Hybrids on Hold: GM axes hybrid pickups until two-mode system debuts in 2008

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JimN @ Apr 30 2007, 09:12 PM) [snapback]432913[/snapback]</div>

My great uncle has an old truck on his ranch that has only one wiper on the driver side. It does have a full set of lights though. The seats are super heavy-duty vinyl or something. We take it out to the pond and fish and we never worry about getting the inside dirty because we just use a hose on the floor and seats when we get back. My cousin came to visit and my uncle was so confused when he would not take his truck into the fields for fear of getting it dirty. Then we showed my uncle the inside and all he could say was “leather in a truck why?†my great uncle is of the mind set you get a truck for work and a car for everything else.

 

I would like a small hybrid pickup truck. My ideal size would be the Chevy Colorado or the Toyota Tacoma, standard cab, long bed, 2 wheel drive. Something with a large 4cyl or a small 6cyl with cyl cutoff and an epa rating near 40mpg.

Do I need to buy a used Ford Ranger 4cyl stick instead? I am ready to buy, MAKE MY TRUCK!

Yes, I would buy a GM or product if it came out first and was at least a mild hybrid like the Civic not a micro hybrid like the silverado was.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(IAO @ Apr 30 2007, 03:28 PM) [snapback]432784[/snapback]</div>

No crap right? I remember when the only people who had larger than an F150 were considered crazy and excessive. Now the F150's are much bigger, but people 'need' even bigger super-duties to carry around their growing yachts and streched 5th wheels a few times a year. What ever happened to small boats, trailers, trucks, and cars? Even the Honda Civic is a big as the Accord used to be... Is McDonald's making everyone so fat they need everything to be bigger now to accomodate their larger rear ends?

 

GM has already developed hybrid drive systems like this used on a bus:

http://www.gillig.com/New%20GILLIG%20WEB/hybrid.htm

They just didn't have the forsight to make a car like the Prius and take a chance on it's monetary success, like Toyota. I am betting they will now. (and many others)

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Delta Flyer @ Apr 30 2007, 11:46 AM) [snapback]432673[/snapback]</div>

Well said.. I drive a 1981 vw rabbit pickup truck for my construction business. I let the lumber yard do the heavy hauling. i just need a box and a ladder/lumber rack. I forced to drive a 25 year old truck, and drive it carefully to get 30mpg (gas rig). If vw made a similar one today with a tdi diesel I would buy it in a heart beat. Same goes if Toyota would make a tiny pick up (simple) on a Prius type platform. Driver/passenger seats, hybrid, small box in the back. Where do I get in line.

Icarus

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Apr 30 2007, 08:23 PM) [snapback]432927[/snapback]</div>

Mild Hybrids (AKA Hollow hybrids) are not really hybrids. A hybrid can use either its ICE (internal combustion engine) or its electric motors for propulsion. Hollow "hybrids" cannot. They have larger-than-normal starter motor for take-off assist. Their battery is too small to do much else. It's a great idea and should be on all autos. But to call it a hybrid is just marketing BS.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(fan-atic @ May 1 2007, 09:39 AM) [snapback]433166[/snapback]</div>

By your definition, the Honda Insight is a "Hollow Hybrid". It's electric motor only assists the ICE. It can't power the car without the ICE running. The Insight gets higher gas mileage than the Prius.

 

The Insight is no longer being made.

The last Accord Hybrid will be 2008.

And emissions were more for the early mild hybrids (in the early days) than either THS or HSD.

Emissions are the same in the hollow (GM) hybrids (at least the BAS stuff). And since 2-mode is STILL NOT in Showrooms, it's anyones guess how they will do for emissions.

Seems mild hybrids, hollow hybrids, whatever, are not holding their own against HSD.

 

"The next generation GM truck hybrid will get over 20 mpg combined, should be 21. The Toyota Tundra is 16 combined (17 old EPA).
So I give a tip of the cap to GM. "

Comparing a current model to a promise is not a real comparison. How many promises has GM made that have not been fulfilled? Do you think Toyota will stand still?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(KTPhil @ May 1 2007, 11:33 AM) [snapback]433286[/snapback]</div>

In my opinion in 2008 Toyota will have a hybrid truck and a hybrid mini van. Toyota will be even more dominant then now with an entire line of hybrids. They might even have a hybrid sports car by then. GM will be # 2 with its late dual mode system on a # of vehicles and some cars like the malibu with its crummy bas system. Honda will have only ONE hybrid out, the Civic. While the Civic is a good hybrid it seems like Honda is going backwards.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hampdenwireless @ May 1 2007, 12:54 PM) [snapback]433305[/snapback]</div>

I wouldn't count on it. The 2008 models will go on sale in about 4 or 5 months. I seriously doubt that they've kept the news about a hybrid truck so quiet that the first you will hear of it is when it hits the show room floor. Same goes for the hybrid minivan, although I do believe I've read that they already have one for the Japanese market.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Delta Flyer @ Apr 30 2007, 04:36 PM) [snapback]432788[/snapback]</div>

The prairie restoration group I volunteer with will have their annual plant sale next weekend. My perennial job is directing traffic. We have a grassy area that people park on, there's a grass ramp going down a few feet from the driveway into this area, and every year at least one woman in a big SUV (sorry ladies, but that's the truth) looks at it and asks "Can I get in there?" This despite the fact that there are usually probably 2 dozen cars down there, and we've never had a problem, even with a Honda Insight.

