Headlight problem

This has gotten ridiculous!... bear with me while I rant..

But these are dying prematurely! An HID bulb should last 8 - 10 times longer than a Halogen... which is well over 100K miles.. even if you run them in the day "which I don't".

I have tried to impart this for a long time, but only a few are getting it... "Its the bulbs and only the bulbs!"... you don't need to spend tons of money making the dealers rich!

I think people sense my anger and frustration and so discount the credibility of what I say.

These bulbs from the factory are either of poor design or the ballast that fires them does not quite match the needed voltage they desire and so start dying prematurely needing a refire while still warm to continue the burn.

My gut tells me its the bulbs or else other bulbs would have the same fits..... so far they are holding up for 30K+ miles after changing. Only time will tell if they go bad too.. if so, the ballast is underpowered.
Regardless, the immediate fix is to replace the bulbs. If you can get the ballast replaced to.. more power to you!

Either way,... ebay bulbs seem to fix the problem "69.00 for two".
*Its really ashamed Toyota has still not given special grace for such premature failures....ridiculous!.
*Dealers only fixing one side..... ridiculous!
*Charging for labor and parts when this is an exception to normal wear.... ridiculous! as its become quite obvious this is a bad lot of bulbs or a bad match with the ballast... other bulbs seem to work just fine... even the cheap chinese bulbs?.....
*wanting to run expensive diagnostics when the problem is so widespread its obvious what the fix is....... ridiculous!
*wanting to replace parts at the owners expense that doesn't fix the problem nor ever has as it is very well documented now that a bulb change is the only fix yet they can't seem to get it!...... ridiculous!
*Not admitting that parts are fallible and Toyota making this whole thing good as repeat customers are one of the biggest draws for new car sales......ridiculous!
*Toyota should be looking for an excuse to take care of the customer and make them happy rather than look for an excuse not to......ridiculous!

This whole process is out of order!.... this whole issue is ridiculous!.. I feel like Al Pacino!!!
We've gone almost 500 posts and still going... and thats just this particular thread on this issue as there are others.......ridiculous!
*This problem has been crazy since 2006 and now even the 2008 cars are showing up with the problem and Toyota's fix is to just do away with HID in their new 2010's?........ ridiculous!
*Other manufacturers aren't having this problem with thier HID's?
HID is an awesome light source... very efficient and bright for the power used and almost impossible to beat for lighting up the whole road both in the foreground as well as the distance at the same time.... it just flat out has allot of lumens!
*I"ve seen enough LED's on the road now to know there is no comparison in performance.... the 2010 has taken a step backwards in performance in the lighting department yet the cost has risen. We now get Halogen again and the expensive LED's which "as efficient as they are", just don't light up the world like HID.. sorry, but true.

I am dissappointed Toyota has not stepped up the the plate and fixed the problem but rather ran from it.....

Its a real let-down to find the company I idolized as being so special apart from all the others is no different in thier ethics.

This is like paying for an expensive dinner and having everything perfect, except the two flies in the soup and the owner denying there is a problem but to appease us is willing to "split the bill".

Would you walk out of that restaurant wanting to come back?

For those of you who think I"m excited and over-reacting... I"ve followed this issue from the beginning and its gone on far long enough... this is now flat out ridiculous!


Thanks.. I feel better now!

 

That's ok, Alan. You are allowed to rant. After all, you were kind enough to post your experiences and solutions, to the benefit of all of us.

The halogens on my VW Beetle would only get about a year out of them before dying. If I can get a few years out of my HIDs, I'd be happy!

Best wishes,

 

I filed my NHTSA complaint Monday, June 15.

I got my Toyota case number Tuesday, June 16. The Toyota rep. said I should contact the dealer and that someone should call me today. She implied that I would probably have to pay up front but may be reimbursed under the goodwill policy.

The car is at the dealer now. I'm awaiting their analysis.

Meanwhile, I'm driving a rental Corolla. Ugh. What a step down.

 

My Toyota customer service rep said that the company was aware that bulbs installed on car manufactured during a certain period of more than a year (lucky me, I got in right on the tail end of it because mine was built in October 2007) were the ones we're all talking about.

Now, my car was still under warranty so having this done was just a matter of time and frustration on my part, but the rep did hint that had I been beyond the warranty period, Toyota would have made it right anyway.
Couldn't hurt to ask...
Good luck

 

Just got the call from the dealer. The guy said it was working fine. I said I didn't care. I didn't want to pick it up and have it go out again and have to bring it back. I was persistent in wanting it fixed. At that point, he said he had already talked to the service manager and the manager had agreed to cover the cost of the bulbs (he said about $200 each) and they would charge me the labor ($150). I said go ahead and do it. I still intend to fight Toyota for the $150.

 

I keep seeing these reports of negotiation among dealers.
It only makes me think Toyota could possibly be paying the whole tab, but the dealers may try to get paid again by the customer as much as possible?

Otherwise, do we really think the dealer is "eating" the cost of the bulbs for 150.00 of labor?... the math doesn't add up.

I'm sure Toyota knows the scoop but cannot reveal whats up to us because the dealers have the right to demand whatever price the market will bear for their products once purchased from Toyota.

And I also "doubt" Toyota pays for the parts and not the labor too!
They are too black and white, it will be none or all.

Sorry I'm so skeptical, or am I?

 

Nothing wrong with being skeptical!

I figure I'm almost where I need to be, based on the experience of others. Since I already have a case number, I don't expect to have a problem being reimbursed. Of course, I'm an eternal optimist (not that there's anything wrong with that).

 

My optimism took a hit.

I spoke with my Toyota caseworker (Nader Nolastname) and told him of the offer (free bulbs; $150 labor). He said that it sounded like the kind of offer that would come from Regional and was the best I would get. I said that I understood that others had gotten full reimubursement at similar mileage but beyond 36 months. (My 36 months were up 5/13. I first noticed the problem about 5/30.)

He put me on hold to call the dealer. When he came back, he said he was not able to speak with anyone at the dealer. I said I would pay the $150 but I intended to pursue this further to seek full reimbursement.

I picked up the car last night. The new headlights are nice and bright. I will be curious to see how long they last.

I was disappointed to discover that the shop gouged a significant scratch into the bumper cover just below the right headlight. There were some smaller gouges just below the seal on both headlights. It makes me wonder whether they actually removed the bumper cover (as they claimed they had to do). There was also a small chip on the edge of the hood, right next to the left headlight.

It was raining and getting dark, so I couldn't do a real good inspection. I went back inside and told them what I had seen. They said I would have to call today and speak with either my service writer or some other guy and of course they would take care of it. I have not called yet.

The damage is not significant, and I could certainly live with it. However, I don't want them to get away with it.

I still intend to press Toyota about complete reimbursement. I don't know what I'll do about the gouges. I'll see how the dealer handles it before I make my next move.

I have had all my servicing done at this dealer (Miller Toyota, Manassas, VA) and have been very happy with them. This is my first bad experience with them.

 

A sidenote, for around 6.00bucks or so you can get a bottle of paint from the dealer "has a little brush inside and pen" that matches your paint exactly. Without that, by car would have tons of little dings and chips visible from rocks etc.

Unless you get about 1 foot away and have good eyes, you can't tell at all unless your really know what your looking for.

Of course.. do that "after" you finish your negotiations!

 

Well, here I am, adding to this horrible 50 page string of nonsence regarding headlights.
Our car is an 06. We replaced one headlight in 2007, under warranty. The other went out in 2008, not under warranty,but replaced free of charge as a 'courtesy' now we're in 2009, and both headlights went out on me last week while I was driving home in the dark. YIKES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and then GGGGGGGGGGERRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!
We took it to the dealer on saturday, where we have had every maintenance check done from the day we purchased the vehicle. They gave us an estimate of "a little over 700$, if it's just the bulbs"....but asked me to bring it back in this week to do a full look-see, to make sure it isn't something electrical. Of course I figure this is just their way of saying it's something else, and charging us, because it's not the headlight problem. I HAVE HAD NO OTHER ISSUES WITH THIS VEHICLE, EVER.

We came home and called the Toyota customer care, they assigned us a case number, and said they would call the service center this week, before making a determination. They were nice enough, but offered no concrete promises. We explained that we had a full maintenance history, that each headlight had been replaced previously, and if there was a competent "fix" why didn't they do it when the lights were a problem the first time. We also let them know we were aware of the NHTSA filings for this problem, and did not expect to have to pay annually for a repair that doesn't resolve the problem. Sigh....we'll see what kind of answer we get on Wednesday.

 

Exactly... if they "fixed" it last time, it should still be fixed.. especially both of them!

 

This is a quite long thread so i did not search through every response so am not sure if what I am going to report has been mentioned before - sorry if it has.

I got stopped by the police one rainy night and he gave me a warning for one headlight that was out and said I needed to get it fixed within a week. I took the car to Toyota the next day and they reported that both were working and they could not recreate the issue. The next day it was drizzling and another party we were following reported that the light was out. I started monitoring this and turns out that every time it rains or drizzles the same light goes out, and when the day dries out, the light comes back on. I am not sure if every problem that has been reported is related to the wet conditions, but it definitely is for my 2007 Prius.

