Down to the Rapture

I don' think windstrings or loveit got the memo:

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Feb 13 2007, 03:48 PM) [snapback]389693[/snapback]</div>

Since no man can know the mind of god (whatever god we're talking about), who knows. That just might be her plan.

And god (if there is one), just might be a woman. Of course, the books were written by men, so we won't know until we die, will we?

I take it you can't conceive of any possibility that your religious view could be false. That makes any kind of reasonable discussion pointless. You quote scripture as your defense. But were I of a different faith, I could quote my own scripture right back at you and be just as convinced I'm right because I have "proof".

I don't know whether there's a god or not. Nor do I really care. If there is, and I live a good life and am a compassionate person throughout, then I'm sure that will be taken into consideration. If there's not, no harm no foul.

I think it would be pretty petty for any god not to let someone into heaven or Valhalla or have their 72 virgins if they lived a good, kind, compassionate life but didn't "believe".

 

I thought windbags was done with this...since no one has the intelligence to talk to him.


I was just speaking to a Catholic priest friend of mine, and while I was there, we brought up this thread. And he thought windstrings, loveit, were of the type that would drive away people from God.

He also thought that I would too, but to a lesser extent, since what I am advocating is thinking outside the Bible, er, box.

While Father George and I may not agree 100%, at least he is not putting down my intelligence, or anyone else's.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Alric @ Feb 13 2007, 03:08 PM) [snapback]389708[/snapback]</div>

Perfect example of calling evil good and good evil.. is the rest of your life so upside down?.. you don't even need to answer.

I found some of your friends in the Bible!...

(2 Pet 2:10 KJV) But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Presumptuous are they, selfwilled, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities.
(2 Pet 2:11 KJV) Whereas angels, which are greater in power and might, bring not railing accusation against them before the Lord.
(2 Pet 2:12 KJV) But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;

Fools see those that know the Lord as Fools when they are the only fool for rejecting him.

I respect your opinion.. since your blind... its hard for me to expect you to accept what you cannot see or understand.......

God has a way of revealing himself to anyone if they are willing and ask... if you don't ask, its your own folly.






<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TJandGENESIS @ Feb 13 2007, 03:26 PM) [snapback]389726[/snapback]</div>

I never implied you were stupid.... in fact, you are too smart for your own good... you have learned to trust in your intelligence and if you can't process it, you won't trust it....

I'm not sure how you deal with love etc, because its above intelligence to grasp too.. I guess you just follow your hormones and you don't have love.. I don't know?

Maybe your heart is dead?.. Can you feel?.... what do you feel?.. do you understand it?

the mind is so limited....

What we are talking about here is much much bigger than the intellect to grasp, but your heart and spirit can if it ware awakened.....

When I said anyone with reasonable understanding.. I mean't just that.. you appear to have none in the spirit realm.

Jesus had the same problems trying to explain heavenly concepts to people that couldn't even get the earthly concepts.. its not a matter of smarts.. it a matter of openess, surrender, and seeking for God.
(John 3:12 KJV) If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?

Your whole problem is you have a disease.... its called an "unbelieving heart".. I bet you can't believe in anything can you?

I think I found some of your friends in the bible too:

(Titus 1:15 KJV) Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.
(Titus 1:16 KJV) They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Feb 13 2007, 04:52 PM) [snapback]389739[/snapback]</div>

Gee, thanks windstrings! This is giving me insight into right wing "leaders." No wonder Condi becomes such an airhead when the facts are shoved in her face.

Also, that verse shows how religion has been used as a form of dominion over its believers (in terms of government).

Thanks again!

 

the purpose of the word of God is to:
(Heb 4:12 KJV) For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

To reveal true intents and thoughts.... not to beat someone over the head.. unfortunately some don't get subtile hints.....so it appears that way......

Jesus was no less nice when dealing with similiar attitudes.....

(John 8:42 KJV) Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
(John 8:43 KJV) Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
(John 8:44 KJV) Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
(John 8:45 KJV) And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.

Does that sound diplomatic and having sensitivity for his feelings and not insulting his intelligence?
And he did it out of Love because sometimes tough Love is the only love that works with someone who is rebellious and self willed.

