Colder weather has zapped my mileage to 44mpg

+100. I see IndyKing mentioning 75 to 80 mph. That's the problem.

IndyKing: If one is comparing 38 mpg to 28 mpg, that's still a 36% improvement. If comparing 40 mpg to 28, that's a 43% improvement.

Since this is such a long thread that I haven't followed closely since I don't have a Gen III, have we gone over your tire pressure? Also, since the EPA test has come up, I know some people have pointed you to some details about the EPA test. Has anyone also pointed you to the Car and Driver article I mentioned at http://priuschat.com/forums/other-c...th-about-epa-city-highway-mpg-estimates.html?

If you look at the EPA's schedule, in the old highway test, the lab temp is 68 to 86 F and the top speed is 60 mph w/an average of 48.3 mph. The additional "high speed" test has a top speed of 80 mph, but the average is only 48.4 mph w/the same temps.

The new cold test is a city test at 20 F, but max speed is only 56 mph and average speed is only 21.2 mph.

 

Our 2010 mileage has been dropping ever since the temperatures got out of the 100-90 degree range. Lately it has been cool and damp - really damp. The car is showing around 44 mpg instead of the 50 we had been getting. I'll be curious to see what happens in May when we get back over 90 degrees again.

 

Hi Cwerdna... I know all of that and some has been discussed here as well. Let me make it clear once again that the source for my frustration with my Prius MPG is that none of my 2 most recent cars (Odyssey and CR-V) has performed bellow estimated EPA MPG even in the most adverse conditions. This is NOT about “driving too fast in the hwy is killing my mileage”. I actually usually drove/drive the CR-V or Odyssey even faster than the Prius but they still manage to keep always at or above EPA estimates. I believe the EPA hwy estimate for my Odyssey is 24-25. Frankly I don't know what I have to do to get bellow that with it in the hwy. My family took a short trip to a ski resort this weekend with the car load with stuff and people, very heavy and very cold... My trip MPG was 26. Yet, my Prius is performing way bellow EPA now in similar situations. I’m now finding my Prius to do only 10-12 MPG better than my previous CR-V in the hwy, which is absolutely ridiculous. Clearly, winter is a killer for good MPG in the Prius compared to rather small hits in other cars with large non-hybrid engines. Because of the winter hit, my lifetime MPG has got bellow to EPA estimates as well. That's nonsense for a car whose major selling point is the MPG! What a crock of baloney! I may proceed with the darn grill blocking…

 

Read what the window-sticker actually says. Then tell us what you hope to achieve by complaining about your misunderstanding to us.

We've been providing information about the seasonal affects on MPG. So it's not like you didn't have ample opportunity to learn about this prior to purchase.

As was already pointed out, your annual average MPG will be impressive anyway. The results from summer offset the drop in winter.
.

 

I don't understand... what is the point of trying to justify the wimpy MPG readings in the Prius during the winter? The hit is outrageous, period. I think I made myself clear, but, if not, I’m repeating: I have never had problems to keep up with EPA estimates in my other cars, but my Prius MPG is considerably low than the 48 hwy rating. I don’t care about the little letter disclaimer that says that it can vary from 40 to whatever, I'm talking about the big bold EPA MPG number, that's the one my cars have always been able to keep up with. Frankly, my Prius lately has not been able to keep up even with the minimal MPG in the small letter disclaimer for that matter... it says 40 but my last hwy trip revealed 38. The way things are looking, my summer MPG will not be able to offset the gigantic winter hit since winter where I drive last a good 4-5 months… but wait, there is hope… I’m now sold on the grill blocking thing…

 

WHAT DO YOU HOPE TO ACHIEVE BY COMPLAINING HERE ?

Since 2003, we've been pointing out the affects of climate. Annual average balances out the seasonal ups & downs. So, it all works out anyway.
.

 

The Prius is not "another" vehicle in many ways including MPG behavior. I have been able to get significantly over EPA numbers in the summer and now will get significantly lower numbers in the winter. I am not complaining as it goes with the territory of a hybrid in 2009/2010. Keep in mind the EPA tests were not designed with hybrids and the factors they introduce, in mind. Maybe in 10 years they will introduce winter and summer MPG numbers, along with elevation change numbers, passenger and cargo weight, wind direction and speed numbers, etc. It could go on and on.

 

.


.

 

What do I wish to achieve? Ask yourself, what do you hope when complaining about something you don't like? Don’t you ever complaint? Think about it. Maybe, factors like 1-this is a forum made for Prius crowds and 2-we are not talking about a simple gadget, but a 30K car.

