1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Master Warning, ABS, (!), and Hybrid Vehicle Warning icon

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by Patrick Wong, May 27, 2009.

  1. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    18,200
    6,482
    0
    Location:
    Green Valley, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2015 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    We're currently in Green Valley, AZ; south of Tucson. Drove ~500 miles yesterday from OC in the 2004 w/76K miles, no problem. Today we drove up to 5,400 ft elevation. On the way down, the Master Warning light, ABS light, (!) brake light, and hybrid vehicle icon in the MFD all appeared. The brightness of the instrument panel and MFD illumination dropped down to the level when headlights are turned on, although the headlights were off.

    I have no tools or test equipment in the car. After some thinking, I decided to drive to the Toyota dealer ~30 miles away (Precision Toyota.) The traction battery SOC started at 7 green bars and dropped down to 5 blue bars during this drive. The traction battery fan was on at high speed. The MFD showed arrows when power flowed from the gasoline engine to the wheels. However it did not show any regen arrows nor did it show power flowing to or from the battery.

    The driveability was impaired because the engine ran at all times and acceleration was very slow, so I had to get out of the way of traffic behind me from time to time. I did manage to get up to ~65 mph while on I-19 (speed limit is 75 mph.) Then we had to go through I-10 which has several Tucson city exits blocked. Then it turned out the Magellan GPS had the wrong address for the Toyota dealer so I had to call the dealer receptionist to get the right address. However we finally got there, dropped off the car, and rented a Yaris.

    My usual guesses as to the root cause would be an inverter coolant pump failure or a traction battery failure. However since I was able to drive an extended distance without the car shutting down, I think the inverter was running at least well enough to keep the 12V bus alive. The battery SOC was not jumping up & down wildly, so that causes me to rule out a battery failure.

    I am now thinking that maybe the inverter has a weird problem that does not impact the DC to DC converter, or the hybrid vehicle ECU has a problem. Anyone have other guesses, please chime in.

    I hope to hear from the service writer tomorrow regarding diagnosis, etc.
     
  2. Celtic Blue

    Celtic Blue New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2008
    2,224
    139
    0
    Location:
    Midwest
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Did the traction battery fan stay on at high speed the whole time? If it did then I wonder if it is throwing some sort of erroneous high temperature reading for the battery pack? Perhaps going into a high temperature protection mode that prevents transfers to/from the traction battery?

    The fact that it continued to misbehave and stayed in "limp along" mode suggests to me that it wasn't something as simple as a battery cooling problem. If say the traction battery ducts were plugged (rodents, etc), the battery got hot, and the fan ran (but couldn't move any air because of blockage) then I would expect it to cool down after a time in this mode, but it sounds like this never happened.
     
  3. hobbit

    hobbit Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2005
    4,089
    468
    0
    Location:
    Bahstahn
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Wow. I guess it can happen to the best of 'em. In the long run I bet
    it'll turn out that that Prius chose the wrong guy to mess with, as
    every detail of ferreting out what's wrong will likely hit the net...
    .
    Was the inverter pump *running*? That's easy to check..
    .
    _H*
     
  4. FL_Prius_Driver

    FL_Prius_Driver Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2007
    4,319
    1,527
    0
    Location:
    Tampa Bay
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    I
    The battery would have been subject to an much higher than normal heat load on hills in the hot southwest. Once you started down the hills would have been charging the battery to the max SOC and that would most likely made it as hot as it was going to get. Were you in B or D mode?

    I would expect the inverter heat load would be hardly any different than normal, since all the MG1 and MG2 current flows through it regardless of battery condition.
     
  5. dogfriend

    dogfriend Human - Animal Hybrid

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2007
    7,512
    1,188
    0
    Location:
    Carmichael, CA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    What was the ambient temp? I'm thinking pretty hot. Could you possibly have a bad 12v battery? I always seem to lose batteries during the summer, sometimes with little or no warning.
     
  6. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2004
    9,157
    3,562
    0
    Location:
    Kunming Yunnan China
    Vehicle:
    2001 Prius
    Good luck Patrick. I know you've been on tough Prius trails before.
     
  7. efusco

    efusco Moderator Emeritus
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2003
    19,891
    1,193
    9
    Location:
    Nixa, MO
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Were you able to get them to hook up the tester before shutting down or did you have to go through the usual rigamarole? And, honestly, I'm shocked that you didn't have at least a Scan Guage with you.
     
  8. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,663
    15,663
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    A thread worthy of subscribing.

    GOOD LUCK!

    Bob Wilson
     
  9. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2004
    13,439
    641
    0
    Location:
    Winnipeg Manitoba
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Well, I got to this party a little late. I sent you a PM.
     
  10. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    18,200
    6,482
    0
    Location:
    Green Valley, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2015 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    Thanks for the comments.

    No Scan Gauge, as I question its ability to retrieve DTC generated by ECUs other than the engine. Jay suggested trying to retrieve blink codes; however I believe that is limited to a very small subset of DTC. In any event the car is now at the Tucson dealer and I haven't yet received a diagnosis.

