100+ MPG Prius in 2009 w/ price cut by 20-30%

Keep in mind that this test was done in Japan and achieved 82 miles per U.S. gallon. Also, keep in mind that the Japanese test cycle is a joke and replicates nothing in the real world. This makes the EPA test seem conservative.

The average speed of the Japanese test is 14.8 mph and the max speed is 43.5. The average speed for EPA hwy is 48.2 with the max at 59.9.
The average speed for EPA city is 19.5 and the max speed is 56.7. Also, the rate of acceleration for Japanese test is 1.78 mph/second while the EPA rate of acceleration is 3.3 for city and hwy.

So, reports of 94 mpg for next vehicle relates to Japanese cycle. Assuming the ratio of Japanese to EPA test holds us, the expected EPA combined would be 63 mpg.

Of course, there may be differences between the Japanese Prius and the American one, in which case we would expect even less that 63mpg for the next American version.

I must say I was really excited when I first heard about a future Prius making 94 mpg. I assumed that it was a PHEV. 63 mpg seems doable, however and would be welcome if not as exciting as I orginally thought.

None of this was made clear in the article.

I heard this same topic brought up on tech talk on the radio, however they did not mention the above statement.. I would lean more to the above statement as being closer to fact..

 

One 'fact' we can corroborate was a statement by Toyota's Wantabe saying that the Prius will have a 9 mile plug-in range. From what I've read, it seems that this may be the most accurate statement about the '09 Prius considering who the rumor is coming from.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mirza @ Apr 14 2006, 10:18 AM) [snapback]239759[/snapback]</div>

9 miles eh?... hay, thats way better than a sharp stick in the eye!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(windstrings @ Apr 14 2006, 01:10 PM) [snapback]239834[/snapback]</div>

Let's see - I live six miles from work and, if I ask nicely, I bet I could get the parking space next to that power outlet on the fourth floor of the parking structure reserved for me and recharge while I am there. So that would mean an all-electric commute instead of a commute where the Prius ICE warm-up cycle was running more than half the time. I'm in. Well, depending on how much extra it costs.

I'd love to see the source on the above Wantabe quote - everything I have read indicates that Toyota is definately not planning on adding plugin capability to the next Prius.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jef @ Apr 14 2006, 05:16 PM) [snapback]239867[/snapback]</div>

Yeah thats the ticket!, you could plug in at work & have them bill you later

I think the plug in option is neat, but I would hope you could go farther than 9 miles and faster than 30 mph to most this plug in idea sounds like the iceing on the cake....

I just think there would be a better way to regenerate the batteries other than plugging in at home & at work, for a little extra ev time. Maybe do the solar roof panel thing but instead of it recharging the aux batt, it could recharge the hybrid batt pack. Charge while you drive..

 

Shinichi Abe, head of Toyota's hybrid division, said that ~ I mixed the statement up with Watabe (sp?).

"Toyota is working on plans for "plug-ins" for the battery from the grid at fuel stations, with future hybrids carrying a traditional power-point for domestic appliances to be used outside the home. Mr Abe said the next Prius model will be able to do a nine-mile commute to work without using any petrol or diesel."

http://business.guardian.co.uk/story/0,,1743417,00.html

 

"Toyota is working on plans for "plug-ins" for the battery from the grid at fuel stations, with future hybrids carrying a traditional power-point for domestic appliances to be used outside the home. Mr Abe said the next Prius model will be able to do a nine-mile commute to work without using any petrol or diesel."

Diesel? Prius comes in a diesel????

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priusguy04 @ Apr 14 2006, 03:27 PM) [snapback]239895[/snapback]</div>

there must be something wrong with thier numbers.... in one breath they say it will be able to go farther and "faster", but then knock it down to 30mph?

We go faster than that now....

 

I suspect new Prius will have 10%-15% better mpg, 1-2 secs off 0-60 time, greater EV range. Current prius can do 40 kmh with EV button, while new one will do 50 kmh. It might not mean a lot, but 50kmh is enough for example for my city driving while 40kmh is just a tad too slow. They will probably improve winter mpg as well.

What is there not to like? To expect anything substantially better, is to dream. They will improve batteries, motors, generators and petrol engine but Prius is already very efficient vehicle.

