Lexus LC500h unveiled at Geneve March 2016

It's hard to find cutaway pics of Mirai guts, but I found video of Mirai production.

You can see at first pic that worker try to connect two parts together. Right part has 3-pole HV cable and small parking motor. Obviously, it's traction unit. Left part has large hole side and 3-pole cable as well. As for me, it's high performance air compressor for fuel stack ventilating.
It's clear that between metal cases no any shafts or mechanical links. This means that absolutely no sense to have HSD inside, because HSD mix at least two different mechanical power sources. In this case, the traction motor is one.

 

Diesel locomotives, some ships, and a few early automobiles are serial hybrids without a traction battery. Hybrid vehicles don't even have to have an electric side at all. The hydraulic systems being developed are hybrids. A battery or other energy storage device can make them more efficient, though.

Within the more exact definitions physics, a fuel cell is not a power source. Power is work done over a period of time. The fuel cell is a source of energy, but it is incapable of applying a force and doing work without another device that can take its electric energy and convert it to kinetic energy in order for any work to be done.

Hybrid vehicles are defined vehicles with two or more onboard propulsion systems. In the case of serial hybrids, not all those propulsion systems have to directly apply force to drive the wheels, but they have to be a system that generates a force. Confusion has arisen because modern hybrid cars do make use of a battery, and people conflate the electric motor together with the electricity when they are two separate things.

A hybrid vehicle is not one with two energy storage systems for one propulsion system. If such were hybrids, a truck with an ICE, a gas tank, and a CNG tank would be a hybrid. In lay terms, it could be said to have a hybrid fuel system, but technically and legally, hybrid isn't used to avoid confusion, thus it is a bi-fuel vehicle instead.

And by Toyota's logic, a BEV with two separate battery packs would be a hybrid.

As stated above, serial hybrids have to have two systems that produce a force, but they both don't have to power the wheels with that force. Electric serial hybrids use the force of one of those systems to work a generator and make electricity. A fuel cell doesn't make electricity by producing a force itself. It does so through a direct chemical reaction; like a battery.

Toyota's rational for applying HSD to their FCEVs is that they synergyize the electricity from the fuel cell and battery pack. It is a marketing move, since the Prius has been so successful, and Toyota hopes some of that success will rub off onto the Mirai.

For those that don't believe Toyota would do such, can you explain why the Yaris hybrid is called the Prius c in North America.

 

The discussion with you is an endless meaningless loop for me. You are still making fun of me and you are trying to mentally exhaust me.

#32
apt49 said: ↑
It does not need to have an IQ average or above to understand that Toyota took the HSD from a Camry hybrid/Lexus ES300h replaced the ICE, e-CVT and gas fuel tank with an FC stack and hydrogen tank and voila the Mirai was born. Still Mirai functions as a Camry hybrid/Lexus ES300h.

#33
Trollbait said: ↑
Since I am below average IQ, maybe you can explain to me where the fuel cell's driveshaft is?

#38
apt49 said: ↑
Pretending stupidity is the last defence zone for those who cannot explain their motives- usually politicians use this trick when there is no other way to fool. So stop irritating me, by pretending incompetency to comprehend, because you are not such a person. In your own post number #33, you provide the answer to your own question, by quoting a part of my wording sharply below that question!


But you did cut corners to give the opposite meaning of my words!

#39
apt49 said: ↑
Pretending stupidity is the last defence zone for those who cannot explain their motives-

But, lets go further down

My question on my post #32 was "I just scratch my head why you make an exception to Mirai, when your behaviour on the atkinson/eCVT aspects reveal that you already understand that function is what matters...." You knew very well that, I DID NOT ask you your opinion why Toyota claims that Mirai is a hybrid. I was questioning you personally about your different stance on the already mentioned subjects. Then on your post #33 you implied that you form an opinion on subjects being discussed on priuschat, based on economic interests by other automakers- the royalties getting paid to Toyota by other manufacturers!!! For a minute I thought that maybe you tried the truth serum and then revealing that unlike the Mirai exception, there wasn't any mission-critical gain for you to highlight eCVT/atkinson disrepancies! But I believe that not only you are not incompetent to comprehend, but you are very very smart person. I believe you are mocking me. I suppose you want to prove to yourself or maybe someone else who probably watches this forum, how much you can stretch the limits of common sense by defrauding others, while going unnoticed and claiming that I am a paranoid!

This time, you come again on your post #39 "replying" to my question (the same question from my post #32)

but after that and on the same post you replied:

#39
apt49 said: ↑
You avoid answering the personal question I made to you...

I am becoming a paranoid.
In my post #32 I made that cursed question. In my next post #38 I wrote:
You avoid answering the personal question I made to you...

I put a full stop here. You exhausted me. This is the last time I reply to you. I hope everyone understand what happened from post #32 and afterwards and realise your intentions to deceive.

You are completely wrong. You are confusing HSD with eCVT. Mirai is a hybrid just like prius. When decelerating they both recharge the battery source. When Fc stack or ICE engine needs help then battery supplement with power. They both need refueling.

 

Look at what I underlined there. You wrote that. Please explain how anybody reading that, and not agreeing with the rest of your statement would take that as anything but you calling them stupid?

This endless loop of a conversation is because you blindly threw out an insult while parroting Toyota's marketing print, and I called you on it. Can you explain how the Miria still functions like a Camry hybrid without the ICE and PSD to blend its output with the motor/generators? Or what about a FCEV makes it a hybrid?

My stance on Atkinson and eCVT is different than HSD is different, because they are different. Atkinsonizing Otto cycle engines through valve timing is not a new concept. Miller used it in the 1950's for his engine. A supercharger was added then in order the combat the power loss resulting from the Atkinsonization. Then eCVT is just the name of a car transmission type.

Neither of those terms are trademarked by Toyota, but HSD is. I brought up the subject of royalties to help highlight that fact, because they aren't paying Toyota royalties to use Atkinson and eCVT.

Other than that, I don't care who is paying who. I don't have financial ties to any of Toyota's competitors. Nor do I have ties through family or friends to any of them. I can't say it any more plainly.

I have stated why the Mirai is not a hybrid, and how that makes its HSD label a marketing and not not a technical one. If you disagree, and feel that what I stated is just a deception, post the evidence to the contrary without insults or allegations of ulterior motives.

 

LEXUS LC 500H REDEFINES HYBRID PERFORMANCE WITH NEW MULTI STAGE HYBRID SYSTEM

 

Looks like there's first drives out now.

2018 Lexus LC500 / LC500h First Drive – Review – Car and Driver
2018 Lexus LC 500, LC 500h First Drive Review: When Concept Meets Reality - Motor Trend
First Drive: 2018 Lexus LC 500 and 500h | Automobile Magazine
2018 Lexus LC500 and LC500h review with price, horsepower and photo gallery

And, it looks like the gearbox really does stick to its 10 predefined ratios, even though that's not the most efficient thing to do (although some of the ratios are curved to simulate torque converter slip and the like, it seems), although there's some talk (including from Toyota's TNGA info releases from a couple weeks ago) that "10th" behaves like a CVT. It'll be interesting to see if that behavior is actually maintained in Eco or Normal mode - the only video I've seen of the car accelerating was in Sport+.

And, that video's right here:

Most of the video is just reiterating the stuff from the TNGA info releases, but there's a few other tidbits in there.