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New (possibly unsafe) trick for saving fuel with the TCH

Discussion in 'Toyota Hybrids and EVs' started by CamryDriver, Jun 8, 2018.

  1. CamryDriver

    CamryDriver Active Member

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    I often stop at Wal-Mart on the way home, usually for just a thing or two. When I get back to the car after 3 to 5 minutes the car seems to need to go through a warm-up of 4 (by my count) or 5 (as claimed by the internet) steps. Regardless of the number, the warm-up steps do not seem to be the most fuel efficient.

    Step 1 seems to be running a short way on EV which lowers the battery SOC a tiny bit.

    In Step 2 the engine runs but the car seems to use mostly the battery and motor for propulsion, draining the battery a fair bit in the process.

    At some point the car will get much louder as it enters Step 3. Step 3 seems to be designed to charge the battery back up after Step 2.

    Finally in step 4 the engine calms back down and the car drive "normally".

    So here is the trick: The other day I put the car in park but did not hit the shutdown button. When I got back to the car a few minutes later the car drove off "normally", skipping the warm-up steps.

    I expect this could be a very bad idea for a number of reasons. Please discuss if you think it saves gas or not, or if there is a safer way to do this security wise. I don't think the Camry will lock in this condition.

    I did this the first time by accident when I was not accustomed to the new push-button vs old key and it most certainly did not save fuel because it was cold and the car actually ran the engine for part of the time I was in the store.
     
  2. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    I remember people doing this with a gen2 Prius. In many cases to leave the A/C on for pets.

    You should be able to manually lock the doors from outside by using the back up key hidden in the fob.
     
  3. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    There was someone here proposing to leave the car on while pumping gas, for similar reasons. I'm old-school, just shut my ears to all the pros, go with the cons: if the car is stopped, you're getting out, turn it right off. Set the parking brake too, lol.
     
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  4. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

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    My Energi gives a very loud double tap horn honk if I leave the car on, get out with my FOB and shut the door. When I do want to do this on purpose, I have to gently close the door but not completely shut it.
     
  5. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

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    Yes if you are just making a short stop, if you turn car off you have to go back up some of low MPG warm-up steps.

    Or in Arkansas get a FORD Fusion Hybrid, which might not be a Calfornia car. Toyota policy is to go with California cars everywhere 50-states, so that's why (1) your vehcile gets low MPG when cold to achieve ultra-low emissions, and (2) Toyota has rules about who gets the CARB warranty based on what state you live. Other makers you either have a Calfornia car or you don't based on emissions hardware installed and warm-up cycles- so they might out-perform Prius MPG when cold - .or as some Gen2/3 owners did they did a thermistor hack to make the system think it was warmed up....just giving some perspectives not really being serious.
     
    #5 wjtracy, Jun 8, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2018
  6. CamryDriver

    CamryDriver Active Member

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    The silly thing is that the car IS still warmed up after only a few minutes of being off. Heck it is still fairly warm after being off for an hour. My old car would run the fan after it was turned off sometimes. That seems silly to me. I'm not sure it did that when it was new.

    I'd not get a Fusion till they fix their silly trunk space issue. I went to buy one and was turned off right away by the tiny 2 tier trunk with the battery taking up way too much space. The Fusion's trunk is worse (much worse) than my 12 year old Civic Hybrid's. The HyCam is perfect in this regard with the traction battery under the seat which makes room for a full sized trunk with a spare and fold down seats. That was a big selling point for me.
     
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  7. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    The Fusion hybrid has the same system no matter the state, and that pretty much applies to all cars now, since CARB states now cover most of the consumer base.
    The engine might be warm, but the catalytic converter has likely cooled. Toyota's primary goal is reducing emissions.
     
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  8. CamryDriver

    CamryDriver Active Member

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    Thanks for that. Thing is I really doubt that the warmup steps really help with that. I expect that the engine is running a bit rich during warmup which is one reason it seems to tank the mileage so much. What do you think?

    I'm referring to when the car is already warmed up BTW, not when it is starting from cold.
     
  9. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    Maybe not that much?
     
  10. CamryDriver

    CamryDriver Active Member

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    The mileage is pretty horrible during the time the warmup is taking place. Maybe not that much for the entire trip but during the event you might only be getting 20 MPG or so.
     
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  11. padroo

    padroo Senior Member

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    My Gen 4 seems to warm up and shut off quicker than my Gen 2 does.
     
  12. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

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    Have they made their warranty convoluted like Toyota? I'll have to check.
     
  13. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Yeah, the engine(a heavy mass of metal) and coolant(mostly water) can remain warm for a time sheltered in the engine bay. The cat isn't those things, and shed heat quicker. It might even be exposed to air flow, and require to be hotter than the engine to function properly. So the hybrid goes through the warm up cycle when the engine is still warm, because that also generates hotter exhaust to heat the cat.

    As mild hybrid systems and tightening emission regs expand, we will likely start seeing catalytic converter heaters on cars.
     
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  14. CamryDriver

    CamryDriver Active Member

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    The 2018 Camry seems to warm up very quickly from a cold start. I think they did some work in this regard but I'm light on technical specifics.
     
  15. CamryDriver

    CamryDriver Active Member

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  16. CamryDriver

    CamryDriver Active Member

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    So the other day I tried to lock the car with the ignition still on and had no luck. The normal way of touching the handle does not work. Pushing the button on the FOB does not work. Finally I could not easily figure out how to lock the car from the outside with the manual key since only the driver's door has a keyhole.

    Maybe the other doors can be locked from the inside first?

    Maybe there is a setting I could change?
     
  17. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    The manual key of my Taurus would at least unlock all the doors from the outside. I just used the power lock on the inside, so can't say how locking with it worked.

    If the manual can't lock all the doors, locking them from the inside, and then manually locking the driver's door should work.
     
  18. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    Is this quest eclipsing the original issue?
     
  19. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    even our 2013 hycam warms up much faster than my 2012 pip, not sure why, it often shuts down after a few hundred feet.
     
  20. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    Ours often shuts down by the second stop sign (100 yards or so), most predictably if the cabin vent system is right off, or at the least temp is set fairly low. BUT, that's after two hours with the block heater plugged in...:whistle:
     
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