How will the Chevrolet Volt be better than a Toyota Prius plug-in hybrid?

We are now getting to the same point of view. The individual elements are not as important as the net effects of the system. Just as the extra weight of the batteries in the prius may make certain modes less efficient, overall they improve efficiency.

I don't really care about bragging rights, so as long as we agree on the first part I'll not try to challenge this POV.

 

The key flaw in the opinion is that usbseawolf is thinking only as a consumer, where I have become a producer as well as a consumer. Of the same item, electricity. However, even though I am a producer, at the end of the month, I am a consumer. And as a consumer, I am bound by their rules, and their method of operation. I can't tell them to throttle back a coal plant, but in some small way, if there are enough people like myself who have installed PV, we might keep them from starting their peak generators that run on diesel.

Many electric companies allow net metering, where one kWh produced is equal in value to one kWh consumed. Many who have PV also are on Time Of Use rates, where there is a higher rate in the day offset by a lower rate at night, and obviously the PV is offsetting the higher day rate, allowing even greater kWh usage at night with no economic penalty. However, there is still a cost that the user must pay, and I will say that most people who install PV are very enthusiastic about saving electricity always. I just switched to two LED night lights, saving 12.6 watts/hour. But every eight days (10 hrs/day per light), that is a kWh saved.

But as a producer, I have produced the electricity, no matter when it gets used, to recharge my Prius and reduce my usage of grid electricity and whatever carbon discharge they are producing. I calculate that by determining the total electricity I've used in a day, subtracting the amount I've sent back to the grid, and determining what percentage my PV generation is of my total. In general, I am offsetting about 35% - 40% of what I would use if I was only a consumer. And this is strictly because of my choice to install a PV system.

So, to me, the grid is actually a bank for my electricity.

 

Way to go! Kill-a-watt brothers unite

I cannot share your opinion though that the typical EV/PV owner is also energy frugal. I am used to reading of 5 - 10 kw arrays from both Volt and LEAF owners. They are not producing excess. I think it is great that they cover their consumption with clean energy generation, but I cannot help but think that the wrong message is being sent to the neighbors, of energy gluttony.

 

Can you explain that, I don't understand the energy gluttony comment?

 

I'm happy to, although I do not know what you are asking. If your question is why I call a 5 - 10 kw array gluttony (assuming it is all consumed by the owner,) then it might help if I mention that my home electric consumption will be about 150 kwh a month after my water heating is switched to NG.

250 kwh/month would cover my home and a local EV commuter. In my area, that is a 2 kw PV array with non-ideal siting.

 

My array will be close to 10kw. I live in Delaware where output isn't going to be great through the winter (particularly if they're covered in snow). Its a grid tie in system so during the time it is working well I'll be supplying excess to the grid. I can't imagine my neighbors looking at my system and muttering under their breath about my being a resource hog.

 

Link to nice Volt review:

Chevy Volt 500-mile test drive: it's just unlike any other car | DVICE


"To summarize, the Volt and the plug-in Prius cost about the same, but with the Volt, you're getting what in our opinion is a substantially better car. It's got more battery life, it's faster, it's more powerful, it's better looking, and it's much more fun to drive."

 

I think the Volt is a great car and it was a strong consideration to compliment my Leaf, but the price just put me out of the game.

now, not all of us have to worry about looking at the sticker

One Year, One Talk-Show Host, 11,000 Miles, And No Gasoline

 

100 cars in his garage?!?!?!?!? That's one BIG garage! Mine only holds two cars.

 

Leno actually has about 250+ cars but only about 20-30 fit in his garage at home. he did a tour of his garages on his show about 4-5 years ago. he stated that none of his cars are for sale and he is unable to expand the garage on his property, so he has various friends and museums storing the rest


**edit** i have been corrected. someone i know who knows someone states its "250 wheeled vehicles" which apparently includes other things like his motorcycles and such

 

Marketing. Jay is one of the "automotive expert" that voted the Volt for North American car of the year.

 

I think it is impressive he uses the Volt as his daily driver. He could literally be driving any car in the world, and he chooses to drive the Volt.

 

rumor has it he was "given" the car.

 

Volt can be great for those with a short commute. It is obvious to see that GM is using Jay's star power to market the showboaters.

 

I don't view 35-40 miles as a short commute. For me that is the most driving that I do in one shot usually unless going to visit family. I certaintly don't like sitting in a car forever which is why I chose to live close to where I work.

 

With 35 to 40 miles driving a day, I'd absolutely be driving a Leaf over a Volt. I thought the Leaf was more comfortable and nicer to drive than the Volt.

Of course I wouldn't trade my Tesla for either, so don't even bother asking. I'm just saying that I'm surprised Jay prefers the Volt.

Thirty miles gets me all the way downtown and back. Thirty-five gets me to the farthest place I regularly go in Spokane proper. My longest drive, excluding road trips and pleasure driving out in the country when the weather was nice, is to a friend's place, on rare occasions, north of Coeur d'Alene. Around 60 miles round trip.

 

I will have to agree with you that the Leaf is more comftorable than the Volt. That is one of the first things that jumped out at me when I first got in one at the dealer. My only complaint I think with the Leaf's interior (and this is getting nit picky!) is that the Ipod and auxillary connections are out in the open whereas in the Volt (and our Prius) they are inside the center console out of sight..

The main reason I did not buy the Leaf is being military I was uncertain about transporting it from place to place. We just drove both cars from Florida to Virginia with no issues. I think had I remained in Jacksonville, or had certainty I would be remaining in Virginia I would have leaned more toward the Leaf. Is one of the reasons I want a Tesla Model S with maybe the second level of range (240 miles I think?). I think all the cars are good in their own right. My average daily drive in Florida was 22.4 miles. In Virginia is looking like it will be about 18ish, but in some pretty cold temperatures. So it will be interesting to see how the Volt does in the cold. You have plenty of experience with that up in Spokane I am sure, but with the Roadster you have 0 range issues/worries. Being a previous owner of 2 Pontiac Fiero's though as my daily drivers I am unsure if I would be able to live with the Roadster even though I want one bad. Is one thing I do not miss is the occassional head bump while entering/exiting the car, lol.

 

I have yet to bump my head getting in or out, but I am not tall. It does take a bit of contortion, which I am willing to do to drive electric. (Note: I only bought the Roadster after giving up on Nissan's ever honoring my order, and giving up on the electric Porsche ever being completed.) Hey, I was willing to put up with the Zap Xebra for four years, in order to drive electric.

 

I had a nice long sit in the Volt at the SF auto show. It didn't go so well. Folks, the rear seat room is absolutely dismal in that car. I put the front seat where I liked it, not even all the way back, and the leg/footroom in behind was terrible. Even if I put the front seat in a cramped position, the room behind is still not very good....
Then, the headroom is really bad back there. Headroom is not all that great in front seat with sunroof either, but it would be about adequate at least for me.

Lady outside the car was telling a rep at the show, geez, this car costs $43k?? wow, that's high.

The car is surely more fun to drive than any Prius, but it's not very practical nor affordable. Guess I'm beating a dead horse, 'cause we've heard it all before.

Said it before, but I believe the PiP is going to clobber the Volt in not too much time.

There was nothing at the show that remotely compares with either Prius or Prius v. The are both totally unique.

The Leaf, well, that car is a little peach. I like many things about that car. I've driven it all of about 3/4 of a mile

 

Volt ranked most fuel efficient gasoline powered vehicle ever (prius ranks third):

Autos Insider | Chevy Volt named top fuel efficient gas-powered vehicle | The Detroit News