Down to the Rapture

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Alric @ Mar 22 2007, 02:12 PM) [snapback]410379[/snapback]</div>

Alric..... I don't want insult you because I respect you as a person..... but you really can't see.

Look at creation, the oceans, the sky and stars, the makeup of matter, the symetry of the human body, the plants, the animals... the amazing intelligence and constant monitoring of love to uphold it all.

I'm sorry you have no eyes.
The earth is filled with his Glory and the evidence of his existence.

Even man, as smart as he thinks he has become.. doesn't even know so many things.... simple things.... why we have to sleep... the mind doesn't?
What do our dreams mean?
What is love and where does it come from?
How did the stars get made?
How did it all start?
I could write a 1000 pages of things we don't know.
I could also write a 1000 pages of proof that God exist by the obvious.

Will you actually deny the possiblity of an obvious existence of God?
Have the delusions of false Gods your've read about really poisoned your reasoning so much?

Cannot you still hear from your heart and the common sense of your spirit?

What has made you so dead?

What has poisoned you so?

If you ask a child, they can even tell you God exist?.. its just common sense... you don't even have to be taught about God to know there is one.

I pray the Lord will open your eyes and your heart.... I want you to be open and expect to get insight you have never had before.

I can pray for you, but you have to be willing.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 23 2007, 12:04 AM) [snapback]410659[/snapback]</div>

Oh, this is too much. Life is indeed beautiful, wondrous, and complex. It grows and changes constantly, and I have the utmost respect for it. But to say it's all the result of an imaginary being that controls each and every cell according to a predetermined plan is utterly absurd.

I have had many long and deep conversations with religious leaders of many faiths. I've led youth groups, sung in church choirs, read scripture in church, and acted in church plays both solemn and joyous. Maybe I've asked too many questions over the years, but I've gradually come to the conclusion that it's all a delusional fantasy. I am not dead or sick or blind. I have a strong, inquisitive mind, and I'm going to use it. Call it a fall from grace if you must, but I don't believe in Heaven or Hell or God or Satan any more. They're interesting and heartwarming stories, but they're not real. If we accepted everything 'The Church' told us, the universe would still be revolving around Earth, Rome in particular. We don't have all the answers, but we know there's more than one.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 23 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]410651[/snapback]</div>

'you don't understand them'


ALAN.

How dare you. If you are trying to pick a fight with me, on things spiritual, then you are picking the wrong fight. Frankly, that one insult you just casually threw in there, well, it ticks me off to no end. HOWEVER, I will rise above your insults, and once again, have to respond to your 'post'.

Seeing as you have YET to respond to my DIRECT post that I levelled at you yesterday...I should not respond to yours.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 22 2007, 09:01 AM) [snapback]410075[/snapback]</div>

:lol: 'use our brains'

Man, all along, I have advocated using your brain. Unfortunately, you refuse to use yours. You turn your brain off, as evidenced in your condemnation of anyone else here...I'll get to it, but man, again, you insult people...'too bad you can't see' you say, or something like that...You really have a knack for getting under my skin, I'll give you that.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 22 2007, 09:01 AM) [snapback]410075[/snapback]</div>

Okay, something that has bugged the s**t out of me for sometime. When you refer to God, could you, a self proclaimed Christian, at least capitalize the 'h' when it comes to Him? Or He?
Show some respect towards your God.

If GOD gave us dominion over the whole planet, as you think, then why don't we have, I do not know, better control? If you think God intervened, at all, it was only to destroy us, as evidenced in the great flood. Or did you forget that? Another reason I don't buy Noah and the fable of the flood. It contradicts what God says. It contradicts His loving us, and not wanting to hurt us. But, I might as well be speaking in Finish for you to get what I am saying...Since you believe, in some sort of twisted logical way, that God wants the best for us, but will destroy us with a flood...It's like when your father would take out the belt, and say just as he pulls your pants down, exposing your naked nice person, and as he lifts the belt high, 'I only do this because I love you', and then smacks the s**t out of you. Yeah. That makes a load of sense. (And, for the record, my father never did that to me...but I suspect you ALAN, you a whipping, and loved it)

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 22 2007, 09:01 AM) [snapback]410075[/snapback]</div>

No, you twist it. You twist what God has said, and done. HE forgives all your sins, PAST AND PRESENT AND FUTURE, despite how you will do it again. Which means, at least to me, that SIN has LOST IT'S POWER, just like, CHRIST SAID IT DID.

