Toyota Prius in Italy

Welcome, Alberto.

If you are concerned about the amount of pollution you car will make, then a Prius is a good choice because the pollution it makes is so much less than a diesel.

The mileage is better than a diesel. Any diesel that will get close to the mileage of a Prius will be a lot smaller. The Prius can fit five people plus it still has a lot of cargo room.

The reason the Prius is not a diesel hybid is that the diesel is so much dirtier. The Prius was not only built to get good mileage but also to be clean. You seem to want both good mileage and a cleaner car. The Prius may be the car you're looking for.

If there is a dealer that will let you drive the car for a few days or a week, do that and see how big it is and how good the mileage is.

I get about 48 mpg combined both city and highway. I think that's about 20 kilometers per liter based on the numbers you gave. You mileage will depend on how many hills you drive up and down and how many kilometers you drive each day.

And your English is just fine!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(AlbertoC67 @ Aug 20 2006, 03:40 PM) [snapback]306307[/snapback]</div>

Chow Alberto,

Milan sounds allot like the area up near Ohare Airport where I work. With planes dumping fuel and other stuff ( :angry: ) overhead as they come in for landing, and there are zillons of very large Diesel trucks stuck in traffic. The Air Quality is not very good during the day, but it all blows off into the lake overnight, thankfully.

The issue with LA is they have mountains to the east. And if they get long period of hot dry weather with mild ocean breezes, the polution will get caught and stew (as its too heavy to make it over the mountains) in the geographical basin that LA is in. There are chemical reactions that occur then, catalyzed by gasoline and other volatile organic compound fumes that build up over time. This causes the Ozone level to soar. You must have been there when they had some cool windy or rainy weather.

I know instantly when I am behind a diesel car in traffic. The car can be like 5 to 10 cars in front, but I smell it, and than look for it, and spot it. Allot worse than somebody driving one of the old V8 carborator cars from the 1970's, believe it or not! The trucks tend to pump the stuff overhead and have apparently more efficient hydrocarbon burn (unless not maintained), but not the diesel cars. These are usually VW TDI's or a few Mercedes (usually E class). Black stained transoms on white TDI's can be seen on occaision. The US just switched to low-sulphur diesel this year. This will increase diesel up to similar energy/gallon costs here in the US as gasoline.

The new Camry's have a electrostatic dust precipitator filter. Maybe we will see those in the Prius in the future?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(AlbertoC67 @ Aug 20 2006, 01:40 PM) [snapback]306307[/snapback]</div>

Ask your dealer two questions: (1) "How many Prius have you sold?"
(2) Have you a trained Prius mechanic? If not where is the nearest?

The Prius is very reliable but you would not want an ordinary motor mechanic to handle any problem you might get.

You may find that in 2007...2008... there will be a long wait if you order a Prius, as demand is likely to increase as people become more aware of their advantages. So NOW is the time to order one.

 

Ciao Alberto!!

Mia figlia e mio genaro abitano a Pozzouli. Vado a Napoli quattro Ottobre!
Mi dispiace ma non scrivo o parla italiano bene!
I am much better in English but I am trying! Jessica has said that she saw only one Prius while they were in Rome. I believe there is a gentleman on the priusonline that is also from Italy.
The car is very much like any other in perfomance. Your roads are very similar to what we have here in San Diego and I have no difficulty. Maintenance with an individual who is certified is important so I agree that you should find out how dedicated your dealer is to keeping a trained person on staff.
Otherwise, regular gas, oil change and tire rotation is about it. Help change the mindset there!!
Buona Fortuna!!

here is a connection to the gentleman from priusonline that says he is in Italy!
http://priusonline.com/viewtopic.php?t=872...c6faac2b2b6cbf8

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(donee @ Aug 20 2006, 12:13 PM) [snapback]306315[/snapback]</div>

I thought that was hilarious! Pasta all around!

and hush, you Muskies! (As Senator Ed used to yell at his kids.)

 

Hi Alberto,

Prego!

I love Italy!

Here is my experience with the Prius. I have owned it for 1,5 years, and my total average fuel consumption over 17000 kilometers is 5 liters per 100 km , or 20 kms per liter. This is for a mix of city driving (0-60 km/h), and highway driving (80-115 km/h).

Since the fuel consumption varies with temperature, many of the reports of better fuel economy are from places where it never gets really cold. Where I live, the average temperatures last year were: spring 13, summer 17, autumn 11, winter 5.

I know there are lots of small diesels in the EU that can get better fuel economy than the Prius, but you are right about the smog. It is a tough choice.

As for the hybrid system being reliable, I have never had any problems with the car, and there are taxi cabs here (Vancouver BC Canada) that have driven over 330000 kilometers without any problems.

Hope that helps.
Ci vediamo!

 

The Prius also does very well in mountains and foothills - of which you have plenty there in Lombardy.
Driving in the mountains and hills does not lower the gas mileage. What you lose efficiently going up the mountain you more than make back going down with the gas motor off.
I have taken our Prius over a 3,030 meters pass on a hot summer day with no problems, and with power to spare. In the winter, I enjoy driving it on snowy mountain roads up to ski resorts in the Sierra Nevada.

I would be more than happy driving a Prius from Milan to the Cortina ski area in the Dolomites.

 

US diesel must be rough stuff. I can absolutely assure you that this doesn't happen in the UK! Maybe it's low-sulphur diesel or something.

The gap in fuel economy between the Prius and other cars in Europe isn't as wide as in the USA. For some reason, even normal gasoline cars over here seem to do better than the same car in the US (and I know the gallons are different sizes) - I don't know why this might be - and of course there are great diesels such as the new Honda Civic. For us, that's a decent sized car, it does 0-60 in 8 seconds and still gets 55mpg - just a little lower than my Prius if I drive carefully, about the same if I don't.

