Just need to vent...

Was not aware. Very cool device. We have a well. Oh well!

I might get what I need just by going up a size or two. I see some that have 12v battery backups but given the amount of water and rate of collection they just don't seem useful.

 

There has been some flooding in our state declared a "disaster" but we were spared of any flooding in our immediate area. In our area, rainfall has not been overwhelming but has been raining continuously for almost a month now.

We had the season's first heat advisory out in our state last Thursday. We can usually get by without using any air conditioning in our house, but the humidity was 99%, and 85F temp was unbearable. I had to take out and put on window AC units out of the storage shed. Two of them are over 15 years old with 10 EER and are very loud. I ordered two new window ACs... 15 EER and 42db Midea 8,000 BTU U-Shaped Smart Inverter Window Air Conditioner units. Chances are by the time I get them, the heat wave will be passed, and they are going to sit in the storage shed until the next heat wave... most likely next year.

 

If they wind up going into service early, I'd love to hear about it. I've been eyeing that same unit to replace a Clinton-era machine.

 

I just looked at the link. Interesting system... But it says 2gal pumped out for every 1gal of water run. I don't think that will be fast enough for a case like @Leadfoot J. McCoalroller was experiencing.

An average 1/3 or 1/2 hp household sump pump has a 42 to 53 gallons per minute (gpm) discharge rate. If the backup system mentioned can only pump out 2 gal for every 1 gal, and because the typical residential water flow rate is between 6-12 gallons per minute, then that means the backup system can only pump out a max 12-24gpm of water at optimal conditions. That is less than half of the discharge rate of the sump pump.

In any case, the system would not work in a place like ours when the electricity is out. No electricity, no well pump, and thus no running water for us.

 

No kidding. If I hadn't been home? Would have been a big flood down there.

If we didn't have a generator, or if it hadn't started? Would have been a big flood down there.

If I do any kind of battery back-up for the pump or a 12v secondary pump? It's going to have to be 4000 GPH to exceed what this storm gave us by a sensible margin. Most of the battery powered ones I see are closer to 1200... for 45 minutes, when the battery dies.

 

Four-way stop and two cars stop at the stop signs at the same time. They're the 90° angle to each other. Which one gets the right of the way the one on the left or the one on the right?

 

Right
.

 

LOL. Did AC have an Energy Star efficiency rating back then in the Clinton era? My units are not that old, but the two SHARP units (8,000 BTU and 6,000 BTU) are definitely from the Bush Jr. era. Both had Energy Star ratings and very good efficiency of 10 EER at the time. They still work OK, but just too loud. I got interested in the U-shaped Midea for the quietness they tout and more on the ability to open the window while installed. In our area, we never need to run AC at night if we can open the window to get the fresh cool air. But we have one room that has only one window. With the AC unit installed, I have to use the AC as a fan at night to get outside cool air. Not the ideal operation.

Yeah, I will let you know how they work. I am sure I can swap the 8000 BTU unit easily. But another one I ordered is a 12000 BTU unit. This one is supposed to weigh 78lb. I am currently using another newer 8000 BTU LG unit purchased a few years ago in a large living/dining area. This unit is too small for this room. Ergo, larger 12000 BTU unit this time. But unlike the smaller 8000 BTU unit weighing just 54lb, I don't think I can install the larger 12000 BTU unit by myself. I have read some reviews on this AC online. While the unit itself got good reviews for its power and quietness, I have read that installation is a bit more complicated than most window AC. The use of the bracket seems to be essential for the unit. For the ACs we have now, I never needed to use any bracket or supporting devices for them. Just holding it in place by the window frame is sufficient.

 

I've installed a couple of 15ks. It should be a 2-person job. It really isn't that hard, to be honest... I think the shell+insert style construction makes it easy to mount really properly. You just have that one heavy lift at the end.

Just to qualify as a real vent:

When I bought the 15k LG air conditioner, UPS rolled it off the truck. It was savaged. So were the second and third ones sent as replacements. I wound up calling the shipper to ask what was up and apparently he was earning a fortune doing authorized factory refurbs on LG window ACs, and Amazon wound up eating it every time UPS smashed one. He didn't care because his business would work either way.