Sin, is what Christ defeated. Why worry about sins, when Christ died on the cross for them? I'm not saying, that there is no earthly consequence for doing wrong and shameful acts; but what I am saying, your sins are forgiven, no matter what, and you don't have to worry about that. Christ said that He would take our yokes. And yet, for some reason, your type of Christian misses the boat on that. Hmm. Maybe it's because you have a guilty complex, one that needs to be continuously punished, that can't accept Christ's forgiveness.



<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 22 2007, 09:01 AM) [snapback]410075[/snapback]</div>

Again, I am not afraid. You can't grasp simple things, so it seems. You say, 'now you trust nothing'. Well, I said, I trust God, so do I trust nothing?

Can you now see what I was saying? You said...ah, never mind. I don't think you got it. Or will.

Moving on, barely...What is with this whole obsession with being covered in blood? Me? I don't want to be covered in any blood. I'm not into that kind of sick imagery. Covered by the Love of Christ, I can accept..

And it's been so long since you got your eyes out of the scriptures, you can't see how blind you are. How you piss off the non believer more then I do.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daronspicher @ Mar 22 2007, 10:41 AM) [snapback]410092[/snapback]</div>

Oh, so it's politically correct to believe that Christ would talk, and not condemn? I must tell my cousin Bill that. He will find that ironic...

How do I feel about that verse? Let me get it...

Revelation 22:18 –Revelation 22:19 (TMSG)
I give fair warning to all who hear the words of the prophecy of this book: If you add to the words of this prophecy, God will add to your life the disasters written in this book;

if you subtract from the words of the book of this prophecy, God will subtract your part from the Tree of Life and the Holy City that are written in this book.
============

Well, for something written by a person under the influence, it's pretty cool.

Again, Revelation has it's moments, it's truth...but it was written, by many accounts, by a man who was stoned. And also, approved by a young church, with an agenda to recruit new believers. SO, the idea of being left out in the cold, well, no one wants that. Everyone wants to be included in the party...

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(airportkid @ Mar 22 2007, 01:10 PM) [snapback]410169[/snapback]</div>

Yes, that is true, the Bible records as historical 'fact' that a great flood came and wiped out the earth. What I (and many others believe), is the great flood was a severe Nile flood. Every year, the Nile would flood the area around it, and more then likely, once, it flooded more then in previous years. Thus, the fable of Noah and his ark.

For the longest time, Noah has been my own personal fable to discount, to prove as it were, that the Bible is not 100% correct. Just the idea that Noah was suppose to be, what, 500 years old? I mean, Give Me A Break.

Then, the absurd idea that every single animal, fit into this ark...well, not every animal; just ask the unicorns...

I often wonder, how much easier it would be to support the Bible, if it jettisonned the ridiculous stories, or at least put them in as fables, to prove a point. Jonah is another...and Moses parting the Red Sea...Nice to film; hard to buy.

Of course, now by saying that, I will be labeled as a heretic, and I will be burned at the next stake...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(airportkid @ Mar 22 2007, 04:23 PM) [snapback]410334[/snapback]</div>

Well, I am upset, a little, at ALAN and his insults at others, and me...but I will try to let it slide...So I am human, despite the nasty PM that suggested otherwise...I won't say who, but that person who did knows what they did, and frankly, I'm pretty sure that I have not had sex with any animals, nor do I have horns, or go by the name Satan...


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 22 2007, 04:34 PM) [snapback]410343[/snapback]</div>

Which is so like God; to screw with those He loves.

