Oil hits new high

People won't care about the price of oil until it hits them at the pumps. That hasn't happened yet, but will shortly. Then you will hear the outrage begin.

 

I will expect $100 a barrel oil when the bombing of Iran begins.

 

Oil was running out in the 70's and they just found a way to get at deeper deposits. The immediate problems are actually that environmentalists have blocked building new refineries for decades. That's why you see a spike when they have to convert to summer or winter blends. There are not enough refineries to allow one to go down for a while while it switches. Also, there are a large number of special blends in California that drive the price up.

And environmentalists block drilling for our own oil while they also complain about sending money overseas. We have oil in ANWR that we are not allowed to drill. We have oil off the coast of North Carolina that we are not allowed to drill. We have oil in the Gulf of Mexico that we are not allowed to drill while the Mexicans and (I believe Cubans) are getting to right now.

These things won't solve the problem of long term oil dependence but they will ease the price at home. Also, most of the oil we import comes from Canada. If we went to Iraq for oil, why did we not just invade Canada? It would have been cheaper to transport the troops and (as far as I know), Canada does not have suicide bombers and people that will strap bombs to kids.

 

Rory, I can only shake my head in disgust at such an attitude. Oil shortages caused by environmentalists? If oil companies had invested some of their record profits in updating their refineries, capacity would not be an issue. It's our own wantonly gluttonous consumption that's the problem, not those pointing out the errors of our ways. Have you ever heard the phrase "A penny saved is a penny earned?" There's more oil in conservation than there is in a hundred ANWRs. Instead of spending ten billion dollars a day in Iraq, you could have purchased outright enough reserves to last decades. Invade Canada because it's cheaper and they're nicer? That doesn't even deserve the dignity of a response.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(roryjr @ Sep 16 2007, 06:21 PM) [snapback]513460[/snapback]</div>

It is probably far easier to brainwash soldiers into risking their lives battling a strangely foreign group rather than people that closely resemble themselves.

 

With the oil high, I wonder how Prius sales are doing lately.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hyo silver @ Sep 16 2007, 11:35 PM) [snapback]513504[/snapback]</div>

I never said environmentalists caused oil shortages. If there was a shortage, we would not be able to drive up to any pump and fill up. What I said was that the prices would be a little cheaper if we could get more of our own oil instead of importing so much. And please. <_< The invade Canada remark was sarcasm meant to show how rediculous it is to say we went to war over oil in Iraq.

Also, you missed that environmentalists have blocked refinery building since the 70's. Prices spike just from changing from winter to summer blends. What exactly does a refinery update entail? And if an oil company was allowed to build a refinery, why would they pour billions of dollars into a new one when legislators and environmentalists are trying so hard to find an alternative to oil?

Last, the "not pointing out the errors of our ways" remark must have been pointed at me. Aren't you pointing out the errors of other people's ways when you accuse them of "wantonly gluttonous consumption"?

 

RoryJr,
I think what the phrase "It's our own wantonly gluttonous consumption that's the problem, not those pointing out the errors of our ways."
Is saying the environmentalists are the messenger telling us of the problem but the problem is the excessive consumption of oil. Well that's how I read it anyway. I don't think anyone is directing it at you.

 

Here's a depressing article about how difficult it will be for us to get off oil and coal as the developing world's thirst for both is expected to grow...

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(patsparks @ 2007 09 17 07:05) [snapback]513656[/snapback]</div>

Yes, that's what I meant.

And my comments about the refineries are what I remember from posts by Jayman, who I understand works in the controls industry and has extensive experience with refineries all over the world. He said the refineries that have updated their systems are able to be up and running from a cold start in a matter of hours, rather than the days or weeks required in the typical US refinery. These delays cause interruptions in the supply of gasoline, which affect the price. (Yes, I know I'm talking gas, not crude.)

And invading Iraq had nothing to do with affecting the price or supply of oil? Operation Iraqi Liberation was about freedom, right?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hyo silver @ Sep 17 2007, 11:11 AM) [snapback]513735[/snapback]</div>

Well, according to the recent TV commercials, it's all about 9/11 and avoiding another attack on our soil. :blink:

(In 30 seconds, you can't get into little details like most of the terrorists in 9/11 came from Saudi Arabia, our big oil friend, or Al Qaeda's stronghold was really in oil-free Yemen, or bin Laden is still somewhere in/near oil-free Afghanistan, which we supposedly control with whatever troops aren't in Iraq).

Interesting hypothesis put forward by 'damn foreign' political economists: Saddam Hussein was starting to trade oil in Euro's, not U.S. Dollars like the rest of the oil industry trades in. Our currency is no longer backed in gold, it's effectively backed by petroleum, so that was a dangerous move to our economic well-being, if it had spread. So in addition to gaining economic control over the oil fields, the top priority was getting rid of this practice. Then freedom to Iraqis and end of whatever terrorism or WMDs they might have were side-benefits. Unfortunately, it put U.S. troops close to our enemies home turf, so any nutcase that didn't like the U.S. could go to Iraq and attack them directly, rather than going thru all the expense and trouble of trying to do something in the U.S. itself. So this war has eliminated attacks on our own soil, but not in the way they thought.