Your Mileage May Vary - Bad News for Hybrids

It's always bothered me that a lot of drivers drive too fast and otherwise as inefficiently as possible so rather than figuring out what they're doing wrong and working to correct their driving habits to bring their mpg in line with the official numbers, they just say that the official numbers are wrong. Perhaps the official numbers could also include a second set of mpg projections. Call that set of numbers the if-you-drive-like-a-jerk fuel economy information.

 

Well, it is supposed to be the average....even if "average" means "jerk"..

 

Why can't they just say...this is the mileage you would get if you drive in a manner to achieve good mileage? I always get the numbers posted on the window sticker. People who don't get it should ask themselves "why" and be willing to change the way they drive if they want to get those numbers.

 

But... But... But...

This is the land of the Free... Free to be stupid.

Just look at the court decision and the lady in the McDonald's coffee lawsuit!!!!

Even if they caused the problem, it is someone else's fault.

 

I still get 44 mpg at 85 mph!

 

We know these things because our cars place the evidence of bad driving habits right in front of our eyes. We need to improve our driving skills so that our cars will perform to the best of their ability then we can brag about our mpg's, irritate our non-hybrid friends and just feel all that much better about having a cool car.

Those that continue to waste fuel, speed, etc. don't want to see the evidence of what they do. They take pride in speeding ahead of us only to arrive at the same destination 60 seconds earlier. They like to bemoan the price of gas but continue their wasteful ways, buying cheaper cereal, turning down the heat to 65 in the house.

 

Unfortunately, the real McDonald's coffee story gets lost in the hype. For a more reasoned explanation than the usual "frivilous lawsuits" sound bite, see:

http://caoc.com/CA/index.cfm?event=showPage&pg=facts

 

As usual, it is assumed that hybrids take a bigger "hit" with the new system (and between reality and the current sticker), when in fact there is no difference if you count it the proper way - percentage! Numbers mean very little, it is the percentage that counts, and it appears that the percentage difference is the same across the board, so why would hybrids be singled out as "losing more?"

 

One of the biggest features of the Prius is the ability to get higher fuel mileage than any other vehicle (except the Insight) - that's why hybrids are such an attention getting target for this subject.

 

But even the corvette got crampy mileage in the hands of Car and Driver. Car and Driver got 12mpg out of it. I think the EPA averages were something like 19/27. But no one complains because it is the corvette. And it does not sell paper when someone says corvette does not get EPA averages..

 

Wow. I still say bull. Stats can be turned into anything you want it to say. 700 cases in 10 years of reported coffee burns. How many cups of coffee did McDonalds served in ten years? If McDonalds served 1 Million cup a day... that is 3.65 Billion cups of coffee. 700/3.65B = 0.0000192%. That is even less than the percentage of Prius died on the road.

As for the lady, it is her fault to put the coffee between her leg.

As far as hot coffee being too hot.... Any coffee shops can produce such hot coffee to due this damage. Maybe I should go to my company breakroom and pour some coffee on myself to make a few bucks.

It is a cause and effect. If we don't do the stupid thing to begin with, we should not be complaining about it at the end of the day. Either putting hot coffee on your lap, or driving a prius (any car) above 55mph as tested... and then go complain to others that it was not supposed to happen. ONLY IN AMERICA.

 

I had to take the car out for early (cold again ) driving today, and the tank mpg dropped below 67 by the time I returned home.

DAMN the EPA.

 

Look at the bright side. Now we will be able to brag at how we BEAT the EPA!

 

The only thing that really concerns me about the new EPA rules... I read somewhere that part of the new approach is to deduct some percentage of milage based on EPA's projections of how that car would fare in the "real world." In other words -- a vehicle-specific "fudge factor."

If this is true, it opens up the EPA test to gross manipulation. It means we won't be able to accurately compare vehicles because some have higher others have lower fudge factors. I'm going out on a limb here, but I predict American car makers will suddenly appear to have much more competitive milage figures...

 

OK here is an alternate view to what seems like a back slap at hybrids. Most here will meet, or exceed by a large margin, the new EPA standards.

Nothing will change in our individual results except that the 'EPA combined ratings' might be 44 mpg instead of 55 mpg. Nearly every Prius owner exceeds this rating even in winter.

 

darrelld you are right, its all percentages. and hybrids will seemingly get hit harder because the mileage WILL drop more, but whether its 25 to 23 mpg or 50 to 46 mpg, its all the same, hybrids kicked butt before the change and will kick butt afterwards.

 

OK, I just read the preamble to the proposed rule change. It's as bad as I thought.

The governemt makes its case by pointing to Consumer Reports and AAA and showing they they showed lower milage for hybrids. (Gov't can only afford bad statisticians I guess.)

Next, they point out that they can change the actual tests themselves, since the U.S. laws are written around the CAFE standards, which are the basis of their numbers, too. So instead, they intend to cook the numbers by including results from the air quality tests.

What are these tests?

One simulates aggressive driving at 80 mph, with acceleration of greater than 8 mph/sec -- a figure our car can achieve only when floored. Another simulates 95 deg. high-humidity weather with the A/C on full blast.

The plan is to revise the actual data (i.e. fudge) the fuel economy of each car based on its performance on these tests.

In short -- the new window sticker is DESIGNED to "prove" that hybrids don't save gas.

And we pay taxes for this!

 

I came to the same conclusions, jbarnhart.

Testing that requires heavy engine loading -- even though such situations are rare for most driving by normal people. It isn't that Prius per se does bad in those situation, but that regular cars don't expose their horrible pumping losses which are present in 90% of daily driving.

So the devil will be in the detail: how much will heavy engine load data be weighted ? If it is over 10%, an agenda is being dished out.

The EPA has been gutted from the inside by bush appointees. Expect more garbage from that department.

 

In the end if these tests are bogus they'll be exposed. Yes, it does sound like they're designing the test to help the otto cycle engine out. Of course the MPG for these cars will suffer too, especially the smaller engines that are going to have to work hard to hit the 8 mph/s. I wonder what the protocal will be for BSOC during these tests.

Anyways, hybrids aren't going to go anywhere and as more people talk to those who own hybrids and hear that they're getting ~50 MPG (or perhpas better in future models) this will all fade into history as another example of human stupidity.