Man, ALAN, why does God have to have vengeance? Is it possible, that God does not have vengeance, at all, but man put that into the Bible, to gain power over men?
I can not grasp, this need, for a harsh God. I just can't get it. Yet, you would, as human, have a hard time with another human performing genocide, right? You would not just stand back as Hitler killed millions of Jews, right? If you could have, you would have killed Hitler to stop him, right?

So why does God get a pass if He kills millions? Where is the sense in that? Is it possible that God did not kill millions, and that that story of the flood was manufactured? Never mind. I know your answer.




<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 22 2007, 04:34 PM) [snapback]410343[/snapback]</div>

More gold in heaven if you do?


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 23 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]410651[/snapback]</div>

Wow, ALAN, it's amazing you don't get jokes...but I have hammered that enough...

In the simplest of ways, I have said, time and time and time again, that I would believe in Christ, God, even with no Bible. So, in that sense, (which I suspect will fly over your head), yes, the Bible means nothing. In that sense.

The Bible has meaning, it has wisdom, but it also has out right lies, and fabrications, if you dare to look at it with logic. Have I forgotten that God was here before the Bible? No. But I am not so sure that we need to take everything in such a literal sense...if we did, then we have to deal with God reaching out with His right hand, and how large that hand must be, and how, or why, would God need hands at all...


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 23 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]410651[/snapback]</div>

My God is the same God as yours is. Strange, that you can't see that. But, to answer your question, the God I know and trust is big enough to allow for questions, to debunk, to tear down His word. For He is larger then any old Bible. How simple that truth is. What you are saying, to me at least, is that the Bible is at the very least, equal to God, and therefore, as powerful. Which I just don't get. Sorry.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TJandGENESIS @ Mar 22 2007, 11:27 PM) [snapback]410745[/snapback]</div>

Jettisoned them? Don't they serve a purpose? Don't you see anything in them that is of value?

All of the Hebrew scriptures were written BEFORE historical accounts as a type of literature were ever conceived. They are not intended by God to be taken literally, because He choose to have them written in a time when the messages were given in fables, allegories and stories.

For instance, in the story of Jonah, I see a would-be prophet who really doesn't want to go to Ninevah and proclaim G*d's truth, but is forced to. But instead of talking about the majesty of G*d, he goes off-script and simply tells the Ninavahites that they are going to hell. Even though he was horrible at what he did, it seems that G*d used his imperfect and incomplete testimony for His own purposes.

Hey wait, that's the point I made earlier when you were criticized for not sharing the exact method of sharing the Gospel that others use here!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 23 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]410651[/snapback]</div>

Well, what measuring stick do you have? A book that declares itself correct? If Stephen King did that with THE STAND (an excellent book, BTW), if Stephen King said THE STAND was the WORD OF GOD, you would laugh your nice person off, right? Well, it's the same about the Bible. Just by saying it's the word of God, does not mean it is. Again, and again, and again, I have pointed out how there are parts of the Bible that have been removed, and by whose decision was that? Did God call down and order the correction? Or did man? I think man did. I measure what I measure, as any person should. With their brain.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(fshagan @ Mar 23 2007, 04:37 AM) [snapback]410751[/snapback]</div>

Thanks!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 23 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]410651[/snapback]</div>

Huh? Not sure (really) what you are meaning here, since I would suppose that most rational people, knowing God or not, know that cheating is wrong...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 23 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]410651[/snapback]</div>

Let me include the important verses after that...I love quoting the Bible, with the correct meaning intact.

Ephesians 4:11 –Ephesians 4:16 (TMSG)
He handed out gifts of apostle, prophet, evangelist, and pastor-teacher
to train Christians in skilled servant work, working within Christ’s body, the church,
until we’re all moving rhythmically and easily with each other, efficient and graceful in response to God’s Son, fully mature adults, fully developed within and without, fully alive like Christ.
No prolonged infancies among us, please. We’ll not tolerate babes in the woods, small children who are an easy mark for impostors.

