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CR compared our former and current car

Discussion in 'Prime Main Forum (2017-2022)' started by bwilson4web, Jun 9, 2019.

  1. jmarkd7

    jmarkd7 Member

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    Yes, and it was only noticed by the 25% of of iPhone owners who use the phone function ;)
     
  2. jmarkd7

    jmarkd7 Member

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    Lately I've been thinking hard about a used Model S, or perhaps a Model 3. The AutoPilot would be a godsend for my 75-mile one-way commute, 60 of which is on a lonely boring interstate. Would appreciate Bob's or anyone's perspective on the utility of AutoPilot. My friend has a Model X and won't drive on I-95 in the DC area without it.
     
  3. SAronian

    SAronian Active Member

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    I can compare Tesla's Basic Autopilot TACC (Traffic Aware Cruise Control) to 2012 Prius Plug-in Advanced DRCC (Dynamic Radar Cruise Control) and BMW i3 Active Cruise Control with Stop & Go.

    Prius DRCC was pleasure on long freeway driving and ideal for highway driving when you want to follow with the traffic without constantly monitoring speed.

    BMW i3 Active Cruise Control is very similar to the Prius with the addition of full stop & go without driver input. During congested commutes with lots of stop-and-go, the response is a bit jerky and slow to respond. Which made it less useful.

    Autopilot TACC is much more responsive than the Prius out BMW. It drives with pacing that's more like a human and can easily handle a slow, stop-and-go commute. The addition of Autosteer is a big plus in reducing driver fatigue.

    Paying extra for Full Self Driving is questionable at this time, but with progress worth following.
     
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  4. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    The BMW i3-REx was my 'gateway' to EV travel and taught me many valuable lessons. Around town, it is a perfectly fine EV and the gas engine provides enough that I have no problem with doing +700 mi cross country trips. But at 2014, there was little trade-in value compared to the $18.3k trade-in for the 2017 Prius Prime Plus that still had some of the 3 year, manufacturer warranty left.

    Although I could and did use the Prius Prime when the BMW had to go to the service department "Spa," the 25 mi EV range meant it was a 3-stop car. The 3d stop means the next is a charger or burn some gas. It also had less interior space than the Model 3 and AutoPilot is awesome compared to TSS-P. The BMW has dynamic cruise control and reads speed limit signs but it has been doing that since 2014. It has not gotten any better.

    Bob Wilson
     
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  5. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    The "auto steer" which keeps the car in the lane is remarkable and gotten better. The first version would get a little too close to the center line in a right hand curve for my comfort but either I've grown used to it or it is doing a much better job of steering in a curve. Even with just the Tesla Lane Keep Assist, the car will steer back from crossing a lane marker and try to stay in the lane with a gentle 'ping-pong.' In contrast, TSS-P beeps and puts in steering input that will cross the lane to the other side. In contrast to these two, auto steer keeps the car centered even on dirt roads.

    The dynamic cruise control (Traffic Aware Cruise Control) is as good as the Toyota TSS-P and better than the "magic eye" of the BMW. The BMW can get confused driving into the sun; into a shadow over the road when headed towards the sun, and; occasionally false alert when there is a road sign over an overpass. Both TSS-P and AutoPilot share similar problems dealing with crossing traffic and testing has show that tractor trailers without aero-skirts can be missed by AutoPilot. I don't have the Prius Prime to see if shares this same blindness and haven't tested the BMW, yet.

    Autopilot does have some weaknesses which are easily recognized and handled. Exiting a divided highway often requires manual steering, not always, but frequently. Also, if one lane become two, the car isn't sure which lane to take so it acts like a "nervous student driver." If there is a leading car, it follow that car into its lane. Some angled intersections have lane lines that can fool auto steer to try and drive into the opposite lane. Also, there are crossing intersections in Mississippi where the absence of right-hand dashed lines but solid right edge lines can fool auto steer to 'split the difference' and try to drive into the opposite side ditch:
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    All of these are easily recognized once you've experienced them but there is no trainer. It can be scary to first time users. Surveys have shown about 80% of the Tesla owners trust AutoPilot while being alert and ~20% do not. Here is a short video from my dash cam showing some of the AutoPilot challenges:


    Regardless, AutoPilot has impressed me with:
    • Following the lanes in sheets of driving rain when even I was starting to have difficulty seeing the lane markers.
    • Handling "micro-sleep" events - Long story short, my wife's week in the hospital; my camping out in her room, and; forgetting my CPAP machine, led to five "micro-sleep" events returning home on a barren, two lane road. AutoPilot kept us from wandering into on coming traffic or driving into the ditch. IMHO, AutoPilot saved us from five accidents so I'm sold on the technology. TSS-P would have just beeped and steered us across the lane into the other side. BMW has no lane keeping technology.
    I've also tested "Navigate on AutoPilot" and it has a lot of promise. It will ask to change lanes to deal with slow traffic or approaching exit ramps. It does require driver confirmation of such changes. However, it is geo-limited to divided highways so it is not a universal solution, yet. AutoPilot works anytime I ask as long as it can see the lane markers and/or a curb.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #25 bwilson4web, Jun 11, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2019
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  6. smyles

    smyles Active Member

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    Just FYI, BMW does have lane keeping technology, albeit speed limited; it's disabled in US vehicles but can be enabled with some effort.
     
  7. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

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    This is the only thing I don't like about the constant improvement and lets skip model years philosophy of Tesla. Cross shopping used Teslas can be down right confusing (BTDT) on just what they can and can not do, what hidden hardware allows this software upgrade, free supercharging if you bought this quarter, etc. When one is looking at many samples, its very confusing. Just make sure to do your due diligence (trust but verify).

    GOOD LUCK!
     
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  8. jmarkd7

    jmarkd7 Member

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    Agree- very hard to follow. My rough understanding is for the Model S, AutoPiliot 1.0 hardware is in 2014-16 and late 2016 builds and on have AutoPilot 2.0 hardware. All Model 3s have AutoPilot 2.0. Model X is hella expensive so I don't know.
     
  9. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    In theory, there should be an easy fix from Tesla by having a searchable VIN database available.
     
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