HWY MPG for the 2010 Prius. PLEASE HELP!

Theoretically the 2010 should be even better, but my son's 2007 typically averages high mid to high 40's at the speeds you reference (and substantially above but I have know idea who was driving that fast , even when throwing in some wind, mountain passes, and altitudes averaging 8-10K ft. This compares favorably with TDI powered cars which are often considered the highway mileage kings and is about the worst possible location/use for the Prius' hybrid system which really targets lower speed stop and go. The bottom line is you will be hard pressed to do better, even for mostly highway driving.

 

I think you may get better mileage (close to 50 mpg) with the TDI once broken in, but I'm not sure where you heard that about minimal service. The TDI service is expensive, and the timing belt replacement alone is $400-800 (VW vs. independant), not including the tensioner and water pump (another $100+). Interval varies with engine, but it's at least every 100k and I've read up to every 40k. It was a deal breaker for me, but I drive mostly city miles.

 

250k+ for battery... modern diesels have a lot of things that break over the long time.

Plus you will be paying more for gas as diesel is more expensive.

Also check residual values if you are concerned for the long term, not sure what they are.

 

2.5k or $2,588 for battery.
Toyota Vehicles : Toyota Announces Price Reduction On Prius Hybrid Batteries / Toyota

Ken@Japan

 

Edmunds TCO for Prius is 2x higher than my ownership experience of 96k miles.

The HV battery should last 300k miles if you do mostly highway driving. The brand new replacement pack costs $2k plus the labor today. When your warranty expires in 10 years, the pack will cost even less due to popularity and mass production.

Diesel emission equipment replacement/repair will cost a lot once the warranty expire as well. Jetta's transmission may need to be replaced and it's warranty is just 3-5 years. There are a lot of moving parts and it requires maintenance (unlike HV battery). Think about that.

2010 Prius highway MPG should match or beat Jetta TDI. However with Prius, you get the benefit of superior city MPG. Remember, highway can have traffic jams and congestions as well! Prius will do 3-4x better MPG than the Jetta in those situations.

It takes a bit of aquired taste to fully appreciate hybrid exclusive premium features such as EV driving, Eco mode, Power Mode, regen-brake, fast cabin warmth, jet-like smooth acceleration, high torque responsive electric motor, etc... Jetta is lacking those features that you will eventually learn to enjoy!

 

I think he meant 250k miles.

 

Sorry to disagree but I spoke with the VW sales manager of the dealership here and they said Timing Belt at 60K miles! No mistake as I asked 3 times.
He said they also replace the waterpump at the same time. So I guess it depends on what dealer you talk to.
The fact that I hear so many different stories about their maintainance worries me.

 

I'd never buy anothe VW. I used to own a 2001 Beetle. Nice designs, but poor reliablilty. I put way too much out-of-pocket money into that car keeping it running, even though I bought it new.

Consumer Reports also confirms their poor reliability

My daughter-in-law had a Jetta. Many problems with that car while she owned it. Final deathwish of that vehicle: she brought it to a VW dealership for routine maintenance. 15 minutes after she left, she got a call from the dealership: the engine compartment had spontaneously burst into flames while the car sat parked in the dealer's lot!! It was totalled.

 

If you are driving 3000 miles/mo on flat roads, you might consider the Prius V with lane keep assist and adaptive cruise control in case you start to fall asleep driving.

Roy

 

The 2010 Prius revs 300 RPM lower with the larger 1.8 liter gas engine. eCVT revs at extremely low RPM on the highway. The "gearing" is taller than 6 speed tranny in the Corvette. Check out this video:

[ame=http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3834454834833982503]Prius e-CVT in action: A view of gas engine RPM at 65 MPH.[/ame]

This is the video of how it feels to drive in EV mode:

[ame=http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8064680594188841431]Sound, Feel and driving experience of a Prius[/ame]

Another hybrid exclusive premium feature - Fun in traffic jam:

[ame=http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5629875641973044508]I-495 LIE Traffic Congestion Utopia (70 MPG in Prius)[/ame]

You can't do that with Diesel.

 

I've just read through the posts here, and I'm glad you've been inquiring about the 2010 by giving us info on intended use and how it would compare to the Jetta TDI. I'll respond to some of your specific points below, but I wanted to make a couple of general comments first.

• I have not driven a 2009 Jetta TDI. In fact, I haven't driven a Jetta TDI. I have been in several TDIs in Europe and I found them surprisingly sprite.
• I have owned a Gen2 Prius ('07) and a new Gen3 (2010). There is hardly any comparison in driving feel between the two (I have the Model V with 17" wheels, so that does make a difference), because the 2010 is a standout performer.
• I feel from your responses that you just don't want to take to heart the comments received. I grant that the comments are coming from true-blue Prius lovers, but I don't see that you benefit from ignoring some of the comments.
• Have you driven that route from Indiana to Wisconsin very often? If you are going to be driving the Borman Expressway (I-90/94) and the Tri-State Tollway (I-294), you'll not be driving 80mph that often! You'll be experiencing road work on a regular basis and traffic jams just when you don't want to see another car.
• Remember: I haven't driven the Jetta TDI, and I AM a Prius lover.

