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Featured Dashboard Summary Sept 2017

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by bwilson4web, Oct 5, 2017.

  1. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    yeah, now i can only find $2,250. rebate. must have mis read it.
     
  2. cycledrum

    cycledrum PSOCSOASP

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    Ah, no 2018 Camry available for rent today. Current renter didn't tell Toyota his car is in shop for body work extra 5 days. Piercey Toyota only dealer renting 2018 Camry so far in Bay Area. So, we try again this Thursday.
     
  3. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    I take no joy in this: GM to Idle Volt Production

    As of Oct. 1, Chevrolet has roughly 6,000 Volts in inventory, a 107 day supply. That’s an increase of 10 days from one month ago.
    . . .
    It is worth noting that the Volt’s irritatingly-phonetically similar cousin, the Bolt, has been getting the lion’s share of GM’s EV marketing dollars since its introduction. With focus on the 200-plus-mile range of the Bolt EV, the Volt hybrid has all but disappeared from automotive news coverage. Its relative obscurity can’t be helping sales.

    The data supports the Bolt is taking Volt sales.

    Bob Wilson
     
  4. markabele

    markabele owner of PiP, then Leaf, then Model 3

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    Don't they make more margin on the Volt? Why would they push the Bolt so much?
     
  5. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Greater ZEV and CARB credits.
     
  6. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    if more people would rather have a 200 mile bev over a 3-400 mile phev, that really says something about the future of plug ins. gm might have hit the lottery if they are making a profit on them.
     
  7. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    I'm not sure the Volt is the best representation of a plug-in hybrid. Since we own two that bracket Volt performance, I can show what works and doesn't. For good measure, I'll include the Bolt:
    metric BMW i3-REx Volt Prius Prime Bolt
    1 kWh/100 mi 29 kWh 31 kWh 25 kWh 28 kWh
    2 EV range 72 53 25 238
    3 charges/100 mi 1.39 1.89 4.00 0.42
    4 charges/500 mi 6.95 9.45 20.0 2.1
    5 CCS yes no no yes
    6
    7 gal/100 mi 2.6 (P) 2.4 (R) 1.9 (R) 0
    8 gas range 78 377 615 0
    9 refuel/100 mi 1.28 0.26 0.16 n/a
    10 refuel/500 mi 6.4 1.3 0.8 n/a

    • Urban driving
      1. Bolt - longest charge range and CCS
      2. BMW i3-REx - long charge range and CCS
      3. Volt - shorter charge range, no CCS
      4. Prius Prime - shortest charge range, no CCS
    • Vacation driving, 500 miles (~7 hr @70 mph)
      1. Prius Prime - longest range, 1 tank, 10 min.
      2. Volt - long range, +2 tanks, 20 min.
      3. BMW i3-REx - shorter range, +6 tanks, 60 min.
      4. Bolt - +2 recharge sessions, 2 * (30 * 3) = 180 min.
    Bolt recharging source: Fast-charging a 2017 Chevrolet Bolt EV electric car

    We would have required a second 30-minute session, probably even a third, to get the battery back to more than 200 miles for any kind of road trip.

    Unfortunately, I read something else and though GM was cited, it is shared by every manufacturer who sells a fast DC charging equipped car:

    General Motors, however, has said flatly that it has no intention of putting any money toward national DC fast charging infrastructure.

    So the way I see it, the choices are:
    • Single car - BMW i3-REx, Volt, Prius Prime
    • Two cars, one gasser/diesel - Bolt
    Bob Wilson
     
    #47 bwilson4web, Oct 14, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2017
  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    agreed, but sales rule, nothing else really matters.
     
  9. cycledrum

    cycledrum PSOCSOASP

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    To Bob's post above.

    Single car, add - Clarity PHEV (coming soon), Bolt EV (rent gas car for vacation).
     
    bwilson4web likes this.
  10. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    and to add to that, in a few parts of the country, you're better off with a g4 hybrid or maybe the new hycam le.
     
  11. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    True but it also mirrors discussions in the BMW i3 forums when someone posts, "Which car should I get, BEV or REx?"
    • Pro-BEV - longer EV range; better acceleration; simpler drive train; lower cost.
    • Pro-REX - longest total range; higher resale prices; no second or rental car.
    I've also seen "no true Scotts man" snark about going to the pure electric, end game while ignoring the reality of long distance or vacation travel.

    Bob Wilson
     
  12. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    absolutely. on an individual basis, facts and data matter. personally, i'm not ready for any plug in on our annual trek to warmer climes.
    even this weekend, 200 miles to nyc, 48mpg on the hycam dash, no point to a plug.
     
  13. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    And I am OK with this to the point of showing our family is in the split camp:
    • 3-to-1 EV - BMW i3-REx for EV with a cross country capability
    • 1-to-3 EV - Prius Prime for cross country with EV capability
    Each car backs up the other and both have dynamic cruise control and collision avoidance, a hard requirement. It means we can safely go liability on both the BMW i3-REx and Prius Prime as each backs up the driving requirements of other.

    If it weren't for the VW diesel penalty, there would be no significant CCS charging network growth. GM has already said 'hell no, not us.' Hummm, perhaps future EPA fines (if there are going to be any) might be paid for with public charging stations?

    Bob Wilson

    ps. Minor changes to signature after BMW i3-REx reached 27k ODO.
     
  14. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    The environment isn't that simple. The Bolt is a brand new model, which recently reached every state. The Volt is a second generation going into its third year. The smart ones that want a Volt are waiting the periodic discounts that GM puts on it and all their cars. Then some might be opting for an even cheaper Malibu once they get to the dealer. Or the hatchback is more appealing than a sedan in this crossover market. A bigger factor could be that the majority buying either car already have another for long trips.

    As for GM not building CCS, this a bone for dealers that don't want a plug in future. Then the only thing about the Bolt that is GM is the glider. The drive train from the battery to the motor is all LG Chem.