That was cool to learn but didn't do me a lick of good sweating in a hot room. Well, I also learned that the refurb shop was all of 3 miles off a route I drove a few times per year, and I already had a trip scheduled. So I hauled the mauled 3rd ac back, swapped on the loading dock and split. 6 seasons good service since, but what a hassle just to get it!

 

Wow, I might be buying the ACs from the same UPS guy who rolled them off the truck and ended up back in a refurbed warehouse. I have been watching the Midea AC units on Amazon for a while. I was originally planning to wait until Prime Day (Tuesday-Wednesday this week) to click on them. But last week, just as the heat wave hit our area, I spotted a few 'used' units with discounts on Amazon Warehouse. The 12K 'used' unit was $344. It has a list price of $499 NEW (currently has a $459 price tag). The 8K 'used' unit was $284. It has a $399 list price NEW (currently $349 with coupon). I don't know how badly they are dented and scratched, but as long as they work, I will take $270 off the list price over new units. If they don't work, I can always return to Amazon for free.

 

Would a submersible one fit in the sump?

Olld boss had such installed. There are other brands out there, but they are all intended as back up in event of power outage. Now maybe that extra discharge rate would have spared the pump motor in this case.

Got to pull out an out unit(18k btu IRRC) that seems to have loss its refrigerant. The process of installing the case and brackets first actually makes it easier than wrestling with a smaller unit.

 

Take care of that back. Lay down on the floor with you legs over a chair. Do it for 15 minutes several times a day until the tightening stops.

 

Yeah, it may have supplemented if the power is not out and the sump pump is still running. But as I and @Leadfoot J. McCoalroller pointed out, the system does nothing in our case when the power is out. No power, no water flow from the well. This system works without power only if the house is provided municipal water pressure.

For up to 8000 BTU units (or maybe even lighter 10K unit though I don't have any experience), no bracket was ever needed. They are light enough to carry and hoist up onto the windowsill. After bringing in the unit from the shed, which is the hardest part, and taking it out of the box, the installation takes less than 10 min, an easy one-man job. I just don't think I can do the same for the 12K BTU unit I ordered, but I will see. If I can't manage to carry it by myself. I have to ask for helping hands... which makes use of the large window A/C impractical for me.

 

There are a slew of fossil fuel powered pumps .....

 

From the q&d measurement yes, and I see a 1hp submersible rig on Amazon that (again q&d calcs) ought to maintain 3900gph through my existing ejector pipe run. Search B0062FTMV0

That's a big step up from what I have in there now.

Another consideration: my house is made of an old house that had two additions bolted on. The sump is actually in one of the additions. The original sump was deleted when the foundations were merged, and a drainpipe was put in to empty the old cellar into the new.

The thing that helped us the most yesterday was when I borrowed my daughter's toy football and stuffed it in that drainpipe. Essentially I started counterflooding a part of the basement I cared about less, to reduce the inflow to the part I cared about more. Now I'm thinking to add a reducer or a valve on that drainpipe.

@Salamander_King For our large AC unit it proved best to treat it as a permanent installation, so we built much nicer side surrounds and got a winterization kit to seal it inside and out so it stays there year round.

 

Yeah, through a wall unit or mini-split would be a much better permanent installation. I just can't allow the window AC to block the view and light through the window all year long. After all, we would only need to use AC for a few days on the hottest days of the summer. The portable AC is probably a better solution for our use case, but that is not going to solve the loudness of the unit. And most portable units I checked had very low efficiency. If the 12K BTU unit turns out to be a bear and can't be installed/uninstalled and hauled to and from the shed by myself, then I will probably return it to exchange with a lighter unit.

But, I just checked the spec sheet again. According to the sheet, the 12k unit itself weighs only 59 lb. I think I had misunderstood the shipping weight as the unit weight. The 10k unit weighs 57lb, and the 8k unit weighs 56lb. So, it is only extra 3 lbs over the smallest unit. Just checked the spec sheet for the 8000BTU LG unit currently installed in our larger room which I installed last week. It weighs comparable 58 lbs. And I had no problem hauling, hoisting, and installing it without help. So, I am now a bit more confident that I can handle the 12k unit all by myself.