 

Hehehehe thanks again! Hear that, oh ye women perusing these forums! You should be at home cooking!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Feb 13 2007, 05:05 PM) [snapback]389761[/snapback]</div>

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Feb 13 2007, 04:52 PM) [snapback]389739[/snapback]</div>

Dr. Berman? Is that you?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Feb 13 2007, 04:52 PM) [snapback]389739[/snapback]</div>

That's right ... you didn't imply it. You said it. Unless I'm completely misinterpreting this little nugget:
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Feb 13 2007, 02:08 PM) [snapback]389616[/snapback]</div>

That certainly looks to me like you're questioning the intelligence of anyone who doesn't see things as you do. I interpreted that as follows: "Since you people don't see things the way I do, you're obviously not intelligent enough. I mean, it's obvious to me. Therefore, you must not be smart enough to see it."

 

Nice of you to take his statments out of context, there proco. :mellow:


Nice photoshop alric..

 

Proco is a little slow.. please forgive him.. he's trying to impress his friends... as far as the rest, I'll explain "again"..

lack of intelligence may work to your advantage when dealing with spiritual things.... those who are smart enough that they have learned to "trust" in thier intelligence because it usually never lets them down can be the biggest suckers in spritual matters.

Have you ever seen someone who is mildly retarded, but sweet and lovable with no malice, hate, envy or the like...... sometimes I think they are the smartest of all!

When you are "smart" it makes you vulnerable to pride which blinds and decieves.

(Prov 3:5 KJV) Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
(Prov 3:6 KJV) In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.
(Prov 3:7 KJV) Be not wise in thine own eyes: fear the LORD, and depart from evil.
(Prov 3:8 KJV) It shall be health to thy navel, and marrow to thy bones.

 

My Wife was reading over my shoulder and had to put her two cents in..


It occurs to me that it might be as simple (?) as this.

People who don't really believe in God and Christ and the Bible, etc. should really care less what we Christians think. They should, quite simply, shake their heads sadly for the poor delusional Christians and walk away. Instead SO many have to violently oppose those who believe and express that hostility in SO many ways. Maybe it's because that deep down inside they fear we poor, delusional Christians are actually onto something and because they're not ready to accept our truth they must attack it. Of course, that may not be true of everyone, but a startling number of people do that. Why such violent reactions? Why do they even care, if they don't even believe? I don't have the answers...I just know this.

I lived 30 years before Christ came into my life and I've lived 12 years since. Knowing Him has radically changed my life for the better in every single way. I haven't had to be perfect...just ready to accept His truths and know that they are better for me than the way I was living before. The reason it's silly to argue about religion and God and Christ is that it's really not something to argue. You either believe or you don't....it's a matter of faith. I don't know why the fact that I have that faith irritates so much of the world, but I'm not going to change it to please the world ( actually I do know why but I'm not going to get into that right now). I do pray that all who don't know Christ will come to that day when the truth is revealed and they can take that leap of faith, but in the meantime...do your thing. Your opinions are yours and they're really not going to shake me a whole lot. Just think of it this way. If I'm wrong, then all I've done is lived a good, moral life by my standards and when I die it's done. If you're wrong....well, lets just say that it might be awkward to stand before God to give an accounting of your life and you have to start out with..."Oh, I didn't believe in you and attacked everyone who did."

Are there false prophets? Of course. Are there cults and preachers and things that are not of God that are done in the name of God? Of course. It's a fallen world. Do Christians sin and mess up, sometimes irrevocably? Of course. We are far from perfect and often fail. Trust in God...not man.

At any rate, thanks for letting me share.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Feb 13 2007, 10:41 AM) [snapback]389464[/snapback]</div>

I wasn't joking.

And I guess you think I listen to who, exactly?

PriusGuy, here's your answer to your last post (which I can understand, and appreciate your thoughts): If I feel a sense of condemnation/judgment from a fellow HUMAN (read: imperfect) about my belief system, then I tend to get a little ornery. When one of those same humans claims to know the mind of God, and is therefore only passing God's condemnation on to me, then I get REALLY ornery. Judge me by my acts...that's all I ask.

I don't fight against God. I fight against hate, racism, bigotry, violence, exclusion, poverty, and overall evil. I think that puts me on God's side. At least, that's what she says.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priusguy04 @ Feb 13 2007, 04:29 PM) [snapback]389851[/snapback]</div>

There would be little if any of that so called hostility were the Christians not constantly attempting to impose their values and beliefs on the rest of society.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priusguy04 @ Feb 13 2007, 06:29 PM) [snapback]389851[/snapback]</div>

Very nice.. thanks for sharing... thats my arguement for atheists... they seem to be the ones who fight the hardest do work against the God they don't believe in, not admitting there are deeper issues they are hiding from.

