Toyota Plans Press Conference For Today To Release Findings

Toyota posted this video at their pressroom:

Toyota Vehicles : Video Library / Toyota

 

The closest related case I could find from NHTSA is their 26 Feb statement on Smith's Lexus which quote "Safety is our top priority,” said Secretary LaHood. “NHTSA will thoroughly examine the Smiths’ car as we work to get to the bottom of possible causes for sudden acceleration."

I have yet to find a single update on their investigation since.

To date, Toyota has provided not one, but two related investigation updates.

 

I'm glad Toyota is starting to fight back against this nonsense! Isn't it a little unreasonable to demand that Toyota accept all blame and fix all reported problems immediately, yet when an fraud is uncovered they should keep quiet and trust the media to expose these people?

 

Yep, all of that.

"Oh what a tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deceive"

 

Well, we were told by Toyota(San Diego) when we had a problem with our 2004 Prius stalling (in traffic) that it was "driver error" because the problem could not be re-created (as in the Sikes case). Even after the problem re-occured over three times, Toyota, brushed us off with "there is no problem with your vehicle--it is your driving!
We were treated like idiots, a complaint to the NHTSA was ignored. Fortunately, we were able to discover the cause of our stalling-indpendently-replacing the small battery with a stronger one and have had no trouble since.
I believe Mr. Sikes--he may be naive in how to operate the vehicle but it is only Toyota's not acknowledgeing problems (which not always can be recreated--as in our case) that is making the Sikes
incident questionable. This is not fraud!

 

Dude, welcome to PriusChat. Please take a moment to read all the technical analysis by the experts here, and listen to the Toyota press conference. Educate yourself by reading a few other recent posts. Mr. Sikes fabricated everything. He claimed he could not stop his Prius, yet an onboard computer revealed that the accelerator and brake were alternately pressed at least 250 times before he stopped. Mr. Sikes was intentionally and periodically pressing the accelerator to reach 90-94 mph, then pressing the brakes, then repeating this at least 125 times. That is what caused the brakes to wear out. The investigation showed that nothing was wrong with his car. Oh, and by the way, the hydraulic mechanical brakes were capable of stopping the car in every condition except being driven off of a cliff. He refused to listen to the 911 operator because he had a deceitful agenda to carry out before the cops came. Once the cops came, he proved that he was capable of stopping the car.

 

@dvlange: Your Prius didn't register DTC due to stalling?

 

I'm not very confident that over-revving MG1 would cause it to seize and stop the car, but I'm also not willing to test it out. :madgrin:

I once worked for a company where we got a letter from a guy who believed that we had infringed on a patent that he held (he was hilariously mistaken). The part of the letter that I remember:

"I don't want to sue or prevent you from building (the product), I'm just interested in a fee, no more than $100 or so for each (unit)"

 

Yes, onboard computer in Toyota's sole posession for days before federal investigators arrived revealed ... blah, blah, blah. The only clarity here is that Toyota has a documented history over years of actively seeking to dismiss and conceal claims about SUA. IF the car was treated with any due diligence by the inept NHTSA, and Toyota was given a chance to examine it separately, AND they examined it with any diligence themselves (two-and-a-half business days for the gravity of the event is nothing) then I might have an iota of confidence in their "findings". What is clear is that there is a substantial disregard for the opinions expressed by the drivers of their vehicles in relation to reported vehicle safety issues. I am more likely to believe Bozo who steps out of the blue to report this than Toyota with its clear and convincing history of obfuscation.

These one-sided "findings" reveal nothing.

 

OK sure. One big conspiracy by Toyota.

Yes, and OJ Simpson didn't murder his wife.

While Toyota is currently under an unbelievable media and government microscope right now, do you really think that Toyota would do something so stupid to risk being caught in a brand new lie by manipulating data for their own agenda? All for one measly Prius owner who wasn't hurt and supposedly doesn't want any financial compensation? If Toyota were caught doing this, the damage would be tremendous. But apparently you think that Toyota has done this.

Do you really own a 2010 Prius, or is that your own lie to fake being able to blend in with the crowd? Why would you purchase (and rely upon for safe travel) a brand new expensive Prius from a company you vehemently and loudly distrust?

 

Remember that MG1 is limited by the HSD computer to a maximum of 10,000 RPM to protect it from electrical overload. With the gear ratio in the Gen-2 Power Split Device, that 10,000 RPM limit on MG1 would be reached when the ICE is spinning at 2800 RPM (if the outer ring gear/MG2 is being held to 0 RPM by the disc brakes). The ICE can go up to almost 4500 RPMs max.

That is why the HSD computer will command the gasoline engine to power down when the front disc brakes are engaged. If for some reason the HSD computer is on the fritz and the gasoline engine is allowed to run to 4500 RPMs when MG2/outer ring gear/wheels are being braked down to very low speeds, the MG1 spin speed can go up to as high as 16,000 RPMs (!). That WILL Burn out MG1 and destroy the transaxle-- MG1 is no longer providing countertorque once it burns out, and the ICE will just freewheel, and the car will come to a stop.

Obviously the HSD computer will never allow that to happen, so our cars will brake normally with engine power-down. But if the HSD computer is malfunctioning, at least you can have the assurance that you can still slow to a stop when the PSD transaxle self-destructs due to MG1 overload.

 

One sided? Now that's a relevation!

I should've known NHTSA and Congress had all along been part of Toyota's massive cover-up.

Shame on you NHSTA! Shame on you DC!

 

a1a1a1 claimed to have experienced sudden unintended acceleration three times in his Gen III in his very first post back in January. One incident was on the freeway while the cruise control was on (could it simply be the normal throw of brake before CC would be deactivated?) and the two other times were coming to a stop sign (could it simply be momentarily loss of brake power when going over an imperfection in the road?).

Now, he's trying to unload his Gen III and wants to buy another recalled Toyota (Tacoma)

 

This posting is wholly consistent with your continuing attempts to
use any slight of hand or illogical contrivance to further your on-
going campaign to demonize Toyota.

Your dredging the unfortunate Lexus incident is merely an appeal to
emotionalism due the deaths involved. We may never know what
happened there. Even the 911 "eyewitness" accounts are second
hand reports of what the driver did by people in the back seat. In
that there was a subsequent fire, any technical investigation into
the various electrical components will be clouded by technical issues
and legal caveats... A muddled situation at best, unlikely to produce
meaningful information beyond the already known possible
contribution of non-standard floor mats.

"If the SUA is truely electronic in most cases..." Pure,
unadulterated speculation on your part. To date none of the SUA
allegations has been shown, nevermind proven, to be "truely
electronic" in nature.

So, beyond trying to confuse the issues and spread FUD, what's your
point?

 

If some idiot has problems because he or she puts an unsecured replacement floor mat on top of the old one, that's not the car company's problem. Try getting Ford or GM to "apologize" for that.

Fact is, there should be a law mandating hooks for driver side floormats. Maybe there is, because Toyota, Honda and a lot of other car companies uses hooks or brackets to secure the mat.

 

I can understand your frustration. No one likes having a dead car, especially in the middle of the road.

The problem in your case is that your car wasn't broken; you had a failing battery. In fact your car was not stalling in any conventional sense, but had a 12V bus being dragged down by a seriously bad battery.

In a normal car, you find out that you have a dead battery when you turn the key and the car goes "rrrmph rrrmph rrrmph....click click click click". That doesn't happen in a Prius. All the Prius needs is enough battery to boot the electronics, and all is good. The actual starting power comes from the big HV battery.

If your 12V battery shorts out and drags down the 12V bus, weird things happen. If your Toyota dealer service was not able to diagnose this, shame on them, although I will say that it can be tricky to catch at first. Batteries have a way of self recharging a bit, so sometimes you have to catch them in the act.

Tom

 

Nah. Nobody in Washington ever thought this might help revive the
domestic car industry. After all, that's political.

 

intermittent electronic failures involving customers with various levels of operational understanding of their device is a tech support nightmare (my job description!!)

problem is, we have a very structured process (how closely its followed by the tech varies quite a bit and for anyone who has gone thru telephone tech support Hell, you know what i mean)

but the model assumes that the customer knows NOTHING. so it starts at the very basic of troubleshooting and most reps skip at least some of these steps based on the conversation or initial observations of the problem. many customers take offense to that assuming that the tech thinks they are idiots. other techs, in an effort cover all bases, may go over or reiterate something previously discussed which may give the customer the impression the tech was not listening to them the first time it was mentioned.

so, all in all, if you are having a tech issue and unless you can completely describe the issues and symptoms, the diagnosis will have some level of frustration...

for the guy who thought Toyota was stupid in not being able to diagnosis a simple problem like a dead battery, let me say this and i am not saying that ANYONE in this situation is any less a human being (who are inherently FLAWED big time!!) than anyone else here.

dead batteries unless charged at rate twice their capacity simply dont just die. they exhibit symptoms, sometimes for weeks before they cause an issue. on the surface, it very much sounds like Toyota blew the guy off without looking at the car.

i can tell you, without good info to go on, its like looking for a needle in a haystack. the car is amazingly complex with several systems relying on each other.

how many threads have people started here for weird issues seemingly unrelated to power of any kind that was fixed by addressing the 12 volt battery?

a lot. and definitely an issue that Toyota is probably looking at for improvements on the next gen Pri. after all, its a big flat rock verses a pebble on a bed of sand.

the issue is obvious but at the same time, the battery is pretty much meant to be the way it is. its a built in fail safe, cheap, replaceable, etc. isolated from the big expensive traction battery. so there is a balance that needs to be met like making sure the customer does not do anything that would cost a lot of money (like leaving the fricking door open and killing the traction battery)

 

Remember Mr Sikes "will not drive that car" so I don't think he'll want to pay. No cash! Who wants to take that car off him / Toyota? I would not hesitate to