person and scenario. We just flew a 1200 mile trip in roughly 4 hours with a friend picking us up from the airport and mother-in-law no longer drives so we didn't have to rent a car when we got here. Made the drive several times and it's typically a 22-hour Cannonball Run from which it becomes necessary to sleep for 10 or 12 hours once I get here.
Oh, most of the time it's on frequent flyer miles too. YMMV

 

So add 30 extra minutes?

Wayne did things in a prius that got unrealistic results, as he does on every car, he was trying to set a record. That is why I put the more real world 6 hours. Canon ball run on a tesla model s (which takes longer to charge than a model 3 long range, hyundai ioniq 5 long range, etc) had 7 hours 12 minutes with lots of stretches over 100 mph. Its going to be between what wayne got and they got if you only charge when the battery is low and charge up to 80% or less.

you pay a monthly member fee of $4 and you don't have a session charge. It looks like he paid a members rate of 24 cents a minute to 99 cents a minute depending the chargers. His bill works out to about 51 cents a minute. It is very realistic. If you want you can add that $4 member fee, I think porsche includes it for no extra charge for their bevs. I have a utility that pushes solar, wind, and plug-ins. For $25 each 6 months ($50/year) I have unlimited L2 charging in the area, and it includes membership for the discounted ea rates. The the L2 are supplied with solar or wind in the municipal network.

Its a stunt, but really I put it up there because the straw man argument that you would take 4 hours to charge each time instead of 10 - 45 minutes if you bought the proper car. Wayne didn't even take 4 hours charging for the whole trip. I really have only gone on 300 mile trips, which meant one super charger stop each way. They are not for doing these cross country trips, but you can do it, and every year it becomes easier. On the upgraded superchargers I can add about 170 miles in 18 minutes on my car, on this porsche you can add them even faster. Its not like I have to plan, I tell the car where I'm going and it picks which superchargers I should use if I want.