OEM spare tire install

Discussion in 'Gen 5 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by Hammersmith, May 31, 2023.

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  1. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Witness Leader

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    I know this is contentious, and I'm a broken record, but you guys are just empowering Toyota in the their quest for new ways to screw customers.
     
    #21 Mendel Leisk, Jul 19, 2023
  2. daisy555

    daisy555 Senior Member

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    I get what you are saying but I also have to take care of myself. I don’t have anyone else to rely on.

    I especially agree regarding subscriptions. Money is power. If Toyota car owners refused to pay for subscriptions, the subscription service would fail.
     
    #22 daisy555, Jul 19, 2023
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  3. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Witness Leader

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    Prius is not the only car for sale. ;)
     
    #23 Mendel Leisk, Jul 19, 2023
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  4. daisy555

    daisy555 Senior Member

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    Yes but I’m not looking for a car that gets mpg in mid 30’s or a Kia or an EV.
     
    #24 daisy555, Jul 19, 2023
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  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    mendel, no one can resist the borg
     
    #25 bisco, Jul 19, 2023
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  6. vvillovv

    vvillovv Senior Member

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    I was surprised to learn the gen5 Prius now uses a new (for prius) bolt pattern of 5x114.3 instead of its previously typical 5x100 bolt pattern. My 06 Civic Hybrid and many other honda models also use the 5x114.3 bolt pattern and my Civic Spare and tools looks at a glance very similar to the Prius V;s spare shown in the video linked on page 1 by @Downrange here OEM spare tire install | PriusChat
    I noticed that there was no info on the wheel lug size and if the wrench in the V's toolket fits the wheel lugs used on the Gen5 Prius.
    It would be easy enough to make sure and or transfer the wrench form the Gen5 kit to the styrofoam kit holder from the V. But it sure would be a bummer if the wrench from the V's toolkit doesn't fit the lugs on the Gen5, if the tire ever needed to be replaced by the spare.
     
    #26 vvillovv, Jul 19, 2023
  7. lohikaarme

    lohikaarme Active Member

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    this the referenced wheel and tire suitable forma spare on the awd 19’’ wheel bolt pattern?
     
    #27 lohikaarme, Jul 24, 2023
  8. Hammersmith

    Hammersmith Senior Member

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    It fits every gen5 Prius.
     
    #28 Hammersmith, Jul 24, 2023
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  9. lohikaarme

    lohikaarme Active Member

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    Well in case anyone is wondering, it appears you still cannot get the parts. I placed an order and received the following:

    “
    Hello,

    Thank you for your order. Please note, part numbers 64997-47100, 64995-47080, 64778-47090 and 51978-47010 are all currently not available through Toyota for sale. They may become available later down the road, however, at this time Toyota will not allow us to order these parts. Also, part number 51931-10040 for the wheel carrier is currently on national backorder without an ETA of release.

    We can proceed with your order for the three parts that Toyota will allow us to procure, including the backordered part and adjust your order accordingly. Please let us know how you would like to proceed or if there are any questions or concerns.”
     
    #29 lohikaarme, Jul 24, 2023
  10. Jack Lindsay

    Jack Lindsay New Member

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    I want to post a note here with a useful link but I'm too new, I can't do it till I've made 4 posts. So this is number 4. Next one (below) should work...hopefully. Oh wait, I have to wait for a moderator to approve this post.
     
    #30 Jack Lindsay, Jul 30, 2023
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  11. Jack Lindsay

    Jack Lindsay New Member

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    Check out this video on youtube for the straight dope on putting a spare in your 2023 Prius.

    I just got an LE and this pretty much clears it up. The one thing I think could be done that would be really helpful would be to just cut a tire-size circle out of the styrofoam, leaving the four sides intact to support the floor piece. If that leaves a tiny dip right over the tire it should be easy to just get a little piece of foam to make it flush. Note: There's a screw-in hole for the little thing that screws in and holds it all in place, but the actual screw-in bolt isn't in the car, you have to get it with the rest of the stuff. You can find the tires, wheels, and jack kits on ebay sometimes, but personally I'm planning on searching junkyards (by phone) till I can find one with all the parts like he's got in that video.

    You'll notice that he specifies it's for a 114.3 mm lug bolt pattern. Yet I've found tires that claim to fit the Prius V that say they're 115. It would seem that 0.7mm wouldn't be an issue with a spare tire, and there are those who say it's no issue. But others claim that it is important and that even that small variance could put undue stress on the lug bolts or even cause them to snap off. I suspect that's an exaggeration and that the tolerances for wheels would be fine with either.

    The 5 x 114.3 (the same as a 5 x 4.5) is a very common wheel size, used on Camry, Rav 4, and several species of Hyundai, Nissan, Honda, Infiniti, Ford, etc. So it shouldn't be too hard to find one with the whole jack kit that fits inside it at a junkyard. I'll update here, with pics, after I get mine sorted out.
     
    #31 Jack Lindsay, Jul 30, 2023
  12. daisy555

    daisy555 Senior Member

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    I’ve watched part of this video. He takes the foam pieces out so easily. I tried lifting one and they didn’t budge.
     
    #32 daisy555, Jul 30, 2023
  13. Hammersmith

    Hammersmith Senior Member

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    That video was posted here in either this thread or another one of the spare tire threads(I think there are 3 or 4 in total). There are a couple problems with that video, but the bolt pattern isn't one of them. The Prius v is a 5x114.3 just like the gen5. The two big problems with his plan are the overall size of the wheel+tire and the age of any Prius v spare tire.

    The overall diameter of the Prius v spare is about 2" shorter than the gen5 tire. I think it's a difference of 1.8" for the LE/SE and 2.2" for the other trims. That would put the corner with the spare tire about 1" lower than the other three corners. Now, I'm sure that wouldn't be a problem if all you're doing is driving a mile or two at 30mph or less to get to a dealership or tire shop, but I don't think I'd be comfortable driving that way for 50+ miles at 55+ mph. Feels like extra stress on the suspension and uneven pressure on the tires(especially the spare). Odds are that you'd be fine, but why chance it?

    The bigger problem in my eyes is the age of the spare tire off of any Prius v. The car was available in the US from 2011 to 2017. That means the newest original spare tire is already around 6.5-7 years old, and roughly half are 10+ years old. A spare tire isn't reliable beyond 10 years, so around half are already beyond that date and the other half have only a couple years before they hit that point.

    I'm not saying to not get a used spare wheel and tool kit if you can find one cheap, but at least put a new tire on it that will give you 10 years of reliability and the correct diameter. For the Prius v spare wheel, that would be a 135/80D17(good) or a 145/80D17(better).


    Also, your plan to leave the corners of the foam boxes in to support the corners won't work without additional modifications. The cargo floor in your LE is lower than the floor of an XLE or LTD. That means any normal spare tire is going to sit a couple/few inches proud of the foam boxes. And without the protector(the foam piece that sits on the floor and holds the spare), it will be difficult to get the tire to sit level on the floor. Since the cargo deck will be resting on the tire, that means your cargo deck will also be crooked. None of these are insurmountable problems, just know that a nice install won't be as easy as cutting a circle in your foam boxes and calling it good.

    Finally, you mentioned you got an LE but not if it was FWD or AWD. If it's FWD you don't have to worry about this next bit, but if you've got an AWD then there's a high voltage cable to the rear motor that needs to be protected.

    BTW, the bolt you mentioned to hold down the spare wheel is part number 51931-10040 and is not available yet.
     
    #33 Hammersmith, Jul 31, 2023
  14. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Witness Leader

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    More like one inch, the difference in diameter. Still significant though.

    Reference from Owner's Manuals, 5th gen Prius:

    upload_2023-7-31_8-46-0.png
    upload_2023-7-31_8-46-35.png

    And Prius v:

    upload_2023-7-31_8-47-41.png
    upload_2023-7-31_8-48-12.png


    Tire Size Comparison
     
    #34 Mendel Leisk, Jul 31, 2023
  15. Hammersmith

    Hammersmith Senior Member

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    But you didn't go one more level down in the Prius v manual to look at the tire size of the Prius v spare. It doesn't matter what the regular Prius v tire diameters are, it only matters what the diameter of the spare is.

    The 195/50R19 on an XLE/LTD has an overall diameter(height) of 26.7".
    The 195/60R17 on an LE has an overall diameter of 26.2".
    The 135/70/D17 spare on a Prius v has an overall diameter of 24.4".

    The effect on the height of the car would be exactly half the difference of the two applicable numbers, but I addressed that in my post.
     
    #35 Hammersmith, Jul 31, 2023
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2023
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  16. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Witness Leader

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    Hmm, I compared the stock tires for both, assuming the temp spare would be close in diameter to those. Apparently not the case for the Prius v. In fact there's a big difference; which is puzzling: you'd think it would upset traction control.

    Prius v stock 16" tire, and temp spare comparison (from above linked site):

    upload_2023-7-31_8-55-30.png

    I wonder if there's even a typo in the Owner's Manual, regarding the Prius v temp spare size?
     
    #36 Mendel Leisk, Jul 31, 2023
  17. Jack Lindsay

    Jack Lindsay New Member

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    Thanks for that tire size comparison visualizer. The space for a spare in the LE is just too tight for a spare. I don't think any will fit, certainly not like in the youtube video I'd suggested earlier, which it turns out was a LTD trim. It would have been nice if the guy would have mentioned that in that video and saved us LE owners the hassle.
     
    #37 Jack Lindsay, Aug 17, 2023
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  18. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Witness Leader

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    What about the Owners Manual’s “were equipped” description of a temp spare. Pretty sure the sheet metal is the the same worldwide.
     
    #38 Mendel Leisk, Aug 17, 2023
  19. Hammersmith

    Hammersmith Senior Member

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    It's because of the lower cargo floor in the LE. You can still do the spare, you just can't do it exactly the same way as in the XLE and LTD.

    In the XLE and LTD, the white floor boxes are deep enough that the wheel comes to the same height(once the foam pad is placed under the wheel to level and support it). So if you want to just hack up your foam boxes to make a space for the spare, you can do that.

    But in the LE, the floor boxes are a few inches shallower. That's why the LE has the lower floor and the larger cargo volume. But these shorter boxes are thinner than the spare tire. That means the top of the spare now sticks up above the cargo floor. If you still want to do the spare, you can, it just takes a couple extra steps. Either you buy the correct floor boxes, or you add buffers above or below the existing boxes to create an even floor(after cutting a circle into them for the spare). Also, you'll need a new cargo mat or cargo liner as the original one won't fit anymore.


    Again, for so many reasons, that video is a pile of crap. Uses the wrong wheel/tire, doesn't explain the differences between trims, doesn't explain the danger of setting the spare on top of the power cable in the AWD without protecting it first, doesn't explain that an unsecured spare is a danger in an accident, doesn't point out how the deck floor isn't strong enough to withstand an uneven surface, doesn't show clearly how just throwing a tire in there without modifying or replacing the floor boxes makes the floor an absolute mess. Absolute garbage.
     
    #39 Hammersmith, Aug 17, 2023
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  20. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Witness Leader

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    In other words, to do a factory-like spare install, it takes a boatload of parts replaced, into four figures, before even getting ‘round to the spare itself.
     
    #40 Mendel Leisk, Aug 17, 2023
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