Public Charging Stations

For PHEV's its not such a big deal, i'm happy enough charging at home right now

 

Are there any money in it? the market had spoken!
It takes a couple minutes to pump a tank, a many hours to charge.

Unless we go to supercapacitors, hydraulic hybrids or otherwise ridiculous battery charge rates the only way you'd get it if there are tax incentives for garage operators.

 

I charge at home. at least 1/3 of distance I traveled are domestically produced electricity. You can check out Electric Car Stations for a charging station near you.

 

Right, there isn't enough charging possible to make money operating the charger, especially when you consider that people will charge their cars at home most of the time.

The important thing is that public charging stations help make it possible for people to own electric cars by providing a safety net.

Utilities have an incentive to push EV ownership and provision of charging stations is one way to help. As more EVs are released I wouldn't be surprised to see some utilities encouraging businesses to install charging stations in their parking lots.

 

There seem to be a lot of unresolved issued with electric vehicles and public charging stations. I believe the Leaf can "fast charge" in about 30 minutes, using a charging rate more agressive than home charging. At the end of a fast charge session it's not as fully charged as a full home charging session, and Nissan cautions against doing this procedure repeatedly.

So: slow, detrimental to battery longevity if done frequently, and doesn't deliver a full charge.

Maybe a standardized battery pack, perhaps several standardized packs in a variety of sizes/capacities, will need to be instigated: All electrical vehicles will use one, and they easily transfer in and out of the vehicle You arrive at a station and swap batteries. You don't own the battery.

Roughly analogous to propane cylinders: old school is to take your cylinder to a gas station and get it recharged. New school: take your spent cylinder to a depot and swap it for another, full compatible, charged cylinder.

 

This is the Better Place concept. Here is a video of a battery swap station.

The bad: Such stations would be expensive to construct, and the under-chassis of EV's would have to be highly mechanically standardized for this approach to be viable.

The good: Currently, this is the only technology that would put EV's on a par with ICE-powered cars in terms of refueling in a couple of minutes or less.

I asked Nissan whether they'd incorporate this approach into the LEAF, and they responded that they're not considering it at this time. Ironic, since it was they who built the prototype EV you see in the video.

 

plus, you'll have to do it every hundred miles or so whereas now, i can drive from boston to dc without stopping and still have fuel to spare.

 

Great thread.. good discussion...

If EV's are going to succeed then the infrastructure will have to be there...

 

This outfit has been gaining speed: Better Place Launches Real-World Battery Swapping Station in Tokyo | Inhabitat - Green Design Will Save the World

 

I think the key is targeting businesses to install them in their parking lots when the businesses themselves would benefit from your extended presence. the per kwh cost of electricity is too low to recoup the charger installation costs otherwise.

Perhaps restaurants, shopping malls, etc... I can even see some garages doing it to attract specific customers if competition is high.

 

I suspect, without knowing for sure, that because of the time factor, charging stations would only be reasonable in locations where the car will be inactive for several hours ... home, work, motels.

EV's were hiped as a vehicle for commuters .... remember, all the studys about how short the average commute is? Now, owners want ammenities ... that want to take overnight trips, and are wanting charging stations along the way. We have not solved the road tax issue from not buying gasoline yet. I do not see government rushing to spend $$$ to provide charging stations, unless those stations will be a means to collect revenue. This very well may be the means to introduce mileage taxation on all vehicles.

"gratis" as one writer suggested .... perhaps at the workplace and motels. Can you impagine the conjestion surrounding charging stations along the interstate as drivers charge for extended period of time? Can you imagine an 8 hour 200 mile trip?

 

I would just like to mention that an RV park already has 90% of the infrastructure to be a charging station for as many as 50 cars at once.

 

+1...I think this works if the cents per mile (CPM) swap rate is competitive with hybrid ICE CPM. If CPM's can't compete than swap outs won't work. I take an 800 mile trip twice a year. So, I stop every 300 miles (present Leaf range) for a swap costing about $30? I would not want to carry extra battery swaps because of weight, however.

 

300 miles is more than triple the current Leaf Range, maybe you're thinking of the Tesla model S (or roadster)?

 

Sorry about the semi-redundant post, but here's a better link to Better Place: Better Place | The Global Provider of EV Networks and Services.

 

I meant as a charge service provider, not owner. Per nissanusa.com it costs $2.75, and takes 7hr to charge Leaf. Assuming 100% markup as a provider you'd be making ~$0.39 per hour. $0.04 an hour with 10% markup.

for comparison on 4$/gal 9% markup (legal minimum) gives $0.36 per gallon. How long does it take to pump 1 gal?

 

I am fascinated by the exchange battery pack concept. I recognize that none of the cars currently available could utilize sich a concept in their present configuration, but future cars could be designed to accommodate such a plan. Great idea.

But, something I have wondered about: Down the road when Volt batteries fail ... inasmuch as the "T" shaped battery lays along the center-line, and across the rear area ... how are they replaced? Was the Volt designed to access the battery from within, or below? What about the Leaf? I am not sure I know where it's battery is located.