Ford C Max, Prius killer?

Sounds like Ford has only started getting these into journalists hands.

 

Good news! Our local Ford Dealer just got a C-Max Hybrid in. Going to test drive it soon.


New 2013 Ford C-MAX Hybrid SE (Black Car) Detroit | Toledo


Not sure where these are being produced, but since I am close to Detroit, it may be why I am seeing one already.

 

I test drove a Ford C Max Hybrid Friday night. The memory has started to fade a bit, but here is a review.

Interior: The SE model I test drove had the lighter interior. I much prefer the dark interior from the pictures. The dash is relatively handsome, especially the nice looking, useful gauges behind the steering wheel. I like that, like a Prius C, there are ratings for acceleration, cruising, and braking. Especially on the left side of the spedometer, the view is quite customizable, and you can get basically the same info from the Prius C's eco coach score if you configure the Myview screen that way. I find the efficiency leaves to be silly. I want more specific information about my efficiency, not growing leaves.

Ford My Touch always starts talking to you and saying all this annoying stuff, 911 assist is off, blah blah blah. I don't really want my car to talk to me unless I talk to it first.

The roof line is extremely high, much higher than any Prius, both in the front and in the back.

The front seats are relatively comfortable, more so than the liftback, but less so than the C. They may be comparable to the V. I felt the cushioning was adequate, but there was something slightly bothersome about the higher side ridges of the seat and how they sort of rubbed against the outside of my thighs. Not a bit deal, but I was trying to pay attention to comfort. The back seats have decent legroom and tremendous headroom, but they are extremely hard to sit on. They are totally different than the front seats. I'd feel bad inviting friends to sit in those seats for any more than a few minutes. Total fail there.

Exterior: The car is relatively attractive. I like the front grill quite a bit. The sides and the rear are OK. To me, aesthetically, the peak in the roof line is a little too high. What I think happened is that they wanted to have more overall passenger volume than the Prius V, and using the Focus platform, they were only able to do it using a super high roof.

Ride/drive: OK, there are some things here that are quite superior to any Prius. First off, the acceleration is smooth and much more easy than in any of the Prii. The horsepower of 188 clearly makes a difference. I found the breaks a bit touchy, but not really more than I experienced when I rented the liftback. The other thing that was very notable about the car was that it was extremely quiet, even at 75mph. This may be partially due to electronics. The C Max has noise canceling technology, with several microphones built into the roof of the car. For those who have been waiting for a more powerful hybrid hatch, this is the one.

MPG: Here's my real concern. This car had somehow already been driven 800 miles already and had a combined mileage of 28.0 mpg when I started it. By the time it was done with my test drive, the mpg was 28.4. I am sure the car will at least settle in the mid to high 30s, but based on a series of reviews I read, many indicated they were not matching the expected 47 mpg. As someone driving a Toyota Matrix now, getting 27 mpg, it makes sense to upgrade to a car that gets 47 mpg, but 37? Maybe not.

 

thanks lib, very well done. too bad you couldn't get a current average mpg. can't wait to start seeing more reviews.

 

Great work. Thank you for taking the time to look closely at this car and to report your reaction to it. I've been looking for a replacement for our minivan, and the C-Max was a car I'd been looking at along with the Prius v(and a couple of other cars).

I have had a similar reaction, but the real question for me is whether I can get the efficiency information in a more valuable format. Perhaps the leaves are simply an "extra" I would choose to ignore or to accept, but I would want the other information to be available at the same time.

Hopefully, there is a way to turn it off.

Here is the part I was afraid of. I found the rear seats in the Prius v to be surprisingly comfortable -- definitely better than my Gen III (which itself was a big step up from the rear seat comfort of my Gen II). I was hoping to hear Ford would make the rear seat in the C-Max better than the rear seating in the Focus, but perhaps they haven't. This may be a deal killer for me (though it may be the smaller space as compared to the Prius v already has made me put the C-Max on the back burner without even getting inside one).

I hope Toyota is listening on this count. Instead of adding all sorts of heavy sound-deadening material, the noise cancelling tech could do wonders to make the cabin more enjoyable and a better family car.

This is a real no-go for me. The other current option for us is the new Mazda CX-5, and people are reporting high 20s -- near to 30 -- for overall fuel economy on that small crossover (with more space than the C-Max, much more comfort, more gadgets and Mazda reliability) at a very good price. I'll take a look at the C-Max, but I'm beginning to think the fuel economy and smaller space are going to make it difficult to make it a purchase over either the Prius v or the CX-5 -- or a few other vehicles. (I realize the CX-5 doesn't approach the low-end C-Max FE numbers, but there are other things to consider in a family car!)