God wants us to grow up, to know the whole truth and tell it in love—like Christ in everything. We take our lead from Christ, who is the source of everything we do.
He keeps us in step with each other. His very breath and blood flow through us, nourishing us so that we will grow up healthy in God, robust in love.
The Old Way Has to Go
==================

God wants us to grow up. Man, I wish we all could...Do you get that ALAN? God wants you to Grow Up! He has said it at least twice in these threads! Seems He is trying to get a message to you!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 23 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]410651[/snapback]</div>

ALAN, there you go again; insulting me. I would ask you for an apology, but you won't grant one, since you seem to be so sure you are correct. Sorry. Was that small of me? I apologise if it was.

'you don't understand how God speaks'. Huh. The same can be said for you, ALAN. But, what I will say, is that you understand what you understand about God. Again and again I say this, what works for you, won't work (always) for others. How dare you assume for one minute, that I don't know how God speaks to me? I hear God speak to me in words I understand. And, from what I gather...others understand as well.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 23 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]410651[/snapback]</div>

BTW: It's 'Christian' not 'christian'.

Do I understand the fruits of the Holy Spirit? Sure, better then many. As well as the gifts. And I have been there when pastors have instructed people to 'act' on Que as if they have those 'gifts'. It's often part of the behind the scenes that others don't know about the church...

I don't exercise what I can't see a need for. It's like exercising your appendix. It won't help it become a needed organ. I know that some people have deceived others into thinking they are moving in the power of the Holy Spirit, when again, they are just following orders from corrupt preachers. This is why I don't speak in gibberish, er, tongues, since it is just that. Gibberish.

And ALAN, if you paid attention, at all to any of my posts, you would have read where I experienced my own miracle of hearing returning to my left ear after being deaf for 30 some odd years in that ear. That happened to me. I was healed, by just asking of God. No big prayer. Just a simple prayer. So, unless you have doubts about that, I have indeed seen the power of God's healing power.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 23 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]410651[/snapback]</div>

For the third time, you insult me. 'TJ, don't discount spiritual things because you don't understand them'
I understand much more then you give me credit for.

You can talk about spiritual things with anyone, if you give them respect, ALAN.




<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 23 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]410651[/snapback]</div>

:lol:

It is never wise to believe that everything that is written is true. Question it, ponder it, dive into it...but don't just accept it because it says to.

Even with what I write. I don't expect everyone to believe everything I write; it's human nature to question. And we are made in GOD'S image, so He must question...And as to God's word being faillible...well...


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 23 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]410651[/snapback]</div>

I'm missing something? :lol: You are so funny! Man, I may be missing a lot of things, but I am pretty sure I understand what I understand, and that is that the Bible is not perfect, Christ loved us all, and I don't care if anyone ever believes in Christ, The Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, or all three. I am not here to convince anyone, that they are right. Or wrong. I firmly believe in Freedom of Thought.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 23 2007, 12:53 AM) [snapback]410651[/snapback]</div>

Have you ever heard, that it's the cat's house; they just let us live in it?

ALAN, I do really endorse that CHRIST DRIVEN message of Peace and Love. Since He also said, 'Love one another; be good to one another' I would suspect He would have dug Woodstock. (And, BTW, what is 'powerflower'? )

If you boil down Christ's message, it's so easy, a child could get it. It's to get along with others. Which means, sometimes you don't agree with everyone. Man, I am so tired of this arguing between you and I. Why I continue, I don't know. Some would say I should just drop it, and let you and loveittoomuch go off and play with your selves. Just let you two close minded, uptight, out of sight fundies go and continue to misrepresent what Christ has to offer.

But then... I would not sleep well. I can't stand religious fundamentalism. It's what causes wars, and heartbreak, and frankly, is what is 99% wrong with the world today. If I can just help one person see that not all who believe in Christ are close minded; that some of us really do want us all to get along...

Well, it may be worth it all.

GOD does not 'come into the picture' for me. He is always there, guiding with His love. And if by 'pleasing man' you mean, helping everyone get along, then yeah, my God is into that.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Mar 23 2007, 01:04 AM) [snapback]410659[/snapback]</div>

I'm sorry, Alric, that ALAN has said these mean spirited things to you.

