Why isn't Toyota on the E85 Bandwagon?

why? they'd loose the AT-PSEV rating. And they'd never consider that.

 

i think the plug in will get much higher performance numbers, does not require a HUGE infrastructure or production change that E85 would have to do in order to become more than a niche product.

that is why imm Toyota is not pursuing the issue.

 

If I'm reading this correctly, you'd need 2 separate fuel systems, one for E85 and one for regular unleaded. Seems complex.

The NEV (Net Energy Values) for E85 are simplistic and fail to address where the feedstock - ie corn, sugar beets, whatever - will be grown to displace that much petroleum feedstock. In addition the NEV fail to address the energy required for processing.

True, Brazil can meet a lot of demand with methanol, derived from sugar beet. Their climate is ideal for such crops, unsure if typical Mid West wheatcrop can produce anywhere near the feedstock. Ditto for Canadian wheatcrop land.

 

It SHOULD be coming from nuclear, wind power. The power company just put up dozens of windmills here on a ridgetop that's always windy

 

Frank:

Especially for cold start in temps much below -10 C. E85 vehicles are *very* hard to start in cold temps, and dramatic overfueling is needed to achieve a start in temps much below -20 C.

Recent EPA documents on E85 challenge vehicles require a cold start to be achieved in under 45 secs. 45 secs?? Might as well buy a diesel and monkey around with spraying ether.

Even at -40, parked outside at my hobby farm as an experiment, my Prius started *instantly*

jay

 

a while back someone posted a link to a UCal Berkley document about ethanol as a motor fuel but I can't find it now. Was an interesting read and esentially said without Government subsides it was not sustainable. Also the evaporative emissions from ethanol were very difficult to control. I'll keep looking and if I find it I'll post the url.

 

Is this what you are looking for?
http://www.c4aqe.org/Economics_of_Ethanol/patzek_ethanol.pdf

 

Right, a dual-fuel vehicle that can run on E85 has to grossly over-fuel to start reliably in cold weather. Remember carbs with stuck chokes? You get the idea.

I *love* that rat rod you built. I've been seriously considering finding an old A frame and building something completely impractical just for taking a spin in summer at the hobby farm.

I'm thinking the "traditional" 350 Chevy, Edelbrock carb, TH400, Ford 9 inch rear. Those pieces-parts are plentiful and easy to build/modify.

 

I'm a little lost on the technical side, however, I would like to know if my '06 Prius can run on E85 with out any modifications. What are the benefits and what are the drawbacks of using E85?

 

Let's face it. There's no way E85 is going to be anything but a niche market for a good while. Until cellulosic ethanol goes mainstream we simply can't produce enough ethanol from corn and the like. We currently have the capacity to produce about 4.5 billion gal/yr. Considering the amount of fuel the US burns daily that's a tiny amount. E85's not a bad idea but hyping it now doesn't amount to anything much more than that... hype. Personally, I think a better approach is to take the available ethanol and blend it at a much lower level but in a more uniformly distributed fashion.

 

There are forms of ethanol that are far better than corn derived. Ethanol in and of itself is a good thing. It has the potential to be carbon neutral and to displace oil consumption. Those are good things. It's the current approaches to producing it that are the problem.

All forms of energy are subsidized. The Coal industry gets some very nice perks for the gov't. Oil and gas get some nice perks too. You would you rather subsidize?

 

cold start in the prius should be a non-issue. It's not like a normal car with a starter motor.. It has two BIG motors to spin up the ICE before fuel is added..

I'll gladly pay a $1 per gallon premium for E85 if it worked in the Prius and if there was a gas station that carried it within 30 miles. I looked for the nearest (non-military) station; its over 300 miles away.

 

We can use any type of fuel we choose. At my house, I choose wind power. In the state of Colorado, anyone who wants to can check the box on their electric bill to get their power from wind. (For a little more money, but not much).

Only 2% of electricity in the US comes from petroleum. Hydro, Nuclear, Solar, Wind, Coal, and Natural Gas are all options for electricity. Maybe even ethanol!

Nate

 

i'm totally cool with inhaling a little ethanol vapor. on bad lab days i keep an open beaker of ethanol at my bench. :lol: