Toyota Signal Mirrors

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(nyconrad @ Dec 18 2006, 07:37 PM) [snapback]364003[/snapback]</div>

So I've read. And what does the HV system have to do with turn signals on the 12V system? I'm not saying he isn't skilled. I am however saying the response in no way answered a single question and raised some doubts about his actual skill.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(nyconrad @ Dec 18 2006, 07:37 PM) [snapback]364003[/snapback]</div>

Which is exactly what I am trying to stimulate, by asking questions.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(nyconrad @ Dec 18 2006, 07:37 PM) [snapback]364003[/snapback]</div>

In what way, shape, or form have I even remotely expressed that? And 'someone with my attitude'? You mean someone who wants actual technical answers to technical questions? Egads. Heaven forbid.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(nyconrad @ Dec 18 2006, 07:37 PM) [snapback]364003[/snapback]</div>

Yes, for a price. And spending forever trying to find the right information, which isn't exactly easy. Where as, as you said, "This site is used by many to share ideas and knowledge they have gained." So which is it then: go somewhere else, or share knowledge here? Since people have done similar mods without pre-made parts I'd assume there are people whom already have a notable deal of knowledge, perhaps even more useful than that in Toyota documentation. There are a lot of smart people here. Shouldn't we try to utilize that instead of telling people to piss off?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(nyconrad @ Dec 18 2006, 07:37 PM) [snapback]364003[/snapback]</div>

By the sounds of it, I'm not the one needing luck because everything I do is with great thought and care. Thanks all the same though. Good luck with yours as well.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Silver Phoenix @ Dec 21 2006, 01:28 PM) [snapback]365205[/snapback]</div>

I can see by your signature panel why you you are concerned with getting exact information before you attempt any mods.

You are welcome to attend any of our local meetings and your issues and questions can be discussed.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(FL Buckeye @ Dec 19 2006, 12:23 PM) [snapback]364220[/snapback]</div>

And I think I didn't get a single clear answer. Most of them severely lacked information, and those were the few that didn't read like infomercials or defensive. Kind of strong? Sure. I don't agrue that. But when I ask for technical data I expect to get something at least close to technical back.

The suggestion to just strip some insulation and solder to the wire is bad enough. Dependable, but highly prone to being sloppy or screwed up by a novice. Given the location I'd expect someone unskilled to cut completely through a wire or drop some solder before the job is done. So I'd only suggest that to someone with some skill. But the repeated suggestion to use Scotchloks in a high-vibrational device ... it's just bad advice plain and simple. Fortunately it's only on a device as unimportant as an additional turn signal so the worst case scenario when the Scotchlok loses a connection is that the car operates exactly as it did at stock. But it's still not right. I love Scotchloks. They're a great invention. But they're totally wrong for this application.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(FL Buckeye @ Dec 19 2006, 12:23 PM) [snapback]364220[/snapback]</div>

1 - I've given ideas. And the dangerous ones always included extremely obvious disclaimers and stated that I'm not a pro. So you can shove your sarcasm because it's flat out not warranted. I've always made sure my potentially dangerous suggestions are affixed with the concern they deserve.

2 - Let's look at the examples you've given, eh?
* rear defrost repair kit - Yes it'd suck up some juice, but then my understanding is that the window defrosters are tied to the rear defroster, so the headroom to support it should be there. And this came with great disclaimers.
* home solar panel systems, or 100lb 12v batteries - This was all part of one suggestion, to use the voltage conversion and regulation electronics from a home solar panel system with a home solar panel 12v battery. They obviously have thorough testing for home use, so the entire system should be safe and dependable. And only a single 100lb (or more) 12V battery would be used, just like at home. The weight of a specialized high-capacity unit like this should be less than that of combining a ton of car batteries in series. Just ask anyone who's done a PHEV conversion just how much their battery box weighed. The real questions on suitability are cost, the efficiency, the battery life, and if the available amps are suitable. Though there could also be a question about temperature range on some of the batteries.

Further, if you'd bothered to do actually unbiased research into my posts instead of just trying to attack me, you'd read posts of mine like this where I quite clearly am concerned about safety issues and give some very sound advice.

But the real crux is that none of these were advice on how to do a mod. They were suggestions and ideas to provoke thought on possibilities that could eventually lead to an actual mod. Where as this is completely different. Here are being handed out informal instructions on how to do mods by supposedly informed persons, with no safety guidance to pre-test parts, with bad suggestions to use Scotchloks, and with no warnings.