That is news to me. I didn't know the credit existed for the TDI. Please make certain you not only qualify, but that you'll be able to take advantage of the tax credit. Its applicability depends on how you file and your income.

Similar MPG for Highway? The Prius is rated 17% higher than the Jetta TDI (manual) -- even higher (20% higher) compared to the automatics. And that is based on running the Prius in standard mode. At highway speed it makes sense to run in Eco mode, and the numbers will be higher. My recent jaunt showed that regular 65+ mph numbers were in the 54 to 56 MPG range -- and that is with the car brand new and running on 17" wheels.

I'll have to take your word on this one, though I have my doubts given my recent experience with my new 2010 Prius V. Did you test drive the car you wanted (a 2010 Prius III, I believe)? Did you drive it in the various modes (Normal, Eco, Power)?

I've got to question some of your reasoning here. Where do you find support that the VW TDI diesel will last "for much longer time than gas engines"? You are looking at a battery replacement at 250,000 miles and then saying it would be time to dump the Prius then, anyway. Do you really intend to drive any car 250,000 miles? If so, then look at real life costs expressed by people who have driven cars than long and far. I haven't done this, and I have only the PC postings to look at, but it sure seems that people have been driving the Prius for many, many miles at minimal maintenance cost.

I didn't know 60% of European cars are running in TDI diesels, though I don't doubt it is a high number. They are running TDI diesels because of fuel costs and car costs -- and they want better performance than the very small gas engines. The downside is that European diesels are not nearly as clean as those sold in the U.S.

I believe it. I have the 2010, and the fit and finish is excellent. Space is more than adequate. The hatch beats the pants off of any mid-size sedan in terms of usable space.

OK. This is simply a matter of preference. (I have to say it that way, right? I can't stand the look of the Jetta, and I find the Gen2 Prius much more appealing than the Jetta. The 2010 Prius is downright sexy in comparison. Again, each to his or her own, though. If it comes down to looks, and looks are important to you, then go with what you like. Who wants to drive a car she considers ugly or unappealing?)

And where did you get that information? The Jetta TDI does NOT have lower carbon emissions than the Prius. Take a look at both the Annual Petroleum Consumption and Carbon Footprint "scores" as reported at www.FuelEconomy.gov. This is information assembled and provided by the U.S. Dept of Energy and the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency. For Annual Petroleum Consumption, the Jetta TDI (manual) scores 11.6 barrels; that is nearly 70% higher than the Prius' 6.9 barrels. For Carbon Footprint, the Jetta TDI (manual) scores a 6.2 (annual tons of carbon dioxide emitted), and that is also nearly 70% higher than the Prius score of 3.7.

The "extraction of minerals" issue has been addressed and debunked scores of times over. Please search not only this site but others. And rethink your uses of batteries of any sort before believing the Prius is the end of the world in terms of use of metals. Just look at the extra metal used in the production of the Jetta engine!

Even with Diesel assumed to be 7% less expensive than gasoline, EPA predicts the Prius will cost 3% less in terms of fuel use. And that is based on driving 15,000 miles per year -- much less than your intended use. Even if you have a higher percentage of highway use than in EPA's model, the Jetta is no winner in fuel prices. I'd have to see the predictions you describe, because the trend for many years now has been just the opposite.

I can't have a definitive say in terms of comparison without having driven the Jetta. At the same time, I just can't see how you come away with a "clear winner overall." If you want the Jetta more than the Prius, that is enough to make it the clear winner, and you don't need any other justification. The Prius is the "winner" in terms of fuel economy, space, comfort, resale/retained value, environmental impact and features. The Jetta is the "winner" in terms of initial cost, given the tax credit. I'll go with you in terms of Jetta being the winner in the "funner to drive" category -- even though I have severe reservations now that I'm driving the 2010 Prius. The points of "contention" would have to be looks and maintenance. Maintenance figures in to the overall cost and value of the car, and you need to consider how long you'll have this next car and how many miles it will be driven. Also, I recommend looking to reliability (Toyota is the clear winner there).

If it comes down to looks and fun, you've made your decision and I'm certain you'll be very happy with the Jetta. If you want to base your decision on dollars and sense, I just don't see the Jetta as the winner, and I think you may be disappointed with the Jetta -- in those terms, that is.

The Prius isn't for everyone (thankfully!!), but please don't toss it out because of a fiscal or environmental analysis that may be flawed.

 

With assertions like this ...

... you sound like you're part of the typical buy-anything-but-prius-no matter-what-others-have-to-say-and-regardless-of-how-truthful-it-might-be-and-while-we're-at-it-let's-troll-the-Prius-forums-a-bit-in-the-guise-of-asking-for-help-because-maybe-there's-a-newbie-just-gullible-enough-there-to-believe-it crowd.

Sheesh! If you really were interested in the truth, you would have done some serious fact-checking on that one. But instead you've cost yourself substantial (all?) credibility.