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Toyota’s new Prius model to get record 40 km per liter

Discussion in 'Gen 4 Prius Main Forum' started by Tideland Prius, Jan 20, 2015.

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  1. Stevevee

    Stevevee Active Member

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    Exactly. After awhile (now), people look at the entire car, and its cost.
     
    #41 Stevevee, Feb 10, 2015
  2. David Beale

    David Beale Senior Member

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    As you can see, because the Prius is already so efficient, Toyota is "up against the wall" trying to improve it. You have to ignore the "savings" and concentrate on the "better" figure. ;)

    Current oil prices dropped, not because of "shale oil", but because the Saudi's caused it to drop. Exactly why they did that is up for debate, but I'm guessing they were asked to by the US to punish the Russians, and they agreed because they also wanted to punish Iran and others, who are a different flavor of religion, and were becoming "uppity". ;)

    And after posting this I'm probably on some list.
     
    #42 David Beale, Feb 19, 2015
    mozdzen likes this.
  3. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    That is an unusual perspective. Saudi Arabia did not increase production, they refused to produce less.
    I thought the reasoning was sound: if they reduced output, the shale producers would ramp up.
     
    #43 SageBrush, Feb 19, 2015
  4. mozdzen

    mozdzen Active Member

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    If they weren't before, they are now:
    Fuel Fix » Saudi oil output rising amid fight for market share
     
    #44 mozdzen, Feb 19, 2015
  5. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

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    they were claiming 20% weight reduction in Gen4 with TNGA platform. According to EPA study that alone should account for 8% MPG gain (more so if engine downsized to match performance). There were also reports of increased thermal efficiency to 42% (from current 38%). That does not account for improvements to electrical components, battery, etc.

    Question is if Toyota can actually deliver it.
     
    #45 cyclopathic, Feb 28, 2015
    Tideland Prius and inferno like this.
  6. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

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    #46 cyclopathic, Feb 28, 2015
  7. inferno

    inferno Senior Member

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    Can't wait for the reveal. One 8% improvement and maybe another 4% improvement from the thermal efficiency = 12%. But maybe -2% for better design and less drag coefficient? Anywho, I want it to be 60 mpg and therefore a 20% increase, wouldn't that be rad?

    8% MPG gain from lighter weight
    4% MPG gain from thermal efficiency
    1% for improved drag performance
    2% for better batteries, lighter
    2% better overall from a more efficient system
    then there's 3% missing :D
     
    #47 inferno, Feb 28, 2015
  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    can they improve drag while going more mainstream in looks?
     
    #48 bisco, Feb 28, 2015
  9. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    will thy design to the test, and then disappoint on the road?
     
    #49 bisco, Feb 28, 2015
  10. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

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    38% to 42% is 11% increase
     
    #50 cyclopathic, Feb 28, 2015
  11. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    10% overall improvement would put them at 55mpg combined (from the 50 mpg combined right now). I really hope they can do it. It's the law of diminishing returns. It's getting hard and harder to eek out mpg. Of course weight is easy but there's the balance between how the car feels on the road (too light and it gets blown around on the highway or doesn't feel solid) and how many features buyers expect the Prius to have (standard or optional). Think about the options for the 2004 Prius. Most are standard. The only thing missing from a base model 2015 Prius compared to a loaded 2004 Prius Package 9 is navigation and JBL Audio (and I guess 3-door SKS vs. 1-dr SKS). The 2015 model adds backup camera, driver's knee airbag, wider tires, LED taillights, bluetooth music streaming. telescoping steering wheel, driver's height adjustable seat, TPMS, Whiplash-Injury-Lessening (WIL) seats.

    Each component doesn't weigh much but together can add noticeable weight (probably as much as half a sack of potatoes),
     
    #51 Tideland Prius, Feb 28, 2015
  12. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    pleather?
     
    #52 bisco, Feb 28, 2015
  13. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    Leather wasn't offered until 2006.
     
    #53 Tideland Prius, Feb 28, 2015
  14. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    ah, thanks.
     
    #54 bisco, Feb 28, 2015
  15. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

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    Here is why Toyota targets 40km/L:
    Mazda to offer diesel-electric hybrid from 2016 – report
     
    #55 cyclopathic, Mar 2, 2015
  16. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    currently developing...
     
    #56 bisco, Mar 2, 2015
  17. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

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    so is Gen4.

    On side note looks like Mazda is serious about small oil burner, CX-3 will be sold in Japan as diesel only. And they have designed knock reducing piston pins, available as option.

    Mazda still promises to bring diesel to US, but 2.2D used in CX-5 and Mazda 3 and 5 overseas got delayed several times due to performance issues. There is assumption that if they bring diesel to US it will be big 2.2 as a step up for 6/3/CX-5/etc, but perhaps 1.5 in Mazda2 will be certified first? Would make sense if they plan to bring diesel/electric hybrid to US.
     
    #57 cyclopathic, Mar 2, 2015
  18. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    yes, but at least toyota has 15 years of experience to work with.
     
    #58 bisco, Mar 2, 2015
  19. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

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    just to be clear: Mazda hybrid system is licensed Toyota HSD. What differentiates it that they probably won't get access to Gen4 improvements, while they enjoy benefits of ICE's better thermal efficiency.
     
    #59 cyclopathic, Mar 2, 2015
  20. Sergiospl

    Sergiospl Senior Member

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    #60 Sergiospl, Mar 2, 2015
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