What is GM's hybrid strategy?

adric22 - You have obviously given this matter more thought that I ... I was satisfied in my mind that GM is only responding to congress. Congress want green .... GM delivers green, even if an inferior, off color green .... and the public cheers. Now conveniently, the EPA changes the rules, so even the inferior effort can get the best "A" rating .... and the public cheers louder.

GM (the auto maker), wants to build large SUV's, performance vehicles,and HD trucks ... that is where money and profits come from. It will be interesting to watch how it all turns out. My only fear is the taxpayers, with our "deep pockets," will be left holding the bag for an inferior, costly error.

 

GM's hybrid strategy:

Cross your fingers & hope people will stop buying Toyota hybrids ... and hope gas goes back to $1.15 a gallon nation wide, and that people will again think it's cool and sexy to drive a land barge.


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My view is different. Toyota has put up very high barriers in the HV arena -- no company is competing successfully against them. GM just has that much higher a jump, given who and what they are.

 

I think the strategy is to suck up all the targeted grants they can, spend it all on advertising, and then screw up the design and execution so badly they can say "See - nobody wants them!"

 

They're just cheating themselves. Their current focus is to advertise "best fuel efficient SUV on highways" @ 6.1L/100km. Guess what? only if you drive at <100km/h as tested by government EPA. Try 8+L/100km on realistic real life driving.

I'm not just speculating. I bought a Pontiac G5 for my son almost for a song taking advantage of their bancrupcy fiasco. They advertise 5.9 L/100km highway, 8.7 city. Real life? 7+L/100km, 10.5 city, 20+% more than EPA. Guess would I buy another GM car in the near future?

My previous Honda Civic maintained 8L/100km city, 5.6L/100km highway (right up to 130 km/h), same as EPA rating, for all 15 years of it's life.

They're doing the same for making so call "hybrids" including the Volt. It looks good on paper, but will not be realistically popular with $40,000+ initial costs and even more extra money for fast charging stations or else you cannot expect to drive at night cause it charges in 110 volt outlets all night long. And how does it help the environment if they can only sell a total of a few hundred or even a few thousand of them?

Lip service, simply lip service. Hate to see them really disappear some few years down the road. How'm I going to get my G5 serviced when that happens?

 

You mean they have a hybrid strategy?

All the BAS mild hybrids are dead. If one goes to GM - Technology - Hybrids, all you see monstrosity class SUVs and large pickups all in two-mode hybrid form. And yes, they sell in TINY numbers (July 2010 Dashboard: Sales of Popular Hybrids Hold Firm | Hybrid Cars) relative to the numbers that GM sells (By The Numbers - July 2010: How Soon We Forget Edition &mdash; Autoblog), let alone the industry as a whole.

Their execution is so poor that it seems (virtually?) all the of the BAS hybrids had their batteries recalled for pack replacement and some of them got a 2nd recall, again for pack replacement. That doesn't include the fact that they delivered almost no fuel economy gain, were overpriced, weak and did poorly in reviews. The two-mode Vue never shipped.

To me, the "new GM" is even worse than "old GM" in the hybrid department w/even fewer choices and seemingly murky future hybrid plans.

 

They have a revolving door ceo, why would anyone think they have a strategy? Hills ideas are even more bizzare, that after bankrupcy they are trying to make hybrids not sell. I doubt anyone at gm really knows what is going on. They do have tallented people that can build phev and bev though.

These seemed to just be things to follow california emissions. The 2 mode shows some promise, but mercedes as one of the partners says its too expensive to put in another vehicle. Mercedes and bmw have gone onto a lithium battery IMA program similar to hyundai and infiniti. GM could rejoin this partnership and do better, but I doubt they will.

I'm not sure where the worse or better can be applied. The volt seems like a much better effort than the fcev program that was funded with many more dollars. It may be spanned out. Hybrids account for under 3% of new cars, so anything like the volt or 2 mode Silverado or Yukon can only help. I doubt gm will sabotage the program, but they seem to be slow and more than a little bit inept.

 

The good news: I think it is too late for GM to do to 'Hybrids' what GM did to 'Diesels'. Folks already see hybrids working.

If I was Ford, I would worry GM could still convince the American public that "Detroit can't do hybrids, only the Japanese can." (I think Chrysler made a Hybrid Aspen for 3 weeks)

 

I assume Canada is the same as the U.S., but all cars here are tested by the EPA, not the car companies themselves, and in their advertising they can use the EPA numbers only. So I wouldn't blame GM for a discrepancy. Just remember, YMMV

 

Unfortunately, not quite, per How Vehicles Are Tested

Also from The Truth About EPA City / Highway MPG Estimates - Feature - Auto Reviews - Car and Driver which I posted at http://priuschat.com/forums/other-c...th-about-epa-city-highway-mpg-estimates.html:

 

There is no strategy for GM till they can produce a 50mpg+ car priced in the low to mid 20's!

 

I think Toyota has a little home court advantage for their hybrids. They're VERY HOT in Asia especially Japan, where the gas prices are off the roof. They have a large customer base there so selling any number of them in North America would be just bonuses.

While car makers in America like the GM would have no home court advantage and have to start from 0. Granted Toyota did start from 0 a decade ago with every new Prius sales loosing money, but it all paid off after 1 decade of hybrid sales domination.

That tells us how good visions and strategies help companies win. Japanese are not high in innovation/inventions. As someone pointed out that almost all the technologies utiliised in the Prius hybrid concept were inventions of America. The Japanese just know how and what to copy at the right timing.

 

Who cares about Japan? They're an old/saturated market like America. GM is having their best sales in China....for example, Buick is considered a luxury car there and sells over twice as many as in America.

What's most interesting is that the Prius has strong sales in North America, where fuel prices are still low compared to most of the world. China must not be concerned about high mpg cars yet, as they have a sense of entitlement right now.

 

I think you're underestimating the effects of bureaucracy. You have the same people, in the same situation, thinking the same thoughts as they did in the 1970's. I don't know that they are capable of meaningful change. If they have anything resembling an evolutionary strategy it is probably to turtle up and hope those new-fangled little "mammal" things will go bug someone else.

 

Didn't I read a while back that China was considering mandating all new cars be hybrids starting in 2012?