I have a lot of experience with high tech diesels and on highway, even small 1.4l diesels from Yaris can not do better than 65-70 mpg, which is less than 10% better than current Prius, with a lot smaller and slower vehicle.

 

Current prius can do 40 kmh with EV button, while new one will do 50 kmh. It might not mean a lot, but 50kmh is enough for example for my city driving while 40kmh is just a tad too slow. They will probably improve winter mpg as well.

Oh darnit Ive been out playing in the round up again , I cant remember what the converision is from kh to mph.....

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priusguy04 @ Apr 15 2006, 02:46 PM) [snapback]240227[/snapback]</div>

See http://home.flash.net/~lorint/lorin/convert.htm

Something wrong with these numbers!
Current prius does 50 kmh with ev button. This is 31 mph
40 kmh is almost 25 mph So hopefully the new one will do EV way beyond that, and better than our current stealth limit of 42 mph.

As for winter mpg it should be closer to summer mpg if they keep the engine warm somehow better than they do now. The battery switch to Lithium should take care of the rest of our current winter problems where the NiMH can almost shutdown. There should only remain some warm up penalty and the lower gasoline energy of winter fuel.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Begreen @ Apr 13 2006, 09:20 PM) [snapback]239569[/snapback]</div>

Brillant! This was an often used marketing strategy in the earlier days of computers. M$ would often announce some type of software/vaporware very early in the product cycle to staunch sales of competing software.

Wildkow

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Apr 14 2006, 11:12 PM) [snapback]240093[/snapback]</div>

WHO knows not of the EV button? maybe Edmonds doesn't, but the EV button is standard in Japan.

In (forced) EV mode I can go 33 mph, and it kicks out when it goes to 34. If the car goes electric on its own, I can go 42 mph. 34 is a bit slow for normal full-time city driving. With a lot of surface roads here having a 45-mph limit, 45 is what I'd want for a top EV speed.

The fact that the Edmonds article thinks that 30 mph is an improvement, shows that they don't know what they are talking about.

But a 9-mile plug-in range would go a long ways toward extending mileage, because it's precisely those short trips that are the mileage killer. Anyone with a short enough commute would almost have an electric car, and the rest of us would avoid that mpg-hit from the 4- or 5-mile trips to the grocery store. But I hope that 9-mile EV range comes with a positive EV switch, that won't start the engine any time I press too hard on the accelerator.

Regardless, I think we can expect big improvements, and if I get a letter telling me that as a "legacy" owner I get first crack at the new model, I'll put down my deposit the moment they let me.

 

I would offer a guess that the Japanese Prius might have mileage/efficiency increases from not
having to comply with US emissions & safety requirements. (Lower weight & no catalytic
converter to have to warm-up).

 

The Japanese 10-15 mode test is done just after warming up.
The US EPA test is done after cooling down over night.

Ken@Japan

 

If we assume that the 40 km/l target (95 US mpg) is for the Japanese mode test, and that the EPA test would probably give more like 63 mpg (as suggested above) for the new Prius....

....then I think that the stated mpg figure does not include the benefit of plugging-in - because how on earth could you standardise for this input?

Therefore owners that plug-in a lot and who use their vehicles for many short trips under 9 miles will see far greater than 63 mpg.

Imagine someone who travels 12,000 miles per year. With an 8 mile commute each way, charging up at work, they use no gasoline at all for that part of their transport needs. So that's 4,200 miles from their annual 12,000 miles gasoline usage gone just like that.

The remaining longer trips will still benefit from another 9 miles per trip gasoline reduction, so assuming two of these per week that's another 1,000 miles per year in EV mode. Already, that's 5,200 miles per year in EV mode, just from charging up at every opportunity.

So what would have been 190 gallons of gasoline used at 63 mpg for all 12,000 miles becomes only 108 gallons used because only 6,800 miles were traveled with the gasoline engine on. Equivalent mpg is therefore 12,000 miles / 108 gallons = 110 mpg US (plus whatever electricity you used).

If you get relatively cheap electricity, that could save a heck of a lot from your annual motoring costs.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tempus @ Apr 13 2006, 05:42 PM) [snapback]239485[/snapback]</div>

It's not that they can't buy a Prius - it's that they can't fit in one! :lol: