Featured Toyota Won’t Make A Proper EV Because Dealers Say It Won’t Sell

The BEV tech is just so lame. Sure Tesla and others are doing some rudimentary (yet advancing) work with assisted driving and computer control of components and systems, but just think how lame the battery charging and propulsion tech are as they currently exist. Limited range, very elementary drive systems based on hundred year old ideas (Tesla-era tech -- how ironic), less-capacity-than-desired electrical storage systems (batteries), lousy performance in common extreme environments (desert heat/Minnesota cold), very limited charging stations with lots of gotcha's no one is talking about, etc.

Frankly, BEVs seem more akin to those robot floor cleaners than space-age, futuristic transport. Good idea, but pretty much loaded with lameosity. Most of the time you find them stuck under furniture, tipped over on the stairs or out of juice just short of the charge station. Now, compare that with the power split device that is integral to the Synergy Drive. That device is pure genius.

BEVs. Just fancy golf carts, or large RC cars.

 

i my roomba

 

From Toyota's Global website.
Toyota Global Site | EV Electric Vehicle

 

There was a time when automobiles were experimental rich man toys with no infrastructure, had limited range and could not compete economically with single horse power. So more than a century later the same is said of similar capacity EVs to ICE. For those with excess monies, limited use and no real world daily schedules to maintain...I salute you as early adapters. However, the current offerings are not fully capable of of replacing ICE...and the manufactures know it. IF...BEVs are to replace them, it's going to take more time, technology and nation wide infrastructure to achieve. Most of us here are gray hairs so maybe by the time our grandkids are our age things will have changed.

 

I think that they can do it easily with PHEVs, the target is 50 g CO2/km. You can get that with a small 6-8 kWh battery in a hybrid. Currently Toyota sells more than 500,000 hybrids annually in EU.

And I doubt those are the final numbers as the EU Commission proposed lower targets and if I remember correctly the final number was 30% by 2030, not 40%.

But that said, market may have a different opinion on BEV shares and it may be that demand for BEVs will be higher. Current Toyota stand on the LEV shares is unknown but a year ago they announced:
Toyota Aims for Sales of More Than 5.5 Million Electrified Vehicles Including 1 Million Zero-Emission Vehicles per Year by 2030 | CORPORATE | TOYOTA Global Newsroom
- 10 BEV models to be available worldwide by the early 2020s starting in China, before entering other markets
- generalizing the availability of HEV, PHEV and/or BEV options to all its models
- the number of models developed without an electrified version will be zero
- By around 2030, Toyota aims to have sales of more than 5.5 million electrified vehicles, including more than 1 million zero-emission vehicles (BEVs, FCEVs).

What we know a year later is that they are meeting the Chinese targets with other manufacturer and re branding. Do we know what happend to electric C-HR for China market?

And a more recent article, from a Toyota battery supplier, Primearth EV Energy:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-09-06/toyota-s-hybrid-fixation-clear-from-supplier-with-no-ev-battery

There is Hope

 

Gasoline prices in our local area have dropped to $2.059 per gallon, EV's won't start to make sense until batteries are able to go 4-500 miles and recharges in 20 minutes or less. SUV's seem to be the vehicle of choice for millions of drivers around the world, hybrids are challenged to be economically feasible at cheap gasoline prices, EV's more so. Me juggies, we are stuck with watching the vehicle market morph into "what sells" not whats good for the planet, its all about the purse.

LG-LS777 using PriusChat mobile app

 

.

 

The hybrid car is almost as old as the electric one.

As for power-split hybrids, Toyota is going to be the only one left making them once the Fusion finally is cancelled. Everybody else is moving to parallel hybrids for the lower cost and better performance. The F150 hybrid will be one. To get suitable performance for a truck or sports car, Toyota had to stick a 4 speed automatic on the back side of the HSD. So much for elegant simplicity.

Lower gas use is not the sole motivator foe people buying plug ins now, and they gaining market faster than hybrids did.

 

You mean like the over ½billion gallons of fuel saved since plugins began en mass? Which in turn keeps prices down? ..... so that the plugin nay-sayers can continue saying, "their cost doesn't make sense - because my gas is cheap" ?

