1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Survey results not a surprise

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Main Forum' started by jkash, Mar 18, 2005.

  1. jkash

    jkash Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2003
    889
    18
    0
    Location:
    West Hills, CA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Survey results not a surprise
    Enviro-weenies really really like their hybrid cars
    David Booth, National Post

    Some people are just plain stupid. Now, if I were more politically correct, a modern sensitive male or simply had any feelings at all, I'd use some euphemism such as deluded or misguided or skewed. But, alas, much to the chagrin of a couple of ex-wives and many ex-girlfriends, I am none of those things, so I'll just stick with stupid.

    The subject of this week's rant is Consumer Reports magazine's annual survey of the state of the automobile. Buried in among the valuable data that is part and parcel of CR's annual auto issue was its Most Satisfying Vehicles customer satisfaction survey.

    It's a pretty simple survey. Consumer Reports asked 250,000 subscribers who had purchased new 2002 to 2004 vehicles if they would buy the vehicle they own again, considering its price, performance, comfort and reliability.

    The presumption is, of course, that no recommendation can rate more highly than a satisfied customer who would purchase the exact same vehicle all over again. Makes sense to me.

    What made much less sense was that the surprise winner was the 2004 Toyota Prius. Of the 1,640 respondents to the survey who owned the little gasoline/electric hybrid, 94% said they would do it all over again.

    Now, I don't want to defecate (of course, I wanted to use another word here -- see the opening 'graph -- but the Editrix has a strict policy regarding four-lettered honesty) all over Toyota's recently redesigned "green" car. In fact, I'm pretty impressed with its technology, performance and general creature comforts. Compared with its predecessor, it's a huge step forward. And compared with the pathetic attempts at more environmentally friendly vehicles that the domestic manufacturers have put forward so far, Toyota is to be given kudos, a corporate standing O if you will.

    But nothing, absolutely nothing will convince me that those 1,542 overjoyed Prius owners (Hey, Dave can do math --I'm just happy to finally get use of that engineering degree my mom paid so much for) are doing anything more than congratulating themselves for being more environmentally conscious than the rest of we emissions-spewing heathens. Do they care whether the Prius's performance is adequate, whether it handles well or what it will cost to repair its complex planetary gear set in eight years? I don't think so. What matters most to them is whether they get the requisite "Ooh, is that the new Toyota hybrid? You're so fabulous to be doing your part for the environment" at their fancy dinner parties.

    Since the tremendous media attention that the Prius has garnered almost guarantees such fawning coos, the thing that mystifies me is why those other 98 (there's that engineering degree again) Prius owners didn't make it unanimous.

    Consumer Reports' evaluators don't particularly like cars, they sure don't seem to like driving them and, were auto design up to them, we'd all be driving Toyota Avalons, governed for 110 kilometres an hour and completely devoid of any motoring pleasure.

    The organization has, however, a huge number of loyal subscribers and its reliability statistics are most probably North America's best source of information. But asking the magazine's editors for their subjective opinions of cars is like asking chartered accountants to rate comedians. Somehow, numbers and pie charts don't quite capture the essence of why we laugh. Or drive.

    Link to article source.
     
  2. efusco

    efusco Moderator Emeritus
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2003
    19,891
    1,193
    9
    Location:
    Nixa, MO
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Someone please remind me, is it still illegal to strangle and otherwise cause a slow painful death to reporters? Or has that law only been revoked for lawyers? :guns:
     
  3. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2004
    13,439
    641
    0
    Location:
    Winnipeg Manitoba
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jkash\";p=\"73556)</div>
    Jeff:

    Don't get me started on The National Post: they appear to be paid advertising by Canada's largest banks (Toronto Dominion, Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce, Royal Bank, Bank of Montreal, etc etc) to support banking policy and Liberal Government policy in Canada.

    IOW: defending higher service charges, low interest rates, "sharing" of confidential banking information with other banks, selling consumer banking data to the highest bidder, etc. They also tried to dismiss a lot of the recent Liberal Government scandals and were rightly roasted by other media commentators.

    I wouldn't use The National Post to stick under my cat's litter box, even if he suddenly developed a FIERCE case of the trots.

    Remember that David Booth makes a fine living being paid to test and "report" on expensive luxury cars and fast cars. He usually writes glowing reports about these cars, such as his recent gushing praise of the new Jaguar and MB high-end cars.

    I would normally recommend a letter writing campaign of Prius owners, but I have to warn you it will immediately backfire. The vast majority of Prius owners are American, and I guarantee David Booth will then publish a rant about all the "Evil Americans" trying to shove their viewpoint into a "uniquely Canadian" perspective.

    Just rest assured hardly anybody reads The National Post. It's a joke, a country club social setting for bankers.
     
  4. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2004
    13,439
    641
    0
    Location:
    Winnipeg Manitoba
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco\";p=\"73577)</div>
    Evan:

    Sorry to report it's *still* illegal, but I've started a fierce Grass Roots campaign to have that particular law repealed.

    I can report we're making good progress on repealing that law that protects lawyers. Will keep you informed ...