Maybe, both have huge influences in the responses here? Personally, I’m not trying to achieve anything… I’m just pointing out what the car really is IMHO, instead of turning my back to it with the thought “oh well the MPG hit in the winter is huge, so what… I still like my car”… not my kind of attitude, sorry.

 

After my experience I would strongly encourage summer and winter estimates for the Prius... of course, this is not Toyota's fault... they are simply playing the game in their advantage... if EPA don't have such attitude to make the distinction between winter and summer why would they... or does anybody wonder why the Prius was released to market shortly before summer?

 

Is an engine block heater next?

Those of us who have had a Prius before don't wonder.

Wayne

 

The summer-winter MPG variance is a condition experienced by all
Prius owners who live where there are significant summer-winter
temperature differences.

Dissatisfaction with this reality may also stem from when in the
annual cycle a Prius was purchased. For those of us who bought in
mid-winter, the first months of operation were a real struggle.
Everything conspired to keep our MPGs low:
* low temps, rain/snow
* "winter" gas
* new tires
* ICE "break-in" issues
* operator learning curve

But as we learned and the weather moderated, MPGs gradually got
better to our continuing pleasure. By the first summer we were in high
cotton with EPA+ MPGs. :cheer2:

Winter buyers regret the inevitable return of lower winter MPGs. But
you can fight back and do better than last year, and the year before:
* grill block
* block heater
* ScanGauge
* better understanding of HSD operation
* better understanding of how to minimize on-the-road MPG killing
conditions.

So, yeah, The Prius gets eye-popping FE/MPGs in a relatively narrow
range of conditions, especially temperature. So what? It nearly always
does better than any other ICE-based vehicle on the market. :rockon:

Get over it, save $$, pollute less, move on, get a life...

or a Tesla...

or wait for the Leaf/Think/i-MiEV

 

It's hard to get over it when you know there are better, cheaper, better quality alternatives if you really want to save money... alternatives that will give you the normal winter MPG drop... saving money with the Prius is common misconception... that's a privilege very few owners have...

 

The issue here isn't why the Prus has a winter MPG drop.

The issue for all the rest of the non-hybrid vehicles is:
Why don't they experience an equivalent warm weather MPG increase?

I has something to do with wasted BTUs, calories... fuel... money.

It would appear that non-hybrids are maximized for, and locked into, cold
weather operating parameters/algorithms.
(Admittedly an overly simplistic, inside-out perspective.)

 

I don't know Wayne... it looks complicated from my quick research... besides, it has become clearer to me that this whole set of actions to prevent winter MPG drop in the Prius seems more like a hobby than a cost effect initiative...

 

EBH may not be cost effective for you and for many others, plus you have to plug & unplug, etc.

But the $5 of foam is cost effective for sure.

 

You should blame the EPA and their test methodology then. The rating is only as good as the test. You are NOT driving the car on a dyno in a lab at specific temperatures. You are not driving it on a specific schedule that includes cycles w/average speeds of 48.3 or 48.4 mph and lower (vs. 75 or 80 mph). You are NOT measuring tailpipe emissions but rather fuel usage. Perhaps you should read Your Mileage Will Still Vary and Many Factors Affect MPG.

The 2010 Prius starts out at a bit over $22K. Calling it a "30K car" is a stretch as higher equipment levels don't help w/fuel economy.

Exactly!

 

The cheapest Prius you can buy right now costs $23350 before taxes (all them comes with floor mats). After taxes in IN, the cheaper Prius costs $24984.5 not any close to 22K, but a lot more close to 25K.

OK, I realize 30K was an exaggeration because FE does not depend on the trim level, but 25K is pretty darn realistic. You can buy almost 2 brand new cars with that money (Accent or Rio) or a very loaded 2010 Hyundai Sonata...

 

I definitively agree. What I do not agree; however, is trying to blame the Prius wimpy winter MPG on EPA's test inaccuracy. That is just like hiding the sun with a sifter (if you know what I mean). Have the Prius MPG hit be proportionally affected similarly to non-hybrids in the winter, then we could blame EPA, but that’s not the case at all! As inaccurate EPA estimates are (and I agree with their inconsistencies), they predict relatively well the average MPG of any car other than the Prius despite of the winter (I cannot speak for the entire hybrid segment).

 

Since when is 44 wimpy?

Virtually all other 2010 vehicles, including hybrids, cannot do that at their best.
.