In closing, we have yet to discuss this with our Toyota dealer so I do not have his input, but hopefully my wife will find some time to take it in over the next few weeks.

 

When you see it go out, take a picture with your telephone camera to show them.

To my knowledge, I don't recall an association with moisture being a problem.

My first impression is to say it was coincidence?... but who knows, you could have an unrelated problem not found on this thread.

But if your problem is really the same as all the other post, a new bulb will fix the problem.

Its possible you aren't noticing it unless its raining as rain or fog will give you a good visual feedback that its not working.... otherwise, its hard to tell sometimes when its clear out as even one light gives ample light to drive by and so the other being out can be easily missed.

Every time you take a slow speed turn or come up on someones rear at a redlight, try to take note if one is out or not by looking at the trees, telephone poles or reflection against the nearby car in front of you.

 

Ok, I have the classic problem too. But I also have observed something else that needs to be followed up with. (Most of my problems are with only one light, both have only gone out a confirmed one time.)

While driving, the problem light will not stay lit for more than 5-10 minutes, usually not more than 1 minute. However, while sitting still in my drive, the light will stay lit for over an hour although it will flicker every few minutes.

Has anyone else had that observation?

Also, has anyone had this repair covered under the normal warranty with the car at 75K miles, 37 months? The problem was first noticed at about 60K, 30 months.

 

Not sure there is significance with it staying lit longer in the driveway, the material inside the bulb is subject to G forces and is somewhat fragile, especially if its not hot enough to stay in a plasma state.

After you refire the bulb by turning it off and immediately back on, does it stay lit much longer then? If so, seems its the same issue everyone else is having.

These bulbs either get "corruption" on the inside or the electric charge is limited due to internal resistance from oxidation or poor quality materials inside.

Its easy to blame the ballast, and although there may indeed be a mismatch, its hard to blame the ballast when replacing the bulb seems to almost always fix the problem.

I just took a chance and rather than play games with the dealers, I bought the bulbs off of ebay and it worked. Seems many others have had the same report.

Worst that could happen is it didn't work and you were out 69.00 both two bulbs you could keep as backups after the dealer figured it out.

but so far, I'm not seeing the dealers figuring anything out.... its only when they replace the bulb does the issue go away.

They often do crazy overkill and replace other things too and ramp up the bill, but until they replace the bulb, the problem never gets fixed.

Is the OEM bulb better or inferior than the Chinese bulbs from ebay?... thats a very good question!... I almost think the Chinese ones are a safer cheaper bet and have a better track record!

 

I have the headlight problem too, and even though I've replaced with with bulbs I purchased on ebay, it's happening again. Also, the headlight that keeps going out has moisture inside the casing; I don't know how water got in there, but it looks like the water was condensed within the headlight casing? In any case, it may have something to do with water...

 

This may all sound silly, but it must be said...
you "must" have a crack somewhere.
the hole in the back that has to be accessed to replace the bulb has a "very" tight rubber seal to prevent air exchange.

All you need is a tiny crack or someway for air to get in for condensation to have its effects.
If you changed the bulb and didn't "retighten" the seal all the way, this could be your problem. There is about a 1/2 worth of turn to tighten and untighten... there should be a solid "stop" when you get it tight.

That cannot happen when sealed properly "at least to my knowledge".

Inspect closely and see if you have a tiny pinhole from a rock or similar too.

There is not a vacuum inside, otherwise we all would have that problem once we changed a bulb, and that's not the case.

The bulbs themselves can handle moisture in the area as long as it doesn't touch.. however, whatever is bringing in the moisture, also brings in impurities. If anything gets on the glass, it becomes very very hot when light doesn't transmit perfectly through it and prematurely takes out the bulb too similar to how fingerprints on the bulb would.

 

$1297.00 and a 12 month warranty on replacement parts. No guarantee that I wont need lights/ or lights and ballast/ again next year, and every year after.

Has anyone tried calling a news station for help????????

 

It needs to be national news and if that doesn't work, go local and see who else picks it up.

 

So, do I win a free set of HID bulbs for being the 500th post?? I had to get my passenger side bulb changed today and paid for it, as it was not "covered by the extended warranty." (2006 Prius/Platinum Warranty) I'll give the Toyota Customer Service Center a call tomorrow to see about getting reimbursed. This was the fifth trip in to my dealer for headlight issues, but the first time I've been charged.

I found quite a price difference compared to others who have posted. I only paid $150 for the bulb and $100 for the labor. Maybe they bought it on eBay.