The other eye-opener last year was a person trying to squeeze a couple bushes and trees into their full-size Hummer. Turns out an opening back window is an option, not standard, so it was a real squeeze, they had tree branches up by the driver. By comparison, a friend with a small single-cab pickup had no problem loading even more trees into his pickup.

I would say 90-95% of full-size/large SUVs on the road today are not needed, and probably half of them have never held more than 4 people or had a full load of stuff or pulled a one-ton trailer, all of which can be done in a vehicle that gets 50% better gas mileage or better. Even my contractor friend who has an extended cab Ford 250 with tonneau cover (and his wife has a big luxury Jeep) uses an old white panel van for hauling his business equipment/supplies around.

A big SUV is a status symbol, nothing more. If you want to haul things around, the serious people use other, cheaper vehicles. And almost nobody actually goes off-road in them (their original purpose).

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(nerfer @ May 1 2007, 03:51 PM) [snapback]433426[/snapback]</div>

You know, the big SUVs don't even hold up in that manner. Watch this H2 trying to climb a trail!

A big, burly SUV is, as was said before, a status symbol, nothing else. I'd like to see someone drive their 19' Chevy Suburban 4x4 into the same spot I drive my Toyota Tacoma short bed, regular cab 4x4! I dare say that my Toyota Tacoma is better suited for off-road driving than the Dodge Ram 1500 that I had.

Honestly, I think that it will be either Toyota or Ford that will be the first to produce a *real* hybrid pickup truck. GM's hybrid truck is just a big PR game.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Delta Flyer @ Apr 30 2007, 02:46 PM) [snapback]432673[/snapback]</div>

While I agree these big trucks shouldn't be used as daily drivers, I also understand that the trucks need to be powerful gas guzzlers if they're put to work. Let's keep the fuel savers to the daily drivers and the true work vehicles with enough power and capacity to get work done. I can remember the day of under powered trucks in my business and it was pain in the butt. By the way, those under powered trucks burned way more fuel because we had to push them so hard.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(fan-atic @ Apr 30 2007, 12:38 PM) [snapback]432582[/snapback]</div>

Oh, COME ON now ... you KNOW GM will make hybrids ... at least for thier guzzlin S.U.V.'s ... that way, when no one wants them (as gas continues to rise above $4 ... $5 ... $6 gallon), GM can say, "SEE? We tried, in good faith, but no one wants them". I wouldn't be surprised if they only offered their customers LEASE agreements ... after making them sign a rediculous application process.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(IAO @ Apr 30 2007, 05:28 PM) [snapback]432784[/snapback]</div>

Funny that europeans seem to do just fine without monster over sized commercial trucks (which get better mileage by the way).

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Marlin @ May 1 2007, 09:52 AM) [snapback]433172[/snapback]</div>

What do you expect? It's the size of a big roller skate ... and of course, that's GM ... making a good thing, but NO back seat ... only selling it in limited markets, then stopping production ... saying, "we tried".

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(nerfer @ May 1 2007, 03:51 PM) [snapback]433426[/snapback]</div>

Sorry, I had to pipe in on this one. This is my first post.

Firstly, I LOL'd at this comment. I actually work at a GM plant and the local college just up the road has a real plant sale every spring. One time, they put a "Plant Sale this weekend" sign at the front of the plant property. You would not BELIEVE the amount of calls that our switchboard got asking "Why is GM selling the plant?" that day!

I've been reading on here for a while because I've been thinking of getting a Prius. Truth be told, I can't afford a new one but am going to check out a first generation one that's in my price range. I think that my wife's driving habits totally suit one, probably even a total EV. She goes from driveway to school (not even a mile), then to work (about the same) and then home. All trips are city, low speed and close.

Not to hijack the thread, but GM could build a better hybrid truck. Packaging (with respect to batteries) shouldn't be as big a deal in a truck (or SUV or van) as they are in a passenger car. If these hybrid pickups had enough juice to power a house (propaganda?), then why not power the whole truck?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(toyotablackbox @ Apr 30 2007, 09:20 PM) [snapback]432970[/snapback]</div>

As a matter of fact, yes. Even the Coast Guard recently upped the weight of the "standard" passenger by 25lbs.!! This was, in part, in response to the capsize of an older fishing 'party' boat that was carrying a rated number of people...but, if you factor in that folks are heavier now then when the boat was rated, it was actually overloaded!