But your right.. they are not content just to go away and think we're freaks, nor will they consent... they
just want to spread contention and hope for an occasion to catch you in a verbal mistake of some type...
the same game they tried on Jesus all the time.

I welcome those who genuinely want to know, but many disrespect God and all those who carry his words so they only bring greater damnation on themselves to play cat and mouse and mock those who attempt to bring them the good news.... News that they no longer have to live in the bondage and blindness.... but they are the children of Laodecia.

This is Gods message to the last days church.... This spirit prevails in many settings and church goers who profess godliness, but deny the power thereof and some even deny Jesus... thinking they are somehow righteous of thier own good works.

(Eph 2:8 KJV) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
(Eph 2:9 KJV) Not of works, lest any man should boast.


(Rev 3:15 KJV) I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
(Rev 3:16 KJV) So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
(Rev 3:17 KJV) Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
(Rev 3:18 KJV) I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.
(Rev 3:19 KJV) As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(IsrAmeriPrius @ Feb 13 2007, 09:29 PM) [snapback]389916[/snapback]</div>

Heh... reminds me of fundamentalist Christians' yelps of attacks against the "Christian minority."

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(IsrAmeriPrius @ Feb 13 2007, 08:29 PM) [snapback]389916[/snapback]</div>

You got it backwards... this society is founded by Christians....and there is a church on every corner.... it is the non believers that are trying to stamp out christianity because it makes them feel guilty with thier sin.

They feel like someone is "cramming" it down thier throat and want to stick their head in the sand and put thier fingers in thier ears, or find someone that will tell them that they are ok and God loves them just the way they are do they don't have to repent.

I have news for you... God hates sin... yes, he loves you and wants to save you from your sin.
If you are saved and are still in bondage to sin, then what did he save you from.... Hell?

Don't kid yourself.. if your God doesn't have power to save you from sin, he doesn't have power over hell either.

Living for God is righteousness, peace, and joy... Sin kills all of those.

Christians just want the freedom to worship without rebuttal in our "free" country.... but our "freedom" apparently offends some who are "free" not to worship.

If you don't want to worship God, then don't, but don't try to force your beliefs on those that do.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Feb 13 2007, 06:52 PM) [snapback]389739[/snapback]</div>

Read, windbags, read. I have said, time and time and time again, I believe in Christ, and in God.

I have what you conservative people call, a believers heart.


I have just grown beyond the need to believe 100% in a book that is flawed, obviously flawed, and unless you are blind, or unwilling to step outside of the self imposed blindness you have, you would see it as well.

You just quote the KJV; does that mean you disregard all the other versions?

And BTW:
Do You Know God? Get *FREE* Salvation Anytime! Just Pray!

I believe in that as well.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TJandGENESIS @ Feb 13 2007, 08:49 PM) [snapback]389936[/snapback]</div>

I know you say you believe, but you deny the power and you even deny his word... you tear out what you don't want and take the parts that suits your needs.

Your salvation is the only thing thats flawed.
I have tons of versions.... I'm sure you found one you prefer too!... NIV I presume... its the one with the most torn out!

Which version would you like this in?
NO matter how many versions, you still don't get it...
(2 Tim 3:4 KJV) Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
(2 Tim 3:5 KJV) Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
(2 Tim 3:6 KJV) For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
(2 Tim 3:7 KJV) Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

How about your favorite?
(2 Tim 3:4 NIV) treacherous, rash, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God--
(2 Tim 3:5 NIV) having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with them.
(2 Tim 3:6 NIV) They are the kind who worm their way into homes and gain control over weak-willed women, who are loaded down with sins and are swayed by all kinds of evil desires,
(2 Tim 3:7 NIV) always learning but never able to acknowledge the truth.

(2 Tim 3:4 NKJV) traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God,
(2 Tim 3:5 NKJV) having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away!
(2 Tim 3:6 NKJV) For of this sort are those who creep into households and make captives of gullible women loaded down with sins, led away by various lusts,
(2 Tim 3:7 NKJV) always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

(2 Tim 3:4 NRSV) treacherous, reckless, swollen with conceit, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God,
(2 Tim 3:5 NRSV) holding to the outward form of godliness but denying its power. Avoid them!
(2 Tim 3:6 NRSV) For among them are those who make their way into households and captivate silly women, overwhelmed by their sins and swayed by all kinds of desires,
(2 Tim 3:7 NRSV) who are always being instructed and can never arrive at a knowledge of the truth.

