Prime destined to be doa?

??? Very few pick ups in Texas? I beg to differ. A ton of pickups in AZ too.

 

really? well, you would know better than i. i haven't been to texas in over 20 years. maybe things have changed. but how to account for the above post #313?

 

Yuge? TX?
No way!

 

I'm reposting the following, since you've been so adamant in the past about the topic. This is your chance to speak up...

Ironically, the reason for being hesitant to promote was due to Prime.

Why promote EV when you are busy developing a PHEV with the hope that will stir mainstream consumer interest?

 

Priuses are popular in Phoenix too, but look at the freeways and count the pickups, and one will notice quite a high percentage. I've been back to Dallas a few times in the past 5 yrs as my son went to a school there. Also from 2000 to 2006, my boss was in Austin, so I made a few Austin trips. Surely no lack of pickup trucks there either.

 

well said. hopefully, toyota will be taking orders for 3 or 400,000 primes over the next 5 years.

one thing that i think would help, would be to make the hatch floor look more finished, instead of something sticking up from underneath. perhaps bring the the door sill up to the top of the battery.

 

http://reviews.everycarlisted.com/ECL_Graphs_PopularVehicle-1.png

 

Because a plug in hybrid is a plug in electric vehicle. Lexus's marketing included the impression that plugging in was a hassle.

 

cool map! altima, bmw, mercedes and jeep are shocking.

 

I hope you are correct, and that Toyota will not release any more anti-plugin ads, sell the Prime nation wide, teach their dealers about plugin vehicles and reach your definition for mainstream sales.

So, are you guessing they will reach 60,000 sales in the first full year of sales?

 

30,000

 

Turning on incentivization (which seems to be drying up) - maybe guessing like volt sales - only a tad bit higher ... between 1.5k-2k month?
.

 

i think the prime and volt may be competitive in sales numbers. although, with the reduced space in the prime, i'd have to sit in each to get a good feel. they both have their plusses and minuses, but i think they'll continue to be niche vehicles.

 

I think the Prime could do quite well.
But I can't make an estimate until I see the price.

People fear the unknown, and a PHEV allows people to have a built-in backup. With Toyota's history, I expect them to easily eclipse gen 1 Volt sales (2-3k/month) if Toyota supports the Prime (marketing, dealers and nationwide sales)mane IF they don't price it outrageously.

 

We'll see the building of a foundation (awareness, education, reputation) within the first 2 years, then a big ramp up for the 3rd along with announcements of what comes next. That's the precedent already set. Prime should be no different. The timing works out especially well when the market as a whole is taken into consideration. Like you said, there is fear of the unknown. That's more of a problem than ever with ordinary consumers. We're past the early adopter stage now. That chapter in history is over.

Gen-2 plug-in offerings (both PHEV & EV) are what will bridge the gap to mainstream acceptance, when plugging in is a consideration when making purchase decisions. Think about how there is rarely any mention of battery concern now. When it comes to hybrids, the belief of needing to replace the pack at some point is pretty much gone. These gen-2 vehicles will demonstrate the batteries are up to the chore.

We'll get to some tipping point with consumer confidence. That takes awhile. In the meantime, there must be a scramble to figure out how to reduce cost enough to make the design capable of high-volume profitable sales without tax-credit help. It must be able to compete with traditional vehicles directly. That is absolutely vital... and still not being taken seriously by some.

We can help with the awareness, education, and reputation. Lots of real-world data and focusing on the true competition is what it will take.

 

Really? You shouldn't be surprised at all since you were one of those folks making "an ado" about seating when it was only the Volt with 4 seats:


We already knew legroom in back was less and there wasn't seating for a fifth person. But now finding out about headroom and confirmation about the cargo area, more than ever I have to wonder who the vehicle was intended for. How will the Chevrolet Volt be better than a Toyota Prius plug-in hybrid? | Page 55 | PriusChat

and:

More legroom and a fifth seat in back will most definitely draw interest Next voltec, what do you think of the new rumors | Page 10 | PriusChat

and:

Toyota strived to retain the appeal of Prius for the plug-in model. They did not make sacrifices like GM.

You're going to have an extremely difficult time convincing people that seating space, depleted efficiency, and cost were not scarifices of Volt. Volt 2.0: Ruess "It will leap-frog... the competition" | Page 25 | PriusChat

and:

For those who didn't learn that lesson with gen-1, they'll have a lot to deal with from gen-2. The new Volt is still has compact seating for 4 Volt 2.0: Ruess "It will leap-frog... the competition" | Page 24 | PriusChat

and:

ad nauseam........

 

all this talk about the 'future' of prime is starting to sound very gm/klutz like.

 

So... you had to go 4 years back and disregard all those who argued for 4 seats in the process. What does that accomplish? Remember, 4 seats was only part of it. With that seating, there needed to be comfortable leg & head room too. Why leave out that from the discussion?

And if you think you're going to convince an ordinary consumers that Volt now has seating for 5, there isn't much of a point of replying. We need to be realistic about the competition. Tax-Credits will run out. When they do, the wrath of traditional vehicles will be a devastating blow if the plug-in market hasn't already become well established.

Remember, a key to that was being flexible. Ironically, you're accusing me of that and claiming it is bad.

 

Late fall release date - 7 months from now is late fall. I suppose we have to wait 7 months to see the pricing. Sure wish everything didn't take so long.
If Toyota and the dealerships embrace the Prime, I'm sure it will do well, but without HOV lane stickers in Ca, I think it will be in the lower 2/3rd ranking group of the Monthly Plug-In Sales Scorecard mainly because there are so many other options available.

 

That list is basically a niche list. Very few are actually available at dealers. It's a very real problem. The bar has been set too low.

If Toyota has been saving up for a nationwide rollout that shoots for a target of competitive sales, there will be decent supply delivered to actually achieve that. Half the mainstream minimum rate here would be a good starting point, especially since they will multi-market rollout all at once. Many things must fall into place quickly for that to happen.

Think about the struggle other automakers have experienced. Why is gen-2 Volt taking so long for GM to ramp up production? How come Nissan is staying so quiet about the 200-mile EV market? When will the problems with low oil & gas prices finally become an issue?