Thank goodness the suggestion to reuse the fuses was at least put in. And really, most of the advice is fairly good, especially from the viewpoint that people doing this have some skill. But as soon as I ask for information and discussion into the extent of the possible damage caused and the amount of headroom in the system, and talk about safety and reliability issues, I get back this kind of crap. Shouldn't we be trying to help people do things better and more safely? Shouldn't we fill in "insert tab A into slot B" instructions with technical data to explain exactly what you're doing and why? For all we know there might even be a better way yet that we'd find if we'd actually talk about the technical details.

So for someone complaining about me coming on kind of strong, you sure do have a way of doing your best to attack without even remotely being fair. Maybe the kettle should just stop calling the pot black so we can get down to actual concerns like an electrical connection that isn't going to fail in a year and doing the safe thing of testing for faults and being sure of secure overhead before hacking the parts into vehicles, eh? Or would you rather just unreasonably attack me some more because I dared to question a member who's been here longer when he gave back absolute refuse for an answer?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(nyconrad @ Dec 21 2006, 01:24 PM) [snapback]365238[/snapback]</div>

I accidentally took off the rear wiper housing while trying to get a better grip on the wiper to see why it isn't moving in an expected manner and found that there's a dumb plastic tab in the way that's easily removed. If I hadn't quickly grasped the mechanics of the tab I wouldn't have removed it and would have just put the cover back on unmolested. But it was easy to comprehend what was the problem and what a non-damaging solution was. That's far better than accidentally shorting out my turn signals or blowing fuses because I had no clue what I was doing and was just following Joe Blow's wiring directions to install a third-party device of questionable quality control. I don't know how many amps are on one of those LED strips, and I don't know how many the original circuit is built to take. LEDs don't consume much electricity, but for all I know it's light wiring with no headroom left and I could melt a wire if I leave my signal on too long such as if I have my hazard lights on for a few minutes if I blow a tire. I'm not going to risk the integrity of the system, but I will happily (and would like to) do the mod if the system still has enough headroom. So yes, I always require exact information and/or understanding of what systems I am affecting before I personally alter them. Not everyone else is as safe as I am however. I respect that. That choice is up to each individual. But I always take my endeavors seriously, especially on such an expensive item as a car. And I would hope I'm not the only one on this planet that does so.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(nyconrad @ Dec 21 2006, 01:24 PM) [snapback]365238[/snapback]</div>

Question for you: Coming from you, someone who has been unreasonable snarky to me, what possible incentive do you think your invitation provides and is in any way viewable as something other than an insult? I know that driving a Prius tends to lend one an air of superiority, but this is ridiculous.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Silver Phoenix @ Dec 21 2006, 02:49 PM) [snapback]365264[/snapback]</div>

Just to get this straight. It was you who entered this thread and decided that people who were responding to your questions were not qualified to answer you. It was you who stated in your initial response: "And I have your word as a certified Toyota mechanic on that?" and " I don't need help. I need answers. And I most certainly don't need BS. Just because they're a neat wiz product doesn't mean they're blessed holy relics from on-high. I just want to treat this matter scientificly with facts. And it'd be nice to give people sound advice on how best to avoid damaging their vehicles." and "I'm not saying he isn't skilled. I am however saying the response in no way answered a single question and raised some doubts about his actual skill".
This isn't "snarky" ?

As for your last point, you are right (that's what you wanted to hear all along isn't it?). I hereby recind my invitation.

 

Wow!
This thread is turning into more of a debate on what is or what isn't the correct way to answer a thread! Or whether or not the information in the thread is technically correct. IMHO you use the information on this site at your own risk. If you believe it's not what you think to be true...DON'T USE IT! Don't flame the people who put their time and effort to contribute to it.

This thread is about "Totota Signal Mirrors". Can you guys do this somewhere else please? Not everyone wants to weed through the back and forth going on just to get to the information concerning the signal mirrors.
Thanks

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Inthewind @ Dec 21 2006, 06:32 PM) [snapback]365417[/snapback]</div>

Agreed. I'm done. Besides, you outrank me.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Inthewind @ Dec 21 2006, 06:32 PM) [snapback]365417[/snapback]</div>

My apologies to the group and to the readers of this thread. Back to the signal mirrors...
When we put the covers on, 2 people were actually involved with each install. To ensure a tight fit, one flexed the cover slightly while the other made sure the tabs were in and then tightened the screws. We first put the top tab in, then flexed to make sure the bottom tab was straight, then screwed tight. This may have helped to get the seams tight on our installs.

 

Some questions is the yellow plastic visible from the inside and can more LEDs be added?

- The plastic on the Ebay version is not yellow. It is clear with yellow LEDs. It is not visible from the inside of the car. IMO it would be distracting if it was. I don't feel the need to add any more LEDs. It is quite bright when lit. The light is channeled across the lenght of the clear plastic so it gives the appearance of the entire strip being illuminated. Since it projects slightly, the edge of the lights on the side of the mirror can be seen from behind as a slight strip that is also illuminated (about 1/4" wide by 2" tall) . An important point is that a car that is alongside you can now see a turn signal. It is clearly visible from the side.