If you care about the environment though, it has to be Prius. Emissions are far less than any diesel, and even less than super-micro city cars like the Aygo. Plus, the more you sit in traffic jams, the more emissions you are saving over conventional cars. Seems to me that would be a major factor in an Italian city...

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(AlbertoC67 @ Aug 22 2006, 07:15 AM) [snapback]307460[/snapback]</div>

According to the USA 2005 Prius Scheduled Maintenance Guide, for the first 120,000 miles (193,121.28 kilometers) it is only inspect, change oil and filters, and rotate tires. Then at 120,000 miles comes the big maintenance item . . . change the spark plugs. :lol:

Due to the regenerative braking, the brake pads and rotors are proving to be extremely long lived. In fact, the rotors can often look rusty due to lack of hard use.

[attachmentid=4579]

 

The reason gasoline cars in Europe get better mileage than those is the U.S. is because they are smaller on average. UK Prius posters have said that it is considered a large car. Here it is a small mid-size (inside. Outside measurements classify it as a compact).

Alberto,
Thank you for starting the 'clean movement' in Italy
With respect to the auto review highway mileage. The ONLY way they could get ANYWHERE near that low would be to go as fast as possible. I drive 67 MPH (108 KPH, it will do 175 KPH) and get 48 - 49 MPG (~20.5 KPL). We have some fairly steep sections on the highways. My ~20,000 mile average is 46 MPG (19.6 KPL) due to the fact that once the temps drop below freezing, the mileage drops. The engine runs more to stay at peak operating temp reducing pollution and provide heat to the cabin. In the summer, I average 52 MPG ( ~22 KPL) or better.

I agree with people who say make sure there is a Prius mechanic available. Not for normal maintenance, but in case there is a service bulletin that affects some part of the hybrid system. If a mechanic can measure the right amount of oil for a diesel or gas car, they can change it in a Prius as well. There are no maintenance items related to the hybrid system other than changing the transmission fluid (after 105K miles I think) which is no different than changing the trans fluid in any car. There is no timing belt to change at 60K miles or any of the other things most cars need.

As others have said, maintenance is almost ZERO. Every 5,000 miles (8000 Km) : Change the oil, check the brakes (for no apparent reason At 20,000 miles (32 Km) my front pads were at 80% usable remaining and the rear at 90%), rotate the tires. Replace engine and cabin air filters at 25,000 miles, earlier depending on how dirty the air (seems like you will do this more often than most). You can do these yourself, it is VERY easy. You can change the oil too. There is nothing special - remove the drain plug, put it back with a new washer, replace the oil filter, add oil. There are NO lubrication points other than hinges and they aren't in the maintenance schedule, probably never need to be done.

You are very lucky in a way. Here, many people buy a Prius without having the chance to drive one, they are all sold before they get to the dealer. I was also lucky. In July 2004, Enterprise Rent a Car had Prii to rent. Toyota has since bought them all back to sell. I rented one for a week, drove it locally and round trip to Boston (425 miles - 680 Km). I was SOLD, SOLD, SOLD. This IS the best car on the planet.

As an 'early adopter' there will be people who think you are crazy and there will be a lot of misperception since there are few on the road there. After you have your Prius (or even the one borrowed for a week) and you show it to them, they too will be convinced. MANY people here still have no idea what hybrid cars are or how they work. "Do you have to plug it in?" is still asked. Also, Ferrari, Maserati and Lamborghini aside, I think people in Europe are not as obsessed with POWER. I suspect you will find people amazed at the combination of fuel efficiency, POWER and size. You will not find another car that has such flexability for carrying items. You will be going skiing with the equipment IN the car, not strapped on top.

People don't change easily. Just remind them that people used to deal with a manual choke to start their cars. I will bet not 1% of people under the age of 40 in the U.S. know what a choke is or what it does. Heck, way back (and way before MY time) one had to crank the engine fron outside the car to start it. My father added seat belts to the 1950's Buick. Before long, people will forget turning a key, starters that crank the engine, surge and jerk transmission shifting, shifters that have to go through reverse and neutral to get to Drive and back to Park, shifters that must be pushed differently depending on the currently selected gear, turning off the headlights, etc. I don't know if the European Prius has the Smart Key system, but if it does, they can also forget about digging something out of their pocket to lock, unlock and start the car as well.

 

I think in long run less maintenance.

1) no starter (ie, as long as we have battery power, we can start the engine). This is good, since a good number of car malfunctions are bad starters.

2) no transmission. I thought the Prius had a CVT... but apparently, it effectively has NO transmission, reducing power loss and... more importantly, again reducing the number of potential malfunctions

3) Regenerative braking - much less use of the brake pads.

4) The computer control of the engine ensures less stress is put on it, particularly when cold (the engine usually idles until it's warmed up while the battery takes over most of the work).

5) No clutch.

6) No alternator.

7) Only one drive belt for water pump.

Change oil and rotate tires every 5,000 miles. (Don't know what that is in kilometers) There's a little more at the 10,000 and 15,000 but not much. A lot less than my old Saturn SC2 coupe.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Godiva @ Aug 24 2006, 04:10 PM) [snapback]309044[/snapback]</div>

I have a vague recollection that the recommended service intervals for the European Prius models is considerably longer than for the North American ones. That is on account of the superior specifications for motor oils used there. The figure of 15,000 km (or 9,000 miles) seem to ring a bell. I could be wrong, though.