Toyota Unveils Advanced Prius Tech

Discussion in 'Gen 4 Prius Main Forum' started by Jeff N, Oct 13, 2015.

  1. David Beale

    David Beale Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2006
    5,963
    1,985
    0
    Location:
    Edmonton Alberta
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius
    I suspect they have just been busy and forgot to mention the "e-four" option. Tideland, cars coming to Canada must all be "certified" for Canada. There is no "me too" for US certification. I'm going to go out on a limb and predict WE will see the system, and the US will too. There are lots of skiers who will want it at any cost and lots of cars sold in the NE US. It's a no-brainer for Canada.

    The induction motors sometimes use "slip rings" to supply current to the rotor for magnetizing, allowing them to have good torque at low RPM (the induction magnetization isn't very effective until the rotor is turning at least 10% or so of rated speed). This would require DC as well as the three phase AC to be supplied, but I suspect the main reason for using these is to reduce reliance on rare earth materials, which are pretty much controlled by China.
     
  2. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Witness Leader

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    57,102
    39,424
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Seems like they're shrinking battery size and loading them up more. Hopefully they don't go down the same rabbit hole as Honda.
     
  3. Sergiospl

    Sergiospl Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2011
    3,938
    1,351
    28
    Location:
    Florida
    Vehicle:
    2011 Prius
    Model:
    Two
  4. E46Prius

    E46Prius Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2015
    314
    219
    0
    Location:
    Costa Mesa
    Vehicle:
    2015 Prius
    Model:
    Three
    ^Very good post thank you!

    [​IMG]
     
    giora likes this.
  5. KrPtNk

    KrPtNk Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2015
    323
    283
    0
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    " To improve brake feel and control while reducing noise reduction, the all-new Prius utilizes a newly-developed active hydraulic booster for its regenerative brakes."

    This is from an official press release. I don't understand what they mean by an "active hydraulic booster."
     
  6. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2004
    45,046
    16,263
    41
    Location:
    Canada
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    I'm no engineer but my interpretation of that statement is that the car will preemptively provide power brakes via the hydraulic brakes to smooth out the transition from regen to friction brakes as opposed to now where it'll only activate when the friction brakes are applied.
     
  7. Jan Treur

    Jan Treur Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2014
    240
    168
    0
    Location:
    Heiloo, Netherlands
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    At the end of the Web page behind this link there are two interesting pdf's. For example, page 16 of the second one shows how the engine can stop at higher speeds than for the Gen 3 (110 km/h vs 60 km/h according to page 6 of the document here).

    grafiek.jpg
     
    giora and Jeff N like this.
  8. telmo744

    telmo744 HSD fanatic

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2010
    2,181
    769
    0
    Location:
    Portugal
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Gen 3 can stop the engine at about 75km/h. Gen 3 PHV can stop at higher speeds, about 90km/h, with the same hardware (P410 transaxle).
     
  9. GasperG

    GasperG Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2011
    1,168
    598
    1
    Location:
    Slovenia
    Vehicle:
    2018 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    75 kmh on EU cheating spedometer ;)
     
  10. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2009
    5,608
    3,789
    0
    Location:
    So. Texas
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    My wife's subaru does that now. It's a great idea that applies to many other situations.
     
  11. giora

    giora Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2010
    1,966
    730
    0
    Location:
    Herzliya, Israel. Car: Euro version GLI
    Vehicle:
    2013 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    N/A
    Increasing engine stop speed from 70 to 110 km/hr.
    Improving cd from 0.25 to 0.24 and slightly less frontal area.
    Good signs that highway fuel efficiency improvement may be as dramatic as city improvement.
     
  12. HGS

    HGS Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2015
    307
    122
    0
    Location:
    Florida
    Vehicle:
    2013 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    Unless I'm looking for it, I don't notice the change over from regen-braking to hydraulic braking at low speed (7 mph?). I'm sure there is a good reason for a new braking system, but I'm very happy with my Gen 3 brakes.
     
    Mendel Leisk likes this.
  13. KrPtNk

    KrPtNk Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2015
    323
    283
    0
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Thank you. I don't drive a Prius (yet) so I am unable to understand how this improvement would alter the driving experience. Also I wonder if it could increase the amount of energy captured in regen braking.
     
  14. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,734
    15,698
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    That comes from the page describing the higher charging capabilities of the new traction batteries. Today, charging limits determine when the mechanical braking augments the regen braking.

    Bob Wilson
     
    Tideland Prius likes this.
  15. Jeff N

    Jeff N The answer is 0042

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2010
    2,382
    1,304
    0
    Location:
    California, USA
    Vehicle:
    2011 Chevy Volt
    I noticed that the new MG2 has adopted the use of rectangular wire "bar windings" very similar to the style used in the first and second generation GM Volt.

    image.jpeg

    Here's an image of a Volt motor below:

    image.jpeg
     
    #55 Jeff N, Oct 16, 2015
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2015
  16. KrPtNk

    KrPtNk Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2015
    323
    283
    0
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    What do they mean by "newly developed active hydraulic booster"?
     
  17. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,734
    15,698
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    We may have to wait for the "New Car Features" to get the details. The existing brake uses a metal bellows filled with nitrogen and a high-pressure, electric pump, and complex valving. It is complex yet amazingly effective. Such parts are subject to redesign using "lessons learned."

    Bob Wilson
     
    Trollbait and KrPtNk like this.
  18. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2009
    5,850
    4,029
    0
    Location:
    Westminster, Colorado
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Prime Advanced
    This is most commonly called "form winding" as opposed to "random winding".
     
  19. giora

    giora Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2010
    1,966
    730
    0
    Location:
    Herzliya, Israel. Car: Euro version GLI
    Vehicle:
    2013 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    N/A
    Notice in here (page 3) that they have improved cabin warm up in a cold day.
    Google translate:
    Third generation Prius, while stopping the circulation of cooling water to the engine warm-up, was to specifications that can not use the heating by the heater.Accordingly, etc. When the vehicle compartment is cold in winter, it can not be warmed by the heating had become a challenge immediately. The two lines branching cooling water, even before the engine warm-up, it has become possible to use the heating immediately by circulating cooling water to the heater side.

    In two lines branching they refer to the lines from the EHR heat exchanger.
     
    #59 giora, Oct 16, 2015
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2015
  20. Jeff N

    Jeff N The answer is 0042

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2010
    2,382
    1,304
    0
    Location:
    California, USA
    Vehicle:
    2011 Chevy Volt
    Here's a good technical background write up.

    http://www.wardleonard.com/filephotos/1/Technical-Note---Random-Wound-.pdf

    Bottom line is that form windings are more common in larger motors, tend to have better "slot fill" (less wasted space), and are more rugged and less susceptible to voltage spike damage or physical wear from vibration.

    All of the motor windings on hybrids or plugins that I have noticed have been random windings (including Tesla) except for GM Volt/ELR/Malibu/Spark and now MG2 on the new Prius.