Does it bother you that the Prius is not Union made?

No.

I don't belong to a union, and Kansas is a Right-to-Work state, so I don't feel that I'm impacted at all if my car was made by non-union labor.

 

I love the fact that it's not Union made. More power to Toyota for not using them.

 

I'd be bothered if it was made by someone like Wal-Mart. But as far as I'm aware, Toyota doesn't have that sort of rapacious corporate culture. It's not clear to me that its staff are suffering as a result of lack of unionisation. Perhaps the Japanese have decided to be efficient and cut-out the middleman - treat the staff decently in the first place, so they don't need to unionise.

Of course, maybe I'm being unduly naive about Toyota - feel free to correct me.

 

I'm with Tony. I work in the IT industry, and there is no such thing as a union for IT workers (in Australia anyway)... so I couldn't really care less.

 

I think the Unions had an important role some time ago, but I can't think of a "happy" experience I've had with any of my Union Made cars.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(gas hater @ Jul 9 2006, 05:18 PM) [snapback]283479[/snapback]</div>

No, it doesn't bother me one bit that the car is not union made, nor does it bother me that it is not American made. I bought the best and most reliable car on the market to fit my needs. When American Union made products can produce what I want that's reliable and fits my budget, then I'll be happy to buy from them. That's the beauty of competitive capitalism. Though I won't be holding my breath waiting for that to happen. Of the 8 vehicles I've owned or leased