Bird flu and cats

Discussion in 'Environmental Discussion' started by bwilson4web, Dec 26, 2024.

  1. frodoz737

    frodoz737 Top Wrench

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    ...lessons learned from COVID? :rolleyes:
     
  2. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    Those who have ever inhaled a lot of smoke (other than by voluntary tobacco-ing) know that snot and boogers are black afterwards. This is not a trivial observation. The nasal-sinus 'apparatus' is effective at particle capture, and mucus flows outwards.

    But also imperfect. Particles 2.5 microns and smaller (PM 2.5) aerodynamically resist capture and continue to lung surfaces where biochemical interactions can lead to medical troubles.

    Viruses are far smaller than that, but are carried in air by larger aerosol droplets. Sneezing and coughing being the other 'clear keys' for nose and lung respectively. So face masks have a rather easy task, made less effective by edge-leakage. I call that the biggest thing to avoid for you or seeing in mask-wearers around you.

    ==
    For me, masks against these biohazards are good enough if their holes are small (i.e., not a scarf) and not edge leaky. Others seek better exclusion of smaller particles. Not my bidness.

    ==
    Things are at low level of concern here now, but I still mask up in in crowds (especially those face naked), on buses and similar, and particularly on elevators. They suck, or rather, they don't, being unventilated.
     
  3. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    H5N1 infections surely occur via fomite ingestion, and COVID thread readers know what that is. I know of no studies of aerosols in 'hot' settings such as milk-cow barns and egg-chicken houses (I guess they are not called barns). ~Easy to study: collect air with effective filters and do DNA sequencing. This would not be fully informative. Second stage feeds air filters to mice to test for infectivity.
     
  4. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    If any wish to learn lessons from COVID, much published literature awaits your attention. Read, draw your conclusions, and share them with us here.
     
  5. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    :rolleyes: is a small contribution.
     
  6. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    My understanding is fecal matter has been the transfer mechanism of bird flu to our species. Since late December, I have observed an increase of face mask usage when out. Wednesday, I'll drive to a favorite casino handling community chips and dice.

    Thursday, I'll drive the rest of the way to Port Isabel for the next Starship launch. Then I'll drive home, possibly via another casino and the solar contractor:
    upload_2025-1-5_22-55-28.png
    This is the latest CDC flu map with my route overlayed. This includes a lot of time passing through @frodoz737 state, Texas, that is notorious for anti-mask, anti-vaccination, anti-medical care, and anti-knowledge. Yes, I will have my 5.56 answer (see "Range Time" ) for any road-rage incidents.

    Just taking reasonable precautions against a public health risk using ancient technology:
    upload_2025-1-5_23-11-50.png

    In 1867, the British surgeon Joseph Lister postulated that wound disease was caused by the germs of the microscopically small living entities that Louis Pasteur had recently described. Lister suggested eliminating germs through the use of antiseptic substances. But in the 1880s, a new generation of surgeons devised the strategy of asepsis that aimed to stop germs from entering wounds in the first place. This was a risky strategy. Hands, instruments, even the operator's exhalations were suspect now.

    Johann Mikulicz, head of the surgery department of the University of Breslau (now Wroclaw, Poland) started working with the local bacteriologist Carl Flügge, who had shown experimentally that respiratory droplets carried culturable bacteria. In response to these findings, Mikulicz started to wear a face mask in 1897, which he described as “a piece of gauze tied by two strings to the cap, and sweeping across the face so as to cover the nose and mouth and beard”. In Paris, the surgeon Paul Berger also began wearing a mask in the operating room the same year. The face mask stood for a strategy of infection control that focused on keeping all germs away, as opposed to killing them with chemicals. Such a narrowly targeted strategy was not uncontroversial.

    The physician Alexander Fraenkel in Berlin, for example, was sceptical about the “whole surgical costume with a bonnet, mouth mask and veil, devised under the slogan of total wound sterility”. However, masks became increasingly widespread. A study of more than 1000 photographs of surgeons in operating rooms in US and European hospitals between 1863 and 1969 indicated that by1923 over two-thirds of them wore masks and by 1935 most of them were using masks.

    Conspiracists are found in internet postings by those who want to kill Americans.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #46 bwilson4web, Jan 6, 2025 at 12:07 AM
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2025 at 1:29 AM
  7. frodoz737

    frodoz737 Top Wrench

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    I have a leftover box of masks I can give you Bob. Hell, I might even have a box of nitrile gloves and a hazmat suit in the garage I can throw in.

    You will have to divert your trip through DFW if you want them though.

    Personally...I've carried a .45 since I was 18...and I just turned 66.

    YMMV
     
    #47 frodoz737, Jan 6, 2025 at 4:32 PM
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2025 at 3:18 AM
  8. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    As for the unused mask, glove, and gown inventory, why did @frodoz737 keep it?

