Poll: Go Big, Go Long or Go Home?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Dragonfly @ Nov 22 2006, 12:45 AM) [snapback]352937[/snapback]</div>

The Democratic party was formed as an alliance of Southern conservatives and Northern liberals. Therefore, it was viciously racist. Nowadays the racism is more subtle, but it's still there.

A lot of progressives (like your friends) consider themselves Democrats, subscribing to the "lesser of evils" theory. But they are a small enough minority within the party that even a moderate like Dean was too far to the left to get the nomination. And there are and have been some fairly progressive Democrats in office, such as Paul Wellstone and Dennis Kucinich, but they are a tiny minority. Taking the party as the sum of the votes of its legislators, it shares the shrub's world view and supports the wartime economy and the national security state.

For me it's summed up in some replies to my letters I got from Senator Dorgan (ND) (at that time in the House). When I wrote to urge him to spend more on health care and welfare, he replied that he agreed with me and that he wanted to spend more on these things, but there was simply no money for it. Yet when Congress voted to bail out the savings & loans, at about that time, and when it voted money for the first Gulf war, and for the present war, not one single senator or representative stood up to ask where they money was going to come from.

A party that will spend money the country does not have on war, while people are homeless and hungry, is not "pacifist," "environmentalist," or even "liberal."

If you, Dragonfly, ran for office from my district, based on the views you have posted here, I'd vote for you, even though I don't agree with you on everything. But you'd never get the Democratic Party nomination. They'd call you an extreme leftist. Because for them, the center is too far left.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(ShellyT @ Nov 22 2006, 10:31 AM) [snapback]352995[/snapback]</div>

So if 50,00 Americans are killed by Islamic terrorists (like they tried to do on 9/11 and in 1993) you would do NOTHING?

Funny though - I didn't realize 3,000+ little meteorites landed on those people heads on 9/11.

 

This clash of civilizations is over THEIR oil. The solution in this case is elegantly simple. Halt the need for their oil. As a civilization we have the means now to cut back tremendously, but we don't have the will, nor will we in the immediate future as long as we allow corporations to run our country and extract profits at the cost of lives.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MarinJohn @ Nov 22 2006, 12:14 PM) [snapback]353063[/snapback]</div>

Now you can answer the question...

 

Oops, meant lightning strike. My bad.

Cato Institute Report

Emphasis mine.

You asked, "Do you think we are the target of Islamic terror?"
My clearer response is that if they are, they are a non-threat to the country of the USA or its people's way of life.

If, in the weeks after 9/11, we had dropped a small nuke on OBL's mountain, pointed to the cloud, and said, " Next time it isn't in the middle of no where." I would have supported the descision.

But we did not. We did the right thing in ousting the Taliban, and then let our attention wander to Iraq. Which was a distraction from securing ourselves and neutralizing the real threats. Plus, it's leading to losing the gains we made in Afghanistan.

The 9/11 attacks were planned in a cave with the important training for it happening in our backyard. Occupying a foreign nation would not have prevented that. And while they may have wanted to kill 50,000, they only killed 3,000. And we were asleep then. How successful would they have been if we had been awake?

If I was president, and 50,00 were killed, I likely would have resorted to the nuke. For having to resort to such a measure, and for having failed the country in the first place, I would resign.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(ShellyT @ Nov 22 2006, 12:46 PM) [snapback]353081[/snapback]</div>

Please, a simple yes or no will do. Are we or are we not a target of Islamoterrorism?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dbermanmd @ Nov 22 2006, 07:49 AM) [snapback]352961[/snapback]</div>

Yes and no, let me explain. Terror in general is an irrational act of violence against their enemy whoever or whatever that may be at the time. The targets have been very broad based, the Jews, Spanish, British, and us. The next target could very well be the Swiss, or any other neutral country, and lets not forget, the first targets of Islamic terrorism were other Muslems that didn't subscribe to their narrow vision. Also, lets not forget, it's not just radacal Islam that creates terrorist actions, remember the Murrah (sp?) Federal Building.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MarinJohn @ Nov 22 2006, 11:14 AM) [snapback]353063[/snapback]</div>

I think this idea is designed to drive down the price of oil.... Which will anger our islamic enemies and bring holy jihad against owners of cars that get better than 30mpg.

Saving oil supports terrorism.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(tleonhar @ Nov 22 2006, 12:54 PM) [snapback]353087[/snapback]</div>

Please, no nuancing - yes or no. By your explaination it seems as though you are saying yes - but I will leave your opinion up to you

I know what terror is - i lived through 9/11. i know islam and its history fairly well through and beyond their attempts to conquer europe in the last millenium several times - and their movement to do so now (bet you know what my answer is). Is the USA a target or not. Simple. Only one answer allowed - No Kerryisms please - that was a joke...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daronspicher @ Nov 22 2006, 12:58 PM) [snapback]353090[/snapback]</div>

Do you live in fear of angering your enemies, known and unknown, all the time?

 

Are we a target of electron gradients, sucidual deer, or tasty legumes?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(ShellyT @ Nov 22 2006, 02:09 PM) [snapback]353125[/snapback]</div>

Cute but not intelligent. If you cannot answer the question you dont have to clog up the works either. Assuming you are answering no.

Amazing how few - like none - here think we are being targeted by Islamofascism. Sad imho

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MarinJohn @ Nov 22 2006, 12:14 PM) [snapback]353063[/snapback]</div>

Agreed...and nicely put, if you don't mind my saying so.

We have, right now, in our power, each of us, the means to change the course of world affairs. We don't have to wait for the next election or fan the fires of fear and division.

The thing is, we'll actually have to make some personal sacrifices, and not call upon others to manipulate policy or statistics (and then blame them when things don't come out quite right).

For the life of me I don't see why we as a country can't indulge in a bit of positivity, and encourage each other to make small sacrifices for larger communal gain.

As a sidenote, I was exposed to broadcast TV for the first time in about a year or so...the crass commercialism of some of the messaging was -- again -- really surprising to me. Those Cadillac "life, liberty, and the pursuit of..." spots were especially egregious.

Pursuit of...what? Selfish, materialistic desires that compromise the fabric of our society and the security of our homeland?!?

BAH!!!!!

It's this kind of marketing manipulation that, I think, is actually turning consumers into victims.

 

Yes, the US is a target of Islamoterrorism. The US is also a target of Christoterrorism (*). We need not, indeed we *must* not, abandon the Bill of Rights to defeat both of these.

(*) Examples: Oklahoma City and abortion clinic bombings.

 

I think we've succeeded in destroying Iraq. There will be no democracy there.

We have instigated a civil war, where they are practicing genocide on themselves. Neighborhoods have become pure Sunni or Shite through murder and flight.

Eastern Iraq will annex itself to Iran. The Kurds in the north may attempt to separate into their own state or join Turkey.

Those who remain will attempt to remain independent, maybe, or ally themselves with someone else, maybe Syria, maybe Lebanon.

We've opened the door for the Iraqi's to get help (and possibly be annexed by) Iran, Syria, Lebanon or "fill in the blank".

We have accomplished nothing but death. What a legacy to leave our children, along with the massive debt that may never be paid off and leaves us vulnerable to China, who holds our loans.

OH, and I didn't vote for Bush...twice.

And....told you so.