4th generation coming 2015!

Other possibilities for the range extender could be alternate fueled ICE or an Al-air battery.

 

Sure...there are plenty of ways to skin this cat. My point was that there is a path for hydrogen to be practical in terms of both cost and efficiency.

 

Toyota only deals in half-truths...otherwise they wouldn't be pushing hydrogen for the same reason (affordability).

Lee's hybrid proposition is interesting but isn't accounting for the paucity of the hydrogen infracture and the associated costs to rectify that nationwide. Installing superchargers comparatively is orders of magnitude cheaper.

 

The "power grid" is nation-wide; the "hydrogen grid" is basically non-existant.

 

There is a path. The issue is in forcing a path now.

CARB is giving FCV, non-plugin, the most ZEV credits, and building refueling stations. PHVs, which could actually do more to reduce pollution in Ca cities than the few FCVs that will end up on the road, get none.

 

Fortunately, it's ridiculously easy to convert one into the other using on-site electrolysis.

 

Superchargers are harder than you think.

Let's say you need the ability to charge eight cars at a time for peak times of the week. That means you need to be able to supply about 1MW. You'll need a 1.5MW transformer and supply line for that, and that likely means medium voltage from the medium voltage (13.8kV or so) distribution grid.

With hydrogen, you can (and will) store it for later. Therefore, you don't need to meet the peak demand, only the average demand. If the peak demand is eight cars for electric, it's probably only 1-2 cars for hydrogen because the refueling is 10 times faster (or more). Further, the average is probably less than the equivalent of one car at a supercharger station when you average for 24/7. That means a 75kW electrolyzer can probably manage to keep up with average demand, and that's the sort of thing available on a low-voltage (480V) distribution line common at most existing commercial establishments such as gas stations and stores.

 

folks, can someone start a new thread and move this argument out of the 4th gen prius thread please? i think we can all agree it won't be a bev or fcv.

 

I totally agree!!
Every time i see a new posting here, i think/hope that there is real news about the Prius 4. And maybe even Doug or Erica....

 

we're only a few months away...

 

All I can think is they're beavering away, working on the design of that new front grill. And I'm getting really conscious of all the bs design elements currently popular. Noticed this on our morning walk with the dog. To be kind, MAYBE some level of the car actually puts something useful in place of this insert. It's some sort of Mazda SUV:

 

If you don't mind the greater losses.

 

I was speaking to a guy at a wedding yesterday (he knows very little about cars) and he said that he really doesn't know when the gen4 Prius is arriving and 99.9% of the population don't know either. I think that he's right

 

OK so we have a date now from Green car report, end of 2015. At least we don't have so much to wait. You don't need to argue Hybrid vs BEV, both will win

 

And on-site compression/cryo cooling and containment too? Gasoline stations don't cryo anything but beer (wink,wink).

 

Those front side holes used in today's styling are just to "simulate" front brake cooling ducts used in racing. That's why if you buy the upper level trim packages of some vehicles they just shove useless fog lights in there. Same with the Prius.

 

Peak demand needs aside, you don't need as many superchargers as you would need hydrogen filling stations [I read something recently about a home hydrogen generator or the like (with electrolysis?), but that would be a scary thing to have in a garage ] thanks to home charging. An EV with 200+ miles of range isn't far away!

 

It's here right now! The new Tesla Model S 70D is EPA rated 240 miles, standard AWD and starts at $75k.

Tesla Motors | Premium Electric Vehicles

 

Well the 41st Toyota Long Beach Grand Prix was held today, and on display were all current 2015 Prii, no hints of any new 2016. It was neat to see a Prius lap the course during the Parade of Exotics cars at the end of the day! Any one else attend the show? I know TORC was in attendance and some members of Priuschat!