And ALAN, how can you say that someone has no eyes? Or when you were not 'saved' did you also, not have eyes? Since you did not have eyes, how did you ever see God then?

You insult as you say 'I don't want insult you'

And, as an honest question ALAN, is English a second language for you? You seem to have a difficult grasp of it sometimes...

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hyo silver @ Mar 22 2007, 11:45 PM) [snapback]410713[/snapback]</div>

I encourage you to not give your time to a dead church in the future that only zaps your faith rather than strengthening it.
Many churches are nothing more the social gatherings that talk a little about God and get tax exemption.

Find a church thats real and worships the real God.




<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TJandGENESIS @ Mar 23 2007, 12:51 AM) [snapback]410739[/snapback]</div>

You got that part right TJ, but you don't understand the power by which he was being influenced.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TJandGENESIS @ Mar 23 2007, 03:05 AM) [snapback]410760[/snapback]</div>

You take anything personal that tells you of a fault..... they are not insults.. how many times do I have to explain it?????

They are observations......

TJ, you win.... I really don't feel I'm doing you any more good and there is none so blind who will not see....
if you really want to revell in your deception and lash out at any bright light that comes your way because it hurts your eyes.....Thats your business........

You can PM me if you ever change your mind and we will bring it open again.... but I really don't feel you want to know God, you only want your majic jenni.

I'm really sad for you as there is so much you are missing.....

So long... I pray the mercy of God be upon you and that you live long enough to see his truth.

Lets face it.. you hate the God I know and understand very little about him and hate the parts you do know about and trample his word under your feet and then justify yourself...... and I"m not sure who your God is.

but I"m sure you serve another God than I based on the extensive and exhaustive replys and we'll just leave it at that.


I leave you with one last scripture to show the mentality you seem to preach.....of which you can flush down the toilet with the rest you have done.
BTW... people like you who proclaim themselves as preachers are the ones that turn others off from God and confuse them about the church as they come in seeking power to deliever them from thier sin and all you do is give them a fake God that accepts their sin and they still have the misery and sting of thier sin and never experience freedom and deliverance.

(Prov 30:20 NKJV) This is the way of an adulterous woman: She eats and wipes her mouth, And says, "I have done no wickedness."

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TJandGENESIS @ Mar 23 2007, 12:19 AM) [snapback]410725[/snapback]</div>

the scriptures tell you that when you get a whipping it seems greivious at the moment you are getting it and then later you see the fruit and benifit of it....

I don't expect you to understand as you have be raised in such a way that allows you to be ok no matter what sin you embrace.


Your God does not hate sin, but loves it.. and he is the father of it.

You turn away everything that offers freedom and deliverance from sin and you take it as a personal attack when I speak about your sin as being bad.. almost as if I'm attacking your wife.

That would make sense, since you are married to your sin and love it and are bonded with it and expect your God to accept it.

I am only bringing more condemnation upon you by presenting the way of freedom to you as you only reject it the more I push it.

 

TJ, I hope you have seen that I do not jump in and and be a synchophant to Windstrings. However, you do not see how mch your anger toward something he said way back has colored you to everything he now says. I suspect you read his posts now through the lens of anger and of insult.

Many times, he is saying the same thing you are saying, but you don't like the way he is saying it. Step back, read his posts in the same 'loving' way you are reading others.

Windstrings, until he does this...you may as well not respond to him at all. I agree with your earlier asssertion that you are just pointing out your point of view. There is no JUDGING going on here people, at least by myself, WS, and lovitsomuchhewants to share.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Schmika @ Mar 23 2007, 09:29 AM) [snapback]410795[/snapback]</div>

Actually, Schmika, you may not be judging...and sometimes I feel that loveit isn't either...but windstrings has on dozens of these posts put himself out there as judge, jury, hand of God, voice of God, and the only one who understands God because he has the inside track.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Schmika @ Mar 23 2007, 07:29 AM) [snapback]410795[/snapback]</div>

I appreciate the wisdom in those words as I am hearing the same thing.

