GM not going away, niether is Ford

Where do you start with a rant like this one?

GM bashing? Most of these posts are just statring facts, like poor quality, losing money, and unsatisfactory dealer experiences. That is bashing?

Please show evidence that Toyota is "fat, dumb, and happy."

I'll ignore the tangent of social and government systems as irrelevent.

Royalties to US companies? I guess you are smarter than all the engineers, lawyers, and the patent offices. Please itemize the patent infringements you are aware of.

 

I'd echo another poster's comment that one shouldn't toss GM and Ford (and Daimler-Chrysler) into the same boat. They're significantly different companies.

GM I generally will bash; but there are a number of Ford models I consider worth buying. (Not as much as a Prius, but good cars nonetheless.)

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dixonr\";p=\"102812)</div>

Don't be so quick to generalize...I'm 6 foot 1, weigh 190 pounds, so not fat...I'm also a CPA, so I guess I'm not dumb either then....and happy? Well, sometimes, but hey, not all the time....where is all this stuff coming from Dixon? This is the third time I've seen these ramblings from you on this sort of topic. Are you at the forefront of a revolution I wasn't sent a memo about?

Would I buy Toyota stock? You bet your tootsie I would? Seeing as they are revolutionizing the way we look at automobiles and emissions today, I would say it's a safe investment, and they're not slowing down either. They're doing their part to make America better, where is GM in that race?

 

In my lifetime, I've owned 5 American cars from all 3 of the big 3. I was happy with all of them. My Prius is the first and only foreign car I've ever bought. It's also the first new car I've bought, as I swore I'd never do that due to the rapid depreciation of most new cars.

The main reason I bought it was to send a message to the market, that it is time for more responsible car buying. All of us who were willing to wait in line for a Prius has made a statement to car makers that cannot be ignored. My hope is that American makers listen this time and rapidly remodel themselves to meet the needs of the future, and not the present wants of the rich CEO's, oil companies, and etc. Then my next car can be an American made, sensible car that I can be proud of.

Besides, the foreign competition we need to worry about is not auto industry, it is the cheap plastic crap everyone is buying from China. Every time you buy this stuff, you are giving more power, money, and increased oil demand to the Chinese with which they can then buy up oil reserves that we will be warring over in the future (or presently depending on your political stance). Its like handing the rope to your executioner.

 

I'd buy Toyota stock if I had the money. But it's already quite pricey.

You know, your argument is quite weakened by your inability to put together ideas in a worthwhile manner.

And I'm with Dave. I'm not fat, quite happy (just celebrated our first anniversary. one year of absolute happiness) and I think my signature will defray any ideas that I'm not intelligent.

You'll find most people on this particular board do not fit the "fat happy stupid american" type....

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dixonr\";p=\"102758)</div>

So why do they have to belt-tighten again? They didn't learn anything circa 1978-1985?

I have no sympathy whatsoever for brain dead companies. The first OPEC crisis was a wakeup call and we pretty much hit the Snooze button, now it's Part II and some of us are slowly figuring it out.

I personally have my doubts that oil will magically run out within 10 years, but at the same time the *easy* supplies of crude will become politically off limits. If we factor the "true" cost of a gallon of gas (Military presence in the Gulf, support of the Saudi family, etc) than it would be every bit as expensive as a fillup in central London or Paris.

So when I hear GM whining and moaning about how crappy their sales are, they have nobody but themselves to blame. I seem to recall a guy by the name of Lutz knocking down conservation and the Prius in particular. He now admits he really dropped the ball on that one.

How about the almost $2 billion U.S. taxpayer dollars, courtesy of the DOE, given the the Big Three to figure out hybrids in the mid 90's? Nothing to show for that huge taxpayer investment, but along comes the Honda Insight and the Toyota Prius.

A neat little car next time you're visiting Europe is the VW Lupo 3L. The "3L" refers to its fuel consumption of 3 L per 100km, or around 94 MPG Imperial gallon.

So I really don't believe the Big Three who made all these claims about how it was "impossible" to make a car like the Prius when Toyota beat them fair and square.

Guess what? Another crucial American invention was Quality Control, part of the larger field of Management Science. A neat fellow by the name of Dr. W.E. Deming invented that, and American industry at the time laughed it off.

So the Japanese invited him to lecture, around 1950, and the rest is history. Deming figures *very* prominently in current Japanese culture:

http://www.deming.org/demingprize/demingprize.html

It's not so much that the United States, and to a lesser extent Canada (In particular the highly efficient CANDU nuclear reactor) had the ideas stolen. The United States and Canada p***** away these inventions and innovations.

So we have ourselves to blame. Don't complain that in the Real World there are smarter folks willing to capitalize on our mistakes. Grow up and deal with it.

 

part of the HSD was to mitigate the battery patent that was supposedly violated with the Classic 273 volt pack. The new battery at 200 volts is under the patent voltage limit. That was my take on the law suite. Toyota was a participant in the suite but Panasonic the battery supplier was the main party in the suite.

 

Hang in there DixonR., they cannot stand anything that does not agree with their basis and rhetoric. The major players in this board politically of course are not going to say or do anything that might give someone the idea ANY american business, and certainly not this government to be doing anything right. And of course they the saviors, want you to BOW first, take the insults and raves, say nothing in return, and just CONFESS YOUR GUILT!! I'm with you man..I like good solutions, I'll walk the talk and still be patriotic and optimistic for this country, but by the tone of these people, that is really divisive and just not correct behavior. We should just admit we're tools and like before just confess the guilt.....

 

GM cant go away... that would totally screw up Toyota's goodwill takeover plans for them.

 

...and who would we have to pick on?....they stoppd making the Corvair, and Ford stopped production of the Pinto and Mustang II...I did appreciate Pontiac bringing the Aztek forward, finally, we had something we could all laugh at again.

 

Last I heard was that Toyota preferred to keep its cash flow and reserves for R & D., not by taking over other auto companies. Maybe China can bail out GM., heck Unocal if they get it will give them more cash.....there sarcastic enough and anti-us to boot !!!!!