Ford bails out on hybrid promise

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Jun 29 2006, 09:32 PM) [snapback]278967[/snapback]</div>

Yes and Yes. Honda uses D cells NiMH D cells. The G1 Prii used the same. The G2 cells are rectangular.

 

The rectangular packaging allowed for much better heat management, as well as significantly tighter layout. And because had become proprietary, it was a golden opportunity to alter the chemistry to achieve a much greater energy density.

Toyota/Panasonic went all out, investing in the future. All that paid off big time.

The competitors just used off-the-shelf industrial batteries already available.

 

Maybe if they had concentrated on hybridizing something that was distinctive like a Fusion with some cleaned up aerodynamics they might have been able to make a dent in the market. I think even Toyota is finding the hybrid Highlander a bit of a harder sell. In today's market, if you're going to be green inside you want people to know you're green. (Sounds like something that Kermit would say. )

Anyway, here's another read on the story from The New York Times.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mehrenst @ Jun 30 2006, 11:53 AM) [snapback]279174[/snapback]</div>

That type of generalization is part of the problem.

A model of Highlander-Hybrid equipped with the same engine as Camry-Hybrid instead would obviously attract a different audience. But since that configuration isn't available (yet), conclusions about Highlander cannot be drawn overall.

Remember, the choice of engine is available for the non-hybrid. Why not the hybrid too?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(john1701a @ Jun 30 2006, 01:18 PM) [snapback]279190[/snapback]</div>

I heard they couldn't fit the 4cyl + hybrid drivetrain under the hood.

But they probably wanted to recoup as much money as they could out of the vehicle. A 6 cyl hybrid would be (in their opinion) more profitable than a 4 cyl. But with the deep discounts they have to offer to move them, they're probably losing money on each one sold.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(john1701a @ Jun 30 2006, 10:18 AM) [snapback]279190[/snapback]</div>

Is it not true? And what "problem" are you referring to? Is it the one where having a hybrid that doesn't give you a major improvement in mileage doesn't drive itself off the showroom floor?

I have seen some local newspaper & tv ads that are promoting the Highlander-hybrid which leads me to believe that they don't exactly run off the lot like the Prius does. There is something to be said for driving a hybrid that has some cache to being seen in one. During my last visit to a dealer for routine service I asked one of the salemen about the Highlander-hybrid and he was clearly in a "sales" mode as compared to a "we'll take your order" mode.

Frankly, I'm not sure what a wider range of engine options will do for hybrid sales. Especially in the case of Toyota who will run out of the max tax credit shortly.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jonnycat26 @ Jun 30 2006, 12:31 PM) [snapback]279197[/snapback]</div>

No, you are simply bitter because that actually is true for Accord. Camry & Highlander share the same chassis, so it can indeed fit.

Regardless, the point is still valid. The problem of generalization still exists.

Different configurations are possible, but news tv & articles portray a belief that choice of engine size will never be an option. A smaller engine in a hybrid will be more efficient than the larger, just like it is with traditional vehicles.



<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mehrenst @ Jun 30 2006, 12:45 PM) [snapback]279203[/snapback]</div>

Highlander-Hybrid was intentionally configured for emphasis on power. Why not try one with an emphasis on efficiency instead?

Toyota could then discontinue the one that doesn't sell as well. That's no different from the way other options have been introduced.

The point is to try. Clearly, Ford isn't. They are bailing early. Didn't they realize it was going to take years of effort after initial introduction? After all, that was true for Prius. It took years for people to discover just how well thought out the design actually was... by waiting for people to learn about it. Success isn't overnight. Long-Term profit requires patience.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(john1701a @ Jun 30 2006, 06:09 PM) [snapback]279339[/snapback]</div>

Platform and chassis are entirely different things John. The engine bay of the Highlander is slightly different than the camry. Don't worry tho, I know you're not intentionally FUDding.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jonnycat26 @ Jun 30 2006, 05:39 PM) [snapback]279353[/snapback]</div>

You claim to know more, yet spread FUD anyway. Why the repeated "won't fit" posts without any explanation? Where's the detail, especially if it is only slightly different? I'm not actually expecting an answer. Your defense of Honda is well established at this point. The support for Ford was simply an unexpected connection.

Of course, it doesn't matter. Long-Term plans cancel out issues of today anyway. If Ford really is planning an upgraded hybrid system for Fusion rather than the current design, where's a press release to confirm that?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(john1701a @ Jun 30 2006, 07:15 PM) [snapback]279374[/snapback]</div>

John... if the camry and Highlander are so identical, where's the AWD camry?

'Nuff said.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hdrygas @ Jun 29 2006, 10:31 PM) [snapback]278942[/snapback]</div>

Gotta agree with you there. Half of my family works/worked for Ford, or "Ford's" as the oldtimers call it. I felt bad about not buying a Ford, or at least an American car, but honestly they've done it to themselves. Nothing resembling innovation has come out of Detroit in thirty years. Its a real shame what the greedy, badly run American auto industry has done to Michigan. The economy there is in the toilet, and the auto industry is a large part of the blame.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Jul 6 2006, 01:42 AM) [snapback]281848[/snapback]</div>

Actually, they've sold the AWD corolla here in the past... the All-Trac.

And in Japan... anything goes. Toyota even sells mild hybrids over there.

 

Well, once again the US automakers are missing the boat (They are on the Titanic). E85 is not the answer to our energy independance. My 17 year old son said that WATER will be the next big crisis in America. Where is the water going to come from to grow the crops for ethanol in this country? IMO, some of our leaders need to go to a math class.