Ford: We goofed on SUVs

funny, i thought they were dumping hybrids for E85... hmm.

i'm personally glad to see the swing heading back to cars and smaller "crossovers" (apparently "slightly taller, glorified station wagon" won't move product :lol just for the sake of wasting less space and fewer resources... and of course the whole if i get hit by one of those it won't be as bad as if i get hit by an envoy thing.

 

I am still seeing as many new monster SUVs on the road as well as more Prii. There seems to be a lot of money out there...I think some of us are just spending it more wisely and wont be so likely to regret our purchase in 2-3 months.

 

Hi All,

I think Ford also goofed on the SUV culture. Their first Hybrid, a SUV, while technically a success is a marketing mistake. I did not believe that when it first came out, but having talked to people about the Prius since I have owned one, I really did not understand how brainwashed SUV people are. There is just no going back on that overnight.

Instead of a totally irrationalized SUV public to sell their first hybrid too, Ford should have made thier first hybrid a MINIVAN. First, its a hole in the market - they gotta have known that Toyota was going for the hybrid SUV market. Second, gas prices have gone up to make it worthwhile (hindsight I know). Third, Family buyers are out for practical solutions, not irrational ego-boosting keepin-up-with-the-jones' tipsy illusionary gas guslers. Fourth Mini-Vans are typically not used as Tow Vehicles, and SUV s are - which melds with present hybrid technology well. Fifth, the Minivan is more an around-town vehicle, which a hybrid is good for, while an SUV is more of a over-the-road weekend escape (modern diesel is better for this) machine. Lastly, Kids like to watch the MFD!

Its easy to see this stuff now. I misunderstood the marketting stuff like everybody else back when it would have been use to anybody, too. But of course, I am not a marketing professional either. And Ford should have know how brainwashed these customers were, they helped brain-wash them!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(donee @ Aug 9 2006, 08:27 PM) [snapback]300508[/snapback]</div>

Yep, like DC's innovative 'Stow-n-Go' seating saving the mediocre Caravan, a hybrid Turdstar minivan might actually have saved what was otherwise considered the worst minivan on the market. As it is, the Turdstar is being cancelled after just a few years of extremely poor sales.

AFAIK, Toyota (as usual) will be the first to the US market with a hybrid minivan and, as usual, they will likely clean-up with it.

Ford's statement of 'We goofed on SUVs' has to be the understatement of the year. My favorite upcoming Ford blunder will be the 'new' 2008 Focus. It's going to be completely reskinned on the outside but it's going to have the same old chassis and drivetrain it's had since 1999. A really new Focus isn't scheduled to arrive until 2010 (at the earliest).

 

So, if I'm getting this correctly, then Toyota made a mistake by catering to the irrational SUV crowd with the Highlander and RX400h SUVs? I mean, Ford did have the Escape Hybrid before the Highlander, so maybe Toyota should have gone for the minivan first?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(donee @ Aug 9 2006, 08:27 PM) [snapback]300508[/snapback]</div>

The problem with this, for Ford, is that while the Escape is competitive, they haven't made a competitive minivan in years. Which raises the question, why hasn't Toyota produced a hybrid Sienna yet? Is there more unutilized space in an SUV than a minivan in which to place the hybrid components? Are minivan owners less eager to assuage the guilt that torments a small minority of SUV buyers, motivating these few to pony up for a hybrid?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(donee @ Aug 9 2006, 08:27 PM) [snapback]300508[/snapback]</div>

Certainly true. "I NEED the space." Maybe, for some people. A lot of people driving SUVs could carry their usual loads in a Prius with careful packing and storing. A few smaller soft bags will be more useful and easier to store AND carry than 1 hard sided case for example.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(donee @ Aug 9 2006, 08:27 PM) [snapback]300508[/snapback]</div>

Maybe where you live. Around here, I'd bet that 90 percent of the SUVs never see a dirt road or tow anything.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(theorist @ Aug 10 2006, 11:41 AM) [snapback]300840[/snapback]</div>

I don't understand this either. They have been selling a hybrid minivan in Japan for years.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(AndrewGS @ Aug 9 2006, 10:44 PM) [snapback]300584[/snapback]</div>

Certainly the hybrid Highlander and RX400 are not the sales success that the Prius has been. I bet you haven't seen any dealers offering lower financing rates and other 'gimmies' on a Prius. I think the Highlander is way over priced for the average hybrid buyer. Not that people couldn't necessarily afford it, but if you are going to spend $5K or more extra for the hybrid, it better save a LOT more money in gas vs the non hybrid version or, like the Prius, have features that are desireable and not available in other vehicles.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(theorist @ Aug 10 2006, 10:41 AM) [snapback]300840[/snapback]</div>

Simply, logistics. The Sienna would be quite easy to build as a hybrid as it shares platforms with the Highlander and others, but the Sienna is built exclusively in the US while all of Toyota's hybrid vehicles are built in Japan. It would cost quite a bit to support building hybrid Siennas in the US, but I'm almost sure Toyota is working on it.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Aug 10 2006, 12:59 PM) [snapback]301032[/snapback]</div>

Made in USA doesn't necessarily means a lot of parts. Labor figures highly in the total x-factory price. The underlying hybrid technology could remain in Japan for a while yet.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(theorist @ Aug 10 2006, 08:41 AM) [snapback]300840[/snapback]</div>

Or better, why haven't they brought the (mild-)hybrid Estima/Previa over here?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Aug 10 2006, 02:59 PM) [snapback]301032[/snapback]</div>

The hybrid Camrys are all made in Japan for now. Same with the RX400h even though they've been building them in Canada for a while. They've been building Camrys in the US for a looong time, but there are still some coming from Japan. Actually, US-built Camrys have a majority of it's parts sourced in North America, but the Japanese Camrys use few North American-sourced parts.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(NuShrike @ Aug 10 2006, 05:58 PM) [snapback]301152[/snapback]</div>

Safety & emissions regulations. It's hard to get a car into the American market.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(NuShrike @ Aug 10 2006, 05:58 PM) [snapback]301152[/snapback]</div>

Don't remember what the hybrid market was like not too long ago, eh? How about the price of gas?

When HSD was introduced, the dinosaurs ruled. The roads were dominated by fast & powerful vehicles guzzling cheap gas. It was very obvious to those of us already driving Classic Prius that the perception of "overnight success" still meant several years of strong sales and media attention. Evidence of that is finally starting to reveal itself.

So now we are at the point when people question the wisdom of choices in the past. In other words, they're looking backward instead of forward. Shouldn't we be asking about what the next step should be?

It is very clear that people simply weren't paying attention until recently. After all, why would you if it wasn't time to purchase a new vehicle?

Hopefully, those documents I created to explain how the various hybrid systems work will help. Got any other suggestions to help, now that people are actually thinking about hybrids?

 

came across this interesting thread, while searching for the more recent ford to stop producing cars' thread.

 

Nice 12 year blast from the past.

 

funny how our lovely search engine found this, but couldn't find the new one.

 

At least we are “functional” today.

Haven’t been on much today, been enjoying the fruits of the Napa region and the some what overcast day:



Maybe someday you will too.

 

we live in hope...