We do say the same things.. but I'm really starting to think TJ and I worship two different Gods.


If I know my Dad and know his words because I have a relationship with him and someone describes thier dad enough.. pretty soon by sheer deduction its not hard to tell we don't have the same dads. Its not judgement.

Counterfiets must have many identical qualities to the real as to not me counted as false.

I think there have been painful things in the past that have caused him to make a God he can live with.

The sad thing is the the God that hates sin is the only one that offers freedom from it so that one can really know God. God and sin doesn't mix. Holiness and evil are not compatible.

There really is a way to live "above sin" where it doesn't control us. Many churches have lost thier way or given up hope and say.. "oh that was for the apostles, or Gods grace loves you just the way you are" and they leave out the part that God hates thier sin, so people assume a loving God will accept thier sin too!

So many people don't understand discipline and disciplines... they have been burnt and abused in the past by those who claimed to love them and were in authority over them.

I fear our next coming generation with the rampant child abuse going on now, they too will have an even harder time understanding a loving God that chastises those whom he loves.

Even today in this generation, they see it as being cruel.

Noah "begged" people to repent and come into the ark, but they scoffed and considered him a stupid old fool with dementia, until it was too late, then they all wanted in like drowning rats wanting to find a stick that floats.. they had no heart to leave thier sin.

Even today... so many only want a loving God that will take thier sin.. so Satan gives them the golden calf they asked for.

A God that lets them revel in thier sin parties and makes them feel righteous as did the pharasees all the while they didn't know God though he walked among them.


Not only did they not know him... they crucified him... even today.. the same crowd who misunderstands him wants to kill him because he speaks of thier sin and exposes thier wrong.

Even in these posts on this forum, you can see the same spirit of those wanting to destroy and silence the voices that expose thier sin.

they call it judgement, I just call it speaking the word.

They call it being judgemental, I call it speaking the word.

They say its fairy tales and the writers were under the "influence", I say its just the truth.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(livelychick @ Mar 23 2007, 07:49 AM) [snapback]410800[/snapback]</div>

I do call sin sin and black black.. if you call that judgement, so be it.

I get the blame because I spoke the words.. but I have no way of judgeing anybody.. but the word of God has a way of revealing the thoughts and intents of the heart.

When people say things that don't line up with the word, they fall prey to its judgement.

People then squirm and try to "justify" themselves rather than humbling themselves before God and admitting thier wrong and repenting so that they can be free from it.

They rather want to embrace it, defend it, protect and even nourish the lifestyle that repels them from a Holy God.

They want a God that loves sin... that would be the devil.

See???... another example.....

You will say that last phrase proves I am judging someone.... but its only proof they don't line up to God.


The pharasees didn't want to line up either.. they wanted to keep thier status as being righteious and even holy and superior, rather than admit they knew nothing and start at the bottom.

Jesus spoke of being born again and marvelled that "the leader of the Jews" did not even know what he was talking about.

That put that person in quite a pickle.. they either had to discount Jesus's words as being bunk to keep thier status, or admit they knew nothing at all and needed to be taught all over again as a child about spiritual things.

We have set up such a foul religious hiearchy that God hates.. it absolutely stinks!.. it only repels people from the true God and give them the golden calf of ritual and form and promise that keeps them from knowing the real Holy God that created all things.

A Golden calf.. something they made with thier own hands from thier own sacrific and things that were valuable to them.. something they could show off and put thier name on.. something they can take the credit for and then worship it as if its God or of God... something that accepts thier party of sin in the midst of it.

They did it because they couldn't see God.. didn't know why he delayed and didn't know what happened to his guidance.. so they created their own god.

The church of laodecia is the one of today thats is asleep and rich and increased with goods and says they have need of nothing and can't see that they are blind, naked and wretched... even so are many of the church goers of today.