 

Test drives are a bad way of judging prospective mpg. Not only are they short drives, some testers will drive them more aggressive, or leave them idling for longer while checking out all the cabin goodies. All of which can bring down the car's reported mpg. In short, you don't know what the people before you did with it. You have to reset the trip display to see what you are getting, and then that might not reflect what you will get on your daily drive.

The best way for a prospective buyer to determine how well they'll do it terms of economy is to keep accurate records of how they're doing with their current car. 27mpg in a Matrix is around it's EPA combined, depending on year and equipment. So EPA is likely in the C-max for you. I believe most of the complaints of not getting EPA we've seen recently were by people who had no idea how bad they were doing with their old car.

Most of the reviews out now are from press events where multiple journos get a chance to drive the car. Any economy numbers reported from those are as suspect as from a test drive for the same reasons. The reports might actually be higher if the manufacturer includes a section of the loop with low speeds and directs the tester in some hypermiling techniques. Somebody got over 60mpg in the C-max under such conditions.​

Edmunds Insideline is the only review from extensive drive time. That time includes some pushing the envelope performance testing. Repeated drag racing isn't common in a daily drive. Plus, it was 90F that day, so AC use needs to be considered.​

 

Yeah. I have no idea what mileage I got on my test drive, and I wasn't too worried about that. What I was worried about was the 28 mpg rating the car had after 800 miles.

BTW, I live in Arizona, and the heat here, inspiring extensive AC use, could clearly impact fuel economy.

 

The Leaves are gimmicky, but the screens are customizable. Going by a smattering of reviews, Ford's eco screens are the ones to beat. It first appeared in the previous Fusion. So checking out those reviews might give you better info on them. To most reviewers, they've seen it already for the C-max.

See my post above on reported numbers from reviews and test drives. They could be less every day real world than the EPA.

Mazda has done some amazing things with their Skyactiv tech. Wayne Gerdes at cleanmpg got 80mpg out of the manual CX-5. Starting with the 2014 Mazda6, we'll see regenerative braking, using a capacitor, in a straight ICE. Depending on the drive, the alternator might never spin up while accelerating or cruising.

 

Who knows how long that car idled with AC on during those 800miles. A dealer worth his salt will cool a hot cabin down before letting a customer test it.

The AC on the Matrix is less efficient than the one on a hybrid, and you have done well with it.

 

Very true.

I took a look at Edmund's latest write up of the C-Max. After having driven it for 400 miles, they are getting a fuel economy which "hovers in the mid-30s." Since Edmunds was getting 40 MPG from the Prius v (right on the EPA numbers), it appears the C-Max is not likely to live up to the EPA ratings. Interestingly, even though Edmunds found the Prius v to have more space, better fuel economy, easier braking and handling and a lower price (comparably equipped and not base model), it was suggesting a [hypothetical] single mom should replace her Gen II Prius with a C-Max. All of this while supposedly comparing the C-Max to the Prius v, but in reality saying that this mom would like the additional space and performance she would get over her existing Gen II Prius, not the Prius v. The reviewer obviously liked the C-Max to some degree (not a ton, I can say), and didn't want to say he would pick one over any other car, but was comfortable recommending it to a current Prius owner.

Overall, I don't see the C-Max as a Prius killer, but it certainly will dig into the Prius v market, even if it is smaller, less comfortable and gets lower FE. I think there are two main reasons: 1) Some people just don't want to carry a Prius tag around, as it might not be the brand association they'd like (people are weird that way, aren't we?); and 2) The C-Max is a Ford product -- buying American will have a real appeal.

I could not believe the mileage Wayne was getting out of the CX-5. He had one stretch WAY over 100 MPGs. I will never drive like Wayne, nor will most drivers, but it is interesting to see what he can squeeze out of any car. More telling to me would be Wayne's results after driving a CX-5 with an automatic transmission, as that is the only kind of car my wife will be driving!

 

We got into a more thorough discussion about the reported mpg in the C-max thread in the news section.
C-Max hybrid to get 47mpg both city/hwy | PriusChat

The short of it; you can't compare Edmunds Prius v number to their C-max simply because they did it on different days with a 23 degree F difference. The v at a pleasant 68F and the C-max at 91F. I doubt the reviewers for went AC on the C-max to control variables. They weren't doing a fuel economy test.