(2 Tim 3:3 NASB) unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, haters of good,
(2 Tim 3:4 NASB) treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God;
(2 Tim 3:5 NASB) holding to a form of godliness, although they have denied its power; and avoid such men as these.
(2 Tim 3:6 NASB) For among them are those who enter into households and captivate weak women weighed down with sins, led on by various impulses,
(2 Tim 3:7 NASB) always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

(2 Tim 3:3 NCV) They will not love others, will refuse to forgive, will gossip, and will not control themselves. They will be cruel, will hate what is good,
(2 Tim 3:4 NCV) will turn against their friends, and will do foolish things without thinking. They will be conceited, will love pleasure instead of God,
(2 Tim 3:5 NCV) and will act as if they serve God but will not have his power. Stay away from those people.
(2 Tim 3:6 NCV) Some of them go into homes and get control of silly women who are full of sin and are led by many evil desires.
(2 Tim 3:7 NCV) These women are always learning new teachings, but they are never able to understand the truth fully.

(2 Tim 3:3 DNT) without natural affection, implacable, slanderers, of unsubdued passions, savage, having no love for what is good,
(2 Tim 3:4 DNT) traitors, headlong, of vain pretensions, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God;
(2 Tim 3:5 DNT) having a form of piety but denying the power of it: and from these turn away.
(2 Tim 3:6 DNT) For of these are they who are getting into houses, and leading captive silly women, laden with sins, led by various lusts,
(2 Tim 3:7 DNT) always learning, and never able to come to <the> knowledge of <the> truth.

(2 Tim 3:3 ICB) They will not have love for others. They will refuse to forgive others and will speak bad things. They will not control themselves. They will be cruel and will hate what is good.
(2 Tim 3:4 ICB) In the last days, people will turn against their friends. They will do foolish things without thinking. They will be conceited and proud. They will love pleasure. They will not love God.
(2 Tim 3:5 ICB) They will continue to act as if they serve God, but they will not really serve God. Stay away from those people.
(2 Tim 3:6 ICB) Some of them go into homes and get control of weak women who are full of sin. They are led to sin by the many evil desires they have.
(2 Tim 3:7 ICB) Those women always try to learn new teachings, but they are never able to understand the truth fully.

(2 Tim 3:3 GWT) and lack normal affection for their families. They will refuse to make peace with anyone. They will be slanderous, lack self-control, be brutal, and have no love for what is good.
(2 Tim 3:4 GWT) They will be traitors. They will be reckless and conceited. They will love pleasure rather than God.
(2 Tim 3:5 GWT) They will appear to have a godly life, but they will not let its power change them. Stay away from such people.
(2 Tim 3:6 GWT) Some of these men go into homes and mislead weak-minded women who are burdened with sins and led by all kinds of desires.
(2 Tim 3:7 GWT) These women are always studying but are never able to recognize the truth.

(2 Tim 3:3 NLT) They will be unloving and unforgiving; they will slander others and have no self-control; they will be cruel and have no interest in what is good.
(2 Tim 3:4 NLT) They will betray their friends, be reckless, be puffed up with pride, and love pleasure rather than God.
(2 Tim 3:5 NLT) They will act as if they are religious, but they will reject the power that could make them godly. You must stay away from people like that.
(2 Tim 3:6 NLT) They are the kind who work their way into people's homes and win the confidence of vulnerable women who are burdened with the guilt of sin and controlled by many desires.
(2 Tim 3:7 NLT) Such women are forever following new teachings, but they never understand the truth.

(2 Tim 3:3 NNAS) unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, haters of good,
(2 Tim 3:4 NNAS) treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God,
(2 Tim 3:5 NNAS) holding to a form of godliness, although they have denied its power; Avoid such men as these.
(2 Tim 3:6 NNAS) For among them are those who enter into households and captivate weak women weighed down with sins, led on by various impulses,
(2 Tim 3:7 NNAS) always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

(2 Tim 3:3 YLT) without natural affection, implacable, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, not lovers of those who are good,
(2 Tim 3:4 YLT) traitors, heady, lofty, lovers of pleasure more than lovers of God,
(2 Tim 3:5 YLT) having a form of piety, and its power having denied; and from these be turning away,
(2 Tim 3:6 YLT) for of these there are those coming into the houses and leading captive the silly women, laden with sins, led away with desires manifold,
(2 Tim 3:7 YLT) always learning, and never to a knowledge of truth able to come,

Would you like that in Greek also?

 

I'm scared of the thought that I might be the antichrist... or whatever you call the worst heathen of yours. How do I tell and what can I do about it?