    The 12V battery is original. No problem starting the car, the warning lights came on ~20 minutes after we started our descent from Madera Canyon (a very nice hiking and birding spot, BTW.) I was using D until I saw eight green bars on the traction battery SOC display, then moved to B. Once the road became less steep then I returned to D.

    The battery fan was running much more than normal. I had the A/C running, trying to keep the battery cool. Ambient temps in the high 90s F.

    We are planning to proceed on to Sedona tomorrow with or without the Prius. If the car isn't repaired then I'll have to return to Tucson next week if/when it is repaired...
     
  11. firepa63

    firepa63 Former Prius Owner

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2005
    1,761
    208
    0
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    I think the original 12v battery may be contributing to this issue.
     
  12. Celtic Blue

    Celtic Blue New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2008
    2,224
    139
    0
    Location:
    Midwest
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Ahh...that's where I would place my bet then. I hope for your sake that this is it, since it would be the cheapest thing to replace. Good luck!
     
  13. 2009Prius

    2009Prius A Wimpy DIYer

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2009
    2,705
    510
    63
    Location:
    USA
    Vehicle:
    2009 Prius
    Would a weak 12V battery cause the display to dim? Just wondering.
     
  14. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2004
    13,439
    641
    0
    Location:
    Winnipeg Manitoba
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    A shorted/bad cell in the battery? Maybe. We won't know until Patrick gets word from the dealership
     
  15. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    18,200
    6,482
    0
    Location:
    Green Valley, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2015 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    My Prius is back in service now. DTC P3000, info code 603. I don't have access to the repair manual right now (as the computer that I am borrowing does not allow multiple browser windows to be open) so if someone wants to look that up and comment, that would be nice. Apparently that DTC has to do with the battery control system. The solution was to clear codes and download firmware for the HV and engine ECUs per SSC50P.

    What is interesting is that SSC had previously been performed back when my dad owned the car. I had driven >60K miles since buying the car with 15K miles in late 2006 and had no driveability problems until now. I'm not confident that this will be a permanent fix but have driven the car ~300 miles so far without further incident - except that the traction battery SOC gauge seems to show 2 red bars more frequently than I would expect during normal driving. So we'll see.

    In Hawaii, Servco Pacific is the distributor and that entity does not share vehicle repair info with TMS USA. Therefore TMS USA had no record that the three applicable SSCs had been performed on my vehicle. According to an email that I received from Servco Pacific back in Nov. 2006 when I asked about the SSCs, they were performed as follows:

    40L stop light switch April 2005
    50P ECU reprogram March 2006
    60C intermediate steering shaft July 2006

    The Tucson dealer re-performed all three. Apparently inspection of the old steering shaft was inconclusive as to whether it was original or not.
     
  16. dogfriend

    dogfriend Human - Animal Hybrid

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2007
    7,512
    1,188
    0
    Location:
    Carmichael, CA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Battery Cooling System malfunction. Abnormal signal input from battery.
     

    Attached Files:

    1 person likes this.
  17. Celtic Blue

    Celtic Blue New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2008
    2,224
    139
    0
    Location:
    Midwest
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Glad to hear you are back on the road, Patrick.

    I should have stuck with my initial guess. So if the codes are correct, the HV cooling system either isn't really cooling (making noise, but no effect or no airflow?) I've never heard the traction battery cooling system kick in, or at least never realized that it was running. Of course the temps here are pretty mild.

    What is it using as a temperature reading for the HV battery? Is it a single point, multiple points, some sort of polling?

    Patrick, I should have asked this before, but since it was you I figured you had already considered this: is there any chance that you had something in the back passenger seat covering the cabin vent for the HV battery? (The sales rep. actually warned us about that.)
     
  18. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    18,200
    6,482
    0
    Location:
    Green Valley, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2015 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    Hi Jason,

    Thanks for posting the repair manual pages. Looks like the battery ECU is suspect if the code reappears. This morning the SOC gauge started at 2 red bars so I'll keep an eye on that as we drive around today.

    Hi Shawn,

    The battery vent is clear. I believe there are four thermistors that track battery temp, spaced throughout the battery modules.
     
  19. hobbit

    hobbit Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2005
    4,089
    468
    0
    Location:
    Bahstahn
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    You had just been doing a lot of regen toward a fairly high SOC,
    and it was hot out. That will definitely tend to get a battery
    fairly toasty. Perhaps the normal, expected operation under
    those circumstances is right on the edge of abnormal conditions
    as defined by Toyota, and you managed to make a brief excursion
    outside the envelope? Maybe some accumulated dust in the air
    passages could have let one of the thermistors see something
    higher than it liked. Maybe one of your thermistors is itself
    out of spec and erroneously reported a higher temp?
    .
    I've been considering opening up my own battery case at some
    point just to check around for corrosion and crud and maybe blow
    things out a little; haven't gotten there yet as I've noticed no
    issues other than the high-altitude weirdness last summer.
    .
    Glad to hear it was most likely a transient thing, though.
    .
    _H*
     
  20. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2004
    13,439
    641
    0
    Location:
    Winnipeg Manitoba
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Patrick

    So everything is ok so far??

    jay