Their numbers include performance testing seeing how fast the car can go and how quickly it gets up to speed. The C-max is heavier than the v. So hard acceleration will carry a higher mpg penalty for it. Unless you regularly see how fast you can get to 60, the C-max's extra weight shouldn't hurt your fuel economy as it did for Edmunds.

We'll have to wait until somebody does a head to head review on the same day to for more relavent numbers to compare.

I don't think Ford does either. Perhaps when they can get the C-max weight down or a Focus hybrid.

 

My v fuel economy varies very little based on temperature when we're not talking about freezing temps. Even when I was sitting in the car with the baby and the AC running in mid August while my wife was in the supermarket, we saw very little impact to the fuel economy over the tank.

Tanks where I stick to secondary roads instead of mountainous interstate are the only appreciable difference. Even then, all of my tanks have been between 40.5 and 42.5 mpg. I'm sure it will drop when we have sub freezing temps, but that is a different animal than AC usage.

 

Your AC use is likely reasonable. Reviewers and customers test driving might be letting the car idle with AC on for extended lengths. Even if not long enough for the ICE to kick on, the drain on the traction battery means that the ICE will be on longer to bring the charge up. It's the same way overuse of EV mode can lead to reduced fuel economy.

Edmunds didn't run a fuel economy test. Not only was the temperatures different, but the driving could have been different. It could have been the same roads. Doesn't mean acceleration and braking was the same. Maybe they ran the C-max through a couple more 0 to 60 runs. Without controlling for variables, their mpg numbers for different can't be compared.

 

I keep waiting to see a new C Max Hybrid on Fuelly. I wonder what kind of mileage they are really getting.

 

I wouldn't trust low number of users on fuelly. It likely is like the gen II prius. If you drive it for good economy, it will be there. If you just drive it, the numbers are going to be below epa.

 

My neighbor just bought a Ford C-Max. It is much smaller than my Prius V. The passenger volume looks comparable but the trunk space is a little more than half compared to my Prius V. My neighbor allowed me to test drive it and I must admit that the extra power of the C-max is nice to have. It doesn't groan going up hill like my Prius V. The interior also looks nicer.

If I have to choose now I probably still go with the Prius V because of the extra cargo room and predicted reliability of Toyota Prii. On the other hands, extra power, nice interior and American made can be good reasons to buy the C-max.

 

Thanks for the quick write-up and comparison of your Prius and your neighbor's new C-Max.

What you've stated may well define the two different types of buyers who are looking at buying a hybrid vehicle. After all, if creature comforts or 0-60 are your number 1 priority, you are not a likely buyer for either a Prius (liftback or v or C) or a C-Max.

For buyers who are most interested in reliability, fuel economy and cargo space, the choice is quite clear: Prius v. For those who would prefer ahead of those three both more oom-pah in the engine compartment and support for an American company, that choice also is clear: Ford C-Max.

I'm a bit more interested in reliability and overall performance of my dollar in the purchase, and I think the Prius v would be the clear choice between the two vehicles. At the same time, I AM looking at a replacement for our Sienna, and the cars I'm looking at are either wagons or small SUV/CUVs. The Prius v is in the running, and the C-Max had a bit of my interest. I'll still take a closer look and test drive it, but the car just seems too small (cargo room, in particular) to fit the bill. It really doesn't have much over my current 2010 Prius in usable space.

 

I agree with the comment about the cargo space. I sold my Matrix when I bought my new Prius V, and I found the trunk of the C Max to be even less wide than the Matrix. It was taller, but that's of less use unless you want to block the window. The seats really fold flat, unlike the Prius V's, which fold flatfish.

The C Max has great head room for tall people though. The V has enough for me, but as a pretty tall guy, I respect that! It's also quieter than the V.

Again, what I'm really wondering about is real world mileage, both for hyper milers and people who drive the car normally. My initial feeling after test driving it was that is was very much in the conversation as an equivalently good car, with advantages and disadvantages. However, if the car actually averages less than 40 miles per gallon, then it's a step down.

 

I just took a trip up to northern Minnesota, where you are more likely to carry lots of stuff and travel far distances. It was no surprise seeing Prius V all over the place. In fact, it was quite exciting to see such popularity already.

 

I'd think an SR-5 Pri-up would be a popular option on the Range.