    :twisted:
     
  5. kidtwist

    kidtwist New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2005
    183
    1
    0
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jkash\";p=\"73556)</div>
    I don't know how many of the 94% who said they would buy another Prius were doing so purely in a self-congratulatory tone. I'm not sure that the writer is wrong, but I don't think ALL of the people surveyed felt the same way about it. The people I know who drive Priuses like them. I've driven two and enjoyed it. It's a fun car to drive, so THAT has to be a factor as well.

    But why is it that a person's willingness to take action to lessen the amount of harm done to the environment should make them the subject of ridicule. There seems to be something increasingly ingrained in western culture which says that selfishness should always be our prime motivation for anything we do. People who do things for any other reason are considered "weenies".
     
  6. Torf

    Torf New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2005
    27
    0
    0
    Location:
    Peoria, IL
    Regardless of whether the reporter is biased against the cars or not, he does raise a good point.

    We Prius buyers are purchasing them for some pretty basic reasons. Not all of which are listed here:

    1) Purchaser likes the mileage and fuel savings.

    2) Purchaser finds the car to be practical and technologically fascinating.

    3) Purchaser wishes to help the environment.


    Now I would be very suprised if a Prius owner was dissatisfied with his purchase if it is based on any of these reasons. Therefore the satisfaction rating is very high.

    We can all acknowledge that there are drivers that may have different needs. Some of these may be hauling loads, driving 5-6 people around, rough terrain, flat out speed and comfort, good acceleration, etc. These people MAY be the ones that tried a Prius and decided it wasn't best for them. Some folks may be technophobes and can't enjoy the car. I really don't know.

    It certainly would be interesting to see the reponses of those who wouldn't buy the car again. As a recent Prius purchases (car hasn't arrived yet), I would be very interested in seeing what people both liked AND disliked about the car.

    I do agree that CR can be a bit lame in their criticism of perfectly good cars.

    Anyhow, I feel that drawing and quartering the author would be a tad harsh given that I think a few good points have been raised.
     
  7. kidtwist

    kidtwist New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2005
    183
    1
    0
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Torf\";p=\"73589)</div>
    I think he raised ONE good point, but the tone of the article was deliberately offensive.
     
  8. efusco

    efusco Moderator Emeritus
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2003
    19,891
    1,193
    9
    Location:
    Nixa, MO
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    The real kicker is this. Do the other people who say they'd by their Corvette, or H2, or BMW 7 series have more just reasons for answering the survey they way they did than us Prius owners? I mean, do you really think someone like that isn't doing so in their own self-congratulatory way?? Of course they are....different snobbish reasons, but they certainly can't be considered more objective than a Prius owner.
    I guarantee that Prius owners, in general, put a lot more thought into their purchase than the average H2 owner did.

    H2 Buyer: "Wow, big cool looking truck. I have huge disposable income." [end thought process]--buys big expensive gas guzzling poser 4x4 at exhorbitant mark-up over value.

    Prius Buyer: "Wow, cool technology. Is it safe? Is it clean? Does it get good gas mileage? Is it reliable? What about the battery? How does it work?--Considers other hybrid and non-hybrid options [conscious decison to do something good for himself and the world]--buys Prius, pays a small premium for the technology, enjoys huge satisfaction for a huge number of reasons...including self-congratulations (with good reason)

    I'm done giving this jerk another moment's thought.
    Absolutely stupid writer.
     
  9. Frank Hudon

    Frank Hudon Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2004
    4,147
    19
    0
    US: Fox News
    Canada: NP
    same pile different location. Probably same flies. Certainly the same smell.
     
  10. kidtwist

    kidtwist New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2005
    183
    1
    0
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco\";p=\"73594)</div>
    Good point, and one I hadn't thought of.
    You've proven once again that some doctors are smart.
     
  11. Torf

    Torf New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2005
    27
    0
    0
    Location:
    Peoria, IL
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(kidtwist\";p=\"73591)</div>
    I think he raised ONE good point, but the tone of the article was deliberately offensive.[/b][/quote]

    I agree with that! The word "weenie" was a dead giveaway.

    I'm sure that drivers of other vehicles as mentioned, like Corvettes, Humvees, etc also feel the same way about their choices. It is telling that Prius beat them all.

    I know I poured more research into my Prius purchase than any other car. For me it came down to dollars and sense.
     
  12. Rumply

    Rumply New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2005
    32
    0
    0
    Location:
    Raleigh/Durham NC
    Hmmm.... Ok... so Booth doesn't like the Prius.... with the current shortage, I gotta say I'd root for him NOT to get one and save em for those of us who appreciate good technology.

    And yeah... the planetary drive probably WILL be horribly expensive to repair if it breaks out of warranty... in 8 years...... but lemme see... In the mean time I'll save thousands in gas (Current car.... 1980 chevy malibu... gas milage.. approx 15 hw). And 8 years from now you don't think I will be looking at an entirely NEW generation of higher MPG cars and more emphasis on alternative fuel options?

    What he doesn't get is... at least for me... I am willing to risk that in 8 years to make my personal statement now and help direct the flow of technology in more responsible directions. To a businessman, there is no bell louder than the cash register.