.

 

My first auto in 1970 was a 1963 Chevy ll Nova it got 22mpg, gasoline was $.19 a gallon, tank held 20 gallons so a fill up was $3.50, that gave me a range of 405 miles. I was making $4.70 a day in the Navy so that was alot of money to spend out of a paycheck.
So 21st century logic would say that a vehicle that has a very short range that costs $30K or more is not going to sell unless you are a city commuter but you will still need a second vehicle for distance. Toyota is looking at this anomoly in a profit logic way.

My v gets 42mpg and I still get 400+ miles per tankfull, (thanks to God that I'm getting more than $141 per month now.) there is not enough infostructure to support EV production across the world to make this economical yet.

Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.

 

Fuel economy is not the only reason. The Prius is designed to minimize pollution since most all people are in the habit of breathing.

The market ignores those who do not have that habit.

 

Move to the forest

Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.

 

If a vehicle drives 3 to 4 hours 99% of the occupants/drivers need to get out to stretch & or eat - &/or take care of nature. We've taken our EV ½way across the nation & back (as have many tesla drivers have) & typically passed a couple charge stations every 140 miles, which meant we would pass a couple spaces ( after traveling around 200+miles) before we finally stopped for ~40 minutes to charge - stretch eat & take care of nature & get back on the road.
Still, those who've never tried it, may be afraid to venture out. Some people will get in the Conestoga wagon & some people will never cross the Atlantic. Neither choice is intrinsically right or wrong, but just because we make our decision, it doesn't make it great for all others. Nothing wrong though, saying what works for "us" - but when people say "their" belief - is, "the" only way to long distance travel? As though most people drive 100''s of mile trips regularly? As though non-EV users speak with experience that charge networks don't exist? That's when it gets bogus.
The illustration below is about 20% more dense with superchargers now,

& that's just Tesla, which doesn't include 14-50 plugs, SAE & chademo quick Charger plugs. If the picture Illustrated all of those variables - one couldn't tell it would was a US map.

yea - & there's no need to even expect EV infrastructure to instantly "POOF" around the world. There are still people that live in caves & jungles, so why would you need to have Chargers all around the world - when in many areas people are still being transported on animals - no gas OR electricity? Maybe wait till there's a bit of density in antarctica & the Australian Outback before that 'across-the-world' concern is created? Jeez no one's saying EV's are ready for everybody .... the OP is simply relevant because nearly 2 decades ago - Toyota was willing to take a risk as a leader in practical high tech - "almost affordable" transportation.
But Now? maybe this is a misconception - but it seems more like they're repackaging the stuff from 2 decades ago. And that's ok ... but it's disingenuous when they have to run negative ads against EV's, because that is evidence they are concerned that their customers are going elsewhere. And since there are hundreds of thousands waiting to buy the model 3? It might be correct.
.

 

do you have this post stored at the ready for any and all objections?

 

OH WERE TALKING TESLA $125000 vs $25000 for a hybrid, hum 100K difference, guess I'm in the wrong league. House went 96% solar how about you? I put my $$ where I live, not in a depriciable liability.

Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.

 

yea - it's good to be on the ready for a gracious rehash of the same ol' FUD.

#1 maybe the part got skimmed - where it said "not for everybody"? yea ... not for everybody
#2 all transportation depreciates.
#3 careful Shoppers finds long-range EV's in the $40k range (ebay is where we found our hybrid SUV Lexus, for example) .... Ie, letting others take the Lion's Share of depreciation - so the six-figure cost notion is kind of a red herring.
#4 what does your solar, or our 10-year old, 8kW AC rated system, covering all of our home's & 2 car's power

have to do with toyota feeling obligated to make excuses why they are unwilling to play techno-transportation catch up - stopping all the Conquest sales against them.

 

It pops up on my phone, then flashes until it is read.

Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.

 

I already live on 6 acres and drive a Prius, is that enough?

 

Got Solar?

Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.

 

Yes, but just a 100 watt unit for charging my 12 volt emergency CPAP battery.