They eat dog food and rotten leftovers for thier meals rather than eating fresh manna everyday from the Kings table.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(livelychick @ Mar 23 2007, 07:49 AM) [snapback]410800[/snapback]</div>

Lively chick, I'm not sure why you think I think I have the inside track..... everybody out here that believes in Jesus as the son of God who came in the flesh to save the world all agree with what I"m saying and are on the same page.. maybe not the method I use to present it, but with the content.... all else that denys Jesus in that role of the spirit of antichrist as stated in the scriptures... .



The spirit of "antichrist" does not openly oppose the Christ..but he denys Jesus as the son of God and only gives him credit for being a wise man and a leader...... it is a spirit that mimics him.. its the fake, the counterfeit.... remember when he sets himself up "as God" in the synogue, only then will the Jews realize he is false. Jesus is the power that killed sin.. in revelations ..... he was given authority above all names and it is written that he was the Only one found worthy to open the book to pour out wrath upon the earth because he is the only one that paid that price. If satan could somehow remove Jesus.... he would win.



He knows that openly opposing the Christ would make everyone his enemy that of the religious world, but he is set to decieve. Many other religions out there.. the devil is not even in competition with.. because he created them in the first place.



I'm sorry to say, but many who have only played church, do not know the basics of christianity and the foundations thereof... let alone know the deeper things. Their pastors only taught them that God loves them and that everything will be ok as along as they tithe and stay a member.

They were never taught the deeper things of the scriptures, yet profess themselves to be teachers when they themselves need to go back and be taught.



I don't have an inside track at all among believers.. only among unbelievers.



Jesus gave pretty clears signs that would follow a believer....... many profess godliness, but deny its power.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TJandGENESIS @ Mar 23 2007, 01:37 AM) [snapback]410735[/snapback]</div>

TJ, to answer your question about "The Blood" if I may?

At the beginning of the bible, there has always been animial sacrifices.

These sacrifices were initiated by God Himself.

The reason for such sacrifices? To make atonement for man's sin/sins.
Atonement meaning according to Webster's dictionary: to make reparation, or to repair or make amends.

Sin(s) brings separation or a gulf between God and man; but it was not God Who separated Himself from man; rather it was man who separated himself from God when he chose to listen to the Evil One instead of God. (It was this man's choice, Adam.)

It is the only way for man to make amends with God.
So if man is serious about his relationship with God then he would do things God's way.

The high priest would dare not approach God on behalf of the people unless there was a sacrifice. Otherwise, his life was on the line.

There were many sacrifices for many different things; but the one type of sacrifice that was offered up would be the spotless lamb, without blemish.

The sacrifices that took place down through the centuries by the Hebrews testifies to the fact that men are not without sin; and that all of us, we are born of a sin nature because of Adam's disobedience to God.

The Lord in His wisdom, down through the passage of time, decided that He wanted to do away with all sacrifice for all time with the exception of one sacrifice.

He so arranged it that He Himself would pay with His own shed blood. It would be through His Son Jesus.

When Jesus died on the cross, the Roman soldier pierced His side with his sword, and there flowed out, mingled, the water and the BLOOD of Jesus Christ.

So unless we accept the payment or say, "Okay, God, I received the payment of Christ's very own shed blood on the cross for payment of all my sin, so that I might be reconciled to you."; otherwise then, no reparation can be made.

Throughout all of the bible, there is the same thread, where God tells and shows us about the redemption of man through the BLOOD.

It's there when God first took and slew the first animal, and then used the animal's skins to cover the nakedness of Adam and Eve.

It's there when Abramham goes to slay Isaac, his only son. But God provided a ram caught in a thicket.

It's there in the Passover when the slain lamb's blood was put on the doorpost and the angel of death passed over each first born.

It's there when the Hebrews circumcised their baby boys because it serves as a visual reminder of their covenant with God.

It's there when a man and a virgin make love; and it should remind them it was God who made marriage.

The shedding of blood it's everywhere.

It runs through the entire bible.

I could give you many more.

And so when a believer receives the atoning SHED BLOOD of Jesus Christ, THE SPOTLESS LAMB OF GOD, slain for his sins, then that is what is known as "COVERED BY THE BLOOD."

This is very basic to Christianity and its tenets.

How could you not know?