 

Homes with wells could still use the systems in the link as backups for a sump pumps that fail as long as the well was still supplying water.

They work quite well, are very dependable and are actually downrated for their advertised performance.

We have a 1" water supply at 60 psi to our home - water supplied by the city which has the water supply pumps on a generator for emergency backup. So for us 40 to 50 gallons per minute isn't out of the question.

The water driven backup sump pump pumps 2 gallons for every one gallon input which will equal an output of 80 to 100 gallons per minute expelled from the sump or 100 gallons x 60 minutes = 6000 gallons an hour - certainly more than any normal human is going to bucket out of a sump in an hour.

A great advantage is it is a dual system that supplements your normal sump. You place the trigger float for the system above your regular sump float and the backup automatically triggers if the normal sump needs help or fails. Ours came with an alarm that is triggered when the backup runs so that you know it has engaged and you might want to investigate the situation to see why the backup came on. The float is really the only mechanical piece on the backup sump and the backup will run forever as long as it is called for and there it water feeding it - it will never run out of battery and doesn't care if you are home or not. In the right environment and situation, you can't beat them.

I would certainly agree that homes receiving water from a well are not the ideal candidates.

Our sump rarely runs - but that wasn't always the case. New 4" gutters and downspouts with buried pipes that carry the water out to the street in addition to a tremendous amount of blood, sweat and tears invested in grading the soil around our foundation so it has a 1 foot fall over 15 feet away from the home has made our sump pump an afterthought these days. I did the grading for the entire home myself using a wheelbarrow, shovel, hoe and rake - I really wasn't exaggerating about the blood, sweat and tears. It was my first home project after my retirement.

 

True, it is for power outages where water keeps flowing. It has extended run time compared to a battery back up, without the need for maintaining that battery.

@Leadfoot J. McCoalroller case, what we saw yesterday isn't a normal event. If he wants to be prepared for the possibility of it happening again, I'd just get another general purpose submersible pump with enough hose to run out the door. Previous owners here actually left such in the basement that I haven't tested. If it hasn't actually died, maybe the old pedestal pump can serve for that.

We need a/c for more than occasional heat waves, so left that unit in year round. I'm replacing it with a portable. Myself can be heat tolerant, so would only need it for taking the edge off on worse days.

Isn't OSHA's cut off for single person lifting 40 or 50 pounds. A hand truck, with stair climbers, is a good investment.

Exhaust in the basement?
The case here didn't lose power. Flooding was just too fast for the current sump pump.

 

We all said the same thing about another storm in June 2018. That one only gave us an inch of water in the basement, only washed away one of the roads near us. But that was enough to scare me into improving landscaping a bit to divert more runoff away from the house and reduce infiltration into the basement. Those improvements held and some can be upgraded further.

This storm was a lot worse, and didn't come with much difference in warnings. (I was already filling buckets when the actual EMS alerts came in)

Once in a thousand years on the old scale means twice more within a dog's age on the new scale.

We DID lose power.... I was able to restore it in 10 minutes by firing up a portable generator.

As far as a secondary pump goes, I have been contemplating the thought of installing a dry standpipe from the sump to the outside. That way I could hitch up a small gas powered pump at the exterior outlet. Same pump could double as fire protection here since there are no hydrants, but there is a creek.

 

Yes, if the sump pump failed on its own, but if the sump pump failed because of a power outage, then well pump is also dead. It seems to be more for the home with a municipal water supply for that reason. For some time, I have thought of installing a solar battery-operated (or backed up) deep well pump to replace the current 240v pump, just in case of a power outage. But when I checked, the cost was higher than I anticipated for the conversion. It was cheaper to install a whole-house generator hookup and buy a dual-fuel portable generator.

Sure, if the OSHA is monitoring, I am in all kinds of violation. LOL Yes, a hand truck would be a great tool to have in the shed. I just use a wheelbarrow for multiple bags of feed bags (I think 40 or 50-lb bags) and other heavy materials. But it does not work going into the house. I've eyeing on this wheelbarrow/hand truck for a while... But not sure if it works for the AC unit.
http://www.amazon.com/WORX-WG050-Aerocart-All-Purpose-Wheelbarrow/dp/B00KCIZ5SM