    I do have to register a complain against the Prius community in general though.....

    WHY WASN'T I TOLD ABOUT "their fancy dinner parties" ???? I take delivery anytime now.. and I don't have a good suit or anything!!!!
    :lol:
     
  13. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2004
    13,439
    641
    0
    Location:
    Winnipeg Manitoba
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Rumply\";p=\"73612)</div>
    Yet another crack-induced hallucination on the part of that "writer." Unless I have to dress up at the office, my idea of a "good suit" is Wrangler jeans and a tee.

    As far as "fancy dinner parties" that would be the lavish parties The National Post writers attend at Canadian bank invitation. I rather doubt you'd see a lowly commoner Prius in *that* parking lot.
     
  14. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2004
    13,439
    641
    0
    Location:
    Winnipeg Manitoba
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco\";p=\"73594)</div>
    Evan:

    I wouldn't blow a gasket about this. Trust me that only wealthy Liberal Government pogues and Canadian bankers read drivel like that. The average person is about as likely to read The National Post as he would jump off the CN Tower.

    The target audience of The National Post will drive the top-of-the-line BMW, MB, Audi, Porsche, Jag, Bentley, Cadillac, etc without even glancing at a lowly Prius. What the h*** we pay for it, so they might as well spend it.

    Don't worry Evan, by "we" I mean Canadians. As an American you're not paying for it. Hmmm that darn tingling sensation has returned to my left arm ...
     
  15. DanMan32

    DanMan32 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2004
    3,799
    27
    0
    Location:
    Tampa Bay, FL
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Rumply\";p=\"73612)</div>
    Actually the PSD is quite simple, and should be easy to repair, if it ever breaks, which is not likely. It is much less complex than an automatic transmission.

    Now the inverter breaking down, that would be a different matter. You pretty much have to replace the whole thing, including its cooling system.
     
  16. bookrats

    bookrats New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2004
    2,843
    2
    0
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    A few thoughts, and then toss this into the wastebasket:
    • I don't think this guy is a "reporter". Columnist, perhaps.
    • Wow, boasting that he has multiple ex-wives, as if it's an achievement. Very impressive.
    • The important point:Anyone reading PriusChat for a week would see that people bought this car for a multitude of reasons: fuel economy, geeky technology appeal, patriotism (wanting to reduce our reliance on oil), good value for money (loaded with extras you'd find in a higher-priced car), Toyota reliability... and fewer emissions.

      • Hey... Consumer Reports Prius owners are happy with their cars. End of story.
     
  17. rflagg

    rflagg Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2004
    947
    9
    0
    Location:
    Springfield, VA
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jayman\";p=\"73616)</div>
    Evan:

    I wouldn't blow a gasket about this. Trust me that only wealthy Liberal Government pogues and Canadian bankers read drivel like that. The average person is about as likely to read The National Post as he would jump off the CN Tower.

    The target audience of The National Post will drive the top-of-the-line BMW, MB, Audi, Porsche, Jag, Bentley, Cadillac, etc without even glancing at a lowly Prius. What the h*** we pay for it, so they might as well spend it.

    Don't worry Evan, by "we" I mean Canadians. As an American you're not paying for it. Hmmm that darn tingling sensation has returned to my left arm ...[/b][/quote]

    Ahh - so it's the Canadian equivalent of a Detroit reviewer. Gotcha :)

    Also, by writing this article, he increases the chances of increasing his readership - the same way that Ann Coulter does when she writes about feminists being the cause of the Atlanta shooting and so on, for example. If you're inflammatory and hateful enough towards something, more people will notice you.

    -m.
     
  18. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2004
    45,024
    16,244
    41
    Location:
    Canada
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    New technology = bad?

    what about in the late 80s when fuel injection came out? I'm pretty sure people were complaining that it was unreliable and such but now it's a common day item in a modern vehicle. Or airbags and that whole fiasco about them being dangerous cause people are stupid enough not to wear seatbelts. Honestly, 43,000 Prius owners (US) can't be wrong. The first real advancement in vehicle technology and I can't believe people are actually against that!

    Granted, you can't please everyone but I am frustrated by the fact that there are those who dismiss it and refuse to look otherwise. Are they mad that Toyota is in lead and not GM or what?
     
  19. KTPhil

    KTPhil Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2005
    1,379
    20
    0
    "complex planetary gear set"

    He only shows his ignorance of the Prius when he makes plainly incorrect statements like this.

    He's just pissed he didn't buy one. Envy isn't pretty.
     
  20. TonyPSchaefer

    TonyPSchaefer Your Friendly Moderator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2004
    14,816
    2,498
    66
    Location:
    Far-North Chicagoland
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Prime Advanced
    I like the way he considers it bad that the Prius gets attention. But isn't that the main reason people buy flashy cars. I mean seriously, if consumers didn't want bystanders to "fawn" over their cars, they wouldn't buy extremely BMWs, MBs, and Corvettes just for their daily commutes.

    In another column, the author fawns all over the Jaguar he's reviewing. How is that different?