Is the e-bay housing fixed or does it retract (non-powered)?

- The Ebay version replaces the outer shell (the part that is painted the same color as the car) of the mirror. There are no mechanics involved. Since the housing of the mirror is not changed, it folds like it used to, but thats all it does.

We installed 3 sets on LIPOG owners cars, and all of them have a nice tight fit at the seam.

 

The clear plastic strip is exposed from the inside of the shell. If I remember correctly, the LEDs are molded into the clear plastic and there are "light channels" to illuminate the entire strip. Somewhere in one of these posts there might be a photo of the covers showing the inside view. I would guess that if you really wanted to add LEDs that there would be room. If you decide to get these, I would say first try them out at night as stock before making that decision.

I've seen a kit for sale that is a strip of LEDs that sticks to the outer shell of a mirror housing and another kit that is a strip of LEDs in the shape of an arrow that sticks to the mirror itself. The EBay covers are not like this. The cover and signal lights are molded together as one piece (meaning the LEDs are not glued on top of the housing)
[attachmentid=5996]

The LED's in above photo are in the bulge, the lines in the clear plastic are the light channels so the whole strip illuminates.
Hope this helps.

 

The fit and finish of the Toyota mirrors is flawless. THey are technically not even "aftermarket" as they are offered in Japan as an option. The seams and paint quality are just as good as the factory mirrors.

As far as the motorized function, I have not had time to look into that at all. I hope to once the holidays are over.

The lights are slightly visible from inside the car on these mirrors. THey stretch all the way around the housing, and you can even see the passenger side if you lean over.

 

For anyone hesitant to place an order I was pleasantly surprised at the efficiency of K.T.DREAMWORK. I placed my order through PayPal on Friday 12/29. It was sent to K.T.DREAMWORK after 17:34 on 12/39. Since it was New Years week end I didn't expect any activity untll some time late this week.

My contact was Tommy and I received an e-mail with shipping info on 1/2 11:46 MST. It gave a shipping time of 16:09 on 1/2 (hong Kong).

I received my mirror covers this afternoon at 13:45 (04:45 1/5 Hong Kong). It took less than 61 hours from when K.T.DREAMWORK shipped this package to the USPS delivered it to me. I've ordered stuff in the US that doesn't get to me this fast.

The covers are as others have described, color is a perfect match. There was no wiring harness that some of the first purchasers had trouble with until it was realized the harness is not for the Prius.

I have one question. The instructions to install the covers are very detailed as part of this topic. The instructions that come from K.T.DREAMWORK would make the installation tough. Not the cover but the wiring. K.T.DREAMWORK does state to "connect the wires to the turn light signal from the fuse box or at the front lights" why did those of you who already did the install elect to get to the wires by dismantling the dashboard to get to those terminals rather than run the wires and connect at the front turn signals? Wouldn't it have been easier to run the wires from the door to the motor compartment and to the turn signals?

Cy

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(CyJak @ Jan 4 2007, 04:11 PM) [snapback]370980[/snapback]</div>

Wow, I ordered the Sigma signal mirrors and EV on Nov 23, 2006 and have not received them yet. Credit card was charge up front. Others might take this into consideration.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mrg @ Jan 4 2007, 07:12 PM) [snapback]371028[/snapback]</div>

Keep in mind that Sigma is only one guy who runs this side business as a benefit to Prius owners (he has one himself). He does not keep very much in inventory, and orders the parts from Japan once a month. Edward is a great guy and will do whatever he can, but things can only move so fast. Remember, he has access to many neat Prius parts that we would otherwise not be able to get.

 

Also keep in mind that what Sigma is selling is very much different than what is on eBay. The cheaper signal mirrors are only the colored plastic cover on the back of the mirror housing. The Sigma parts are a complete replacement assembly that replaces everything from the door out.

If all you want to do is add the signals then the cheaper on will do. If you have a broken mirror, like I did, then that part is useless for you. If you consider that Toyota charges $250 for that assembly for ONE SIDE ONLY, and the colored back cover for another $40, and the mirror for another $65, the Sigma mirrors are a really good deal if you have a broken mirror.

Also the Sigma signal mirrors are a real Toyota part, not a cheap Chinese knock-off (although they may very well actually be made in China, who knows...), if that is important to anyone. They are part # 08411-47010-B1 from Toyota. Curiously the label was in English. Actually, I think most of the writing on the outside of the TRD suspension was in English too, even though all the instructions for both mirrors and suspension was in Japanese.