    I gave my dust masks away and use gloves for cleaning toilets and dog poo.

    Fort Worth was where I picked up my first Prius, a Gen 1, in October 2005 and drove it home to Huntsville. Driving with traffic on the Texas Interstate measured ~37 MPG. My first thought, "Is this Prius broke?" But I knew the EPA measured 52 MPG with a relatively slower, highway speed.

    I have an affinity for empirical science and engineering. So I broke the rest of the trip into segments:
    • 55 mph (it was after sunset) - 56 MPG
    • 65 mph - 52 MPG
    • 75 mph - 46 MPG
    Turns out there is a "knee in the curve" between 65 and 70 mph. Drive at or below 65, the Gen 1 gave 52 MPG. At higher speeds, the MPG rapidly fell off due a latent design defect. It was corrected in the later Prius generations.

    So I already have excellent N95 masks, 3M model 8511, to deal with cough generated aerosols. As for contaminated chips and money, ordinary hand washing works although it is not clear that contact transfer is an effective transfer relative to inhalation of cough generated aerosols.

    As for the road rage, weapon of choice, Wyatt Earp said:
    • “No wise man ever took a handgun to a gunfight.”
    • “Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything. You must learn to be slow in a hurry”
    I'm hoping an emotional road rager will carry the heaviest caliber pistol with magnum rounds their Visa can buy. Seeing my rifle, they should become even more excited and hopefully shoot as fast as possible. I'll be as low as possible deliberately firing, fast flat trajectory, varmint rounds that explosively expand about an inch inside what ever they hit.

    Bob Wilson
     
  9. frodoz737

    frodoz737 Top Wrench

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    Speaking first person...

    Masks were "mandated" at work, as were the shots...until dot gov lost the lawsuit. Gloves and suits...because I fix sh-t for a living. I doubt you deal much with Skydrol, Jet A and Dinitrol though.
     
  10. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Fortunately, I only deal with toilet and dog poo cleanup.

    When I was a supervisor, I tracked the CDC flu reports to know when absences would occur and projects would need my help. It never occurred to me to push for vaccinations as I figured the absence was its own reward and punishment.

    I follow the rule of three:
    • Someone presents nonsense - I share my opinion openly
    • Someone continues to present nonsense - I approach them privately to go over technical details
      • Don't worry about a PM from me. I only do this with coworkers and blood kin
    • Someone continues their nonsense - I would often work like heck, in private, to craft a fix
      • See "range time"
    So I keep up with my vaccinations, buy quality protective masks, practice good hygiene and take care around infected populations.

    One thing I don't understand is why anyone would advocate against vaccinations, using quality masks, and not be alert to transmissible infections in our communities?
    • Better to be silent and thought the fool than open one's mouth and remove all doubt.
    One irony is seeing posts about massive vitamin and food additives to prevent or address health care ... food as medicine. Yet I buy lemons and squeeze them into club soda for a true, sugar free beverage. Eating out, I order club soda and a side of lemon slices that I eat. I just like sugar free, lemon and carbonated water.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #50 bwilson4web, Jan 7, 2025 at 4:10 AM
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2025 at 4:23 AM
  11. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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  12. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    My go to:
    IMG_0149.jpeg
    looks a little goofy, but fits well. Get some stares and infrequent comments from inconsiderate and sometimes aggressive humans, but I’m more concerned with my health
     
  13. frodoz737

    frodoz737 Top Wrench

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    Good...ya'll do ya'll. Just don't try to force mandates (which failed) on others like the powers that be did with COVID...for the latest new flu.
     
  14. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Here is one not behind a paywall:
    What to know about the first bird flu–related death in the U.S.

    The patient, a Louisiana man over the age of 65 who had underlying medical conditions, contracted the virus from a backyard flock and wild birds, the Louisiana Department of Health noted in reporting his death January 6.
    ...
    The patient, the country’s first severe case, was hospitalized with respiratory symptoms in December, and state health officials reported he had highly pathogenic avian influenza, or H5N1, on December 13.
    ...
    Genetic analyses of viral specimens from the Louisiana patient showed that he had caught what’s called the D1.1 virus subtype, which has been circulating in poultry and wild birds in the United States. A 13-year-old girl in British Columbia, Canada, hospitalized with critical illness from bird flu in November, also had this version of the virus. She no longer needs intensive support but remains hospitalized. Another virus subtype, called B3.13, is spreading primarily in dairy cows.

    I'll be in New Orleans Thursday for a meeting with my contractor then South to Starbase for the 'at risk' Starship launch. Weather looking dodgy. Will take extra ammo and investigate hog hunting options. Possibly see if I can pick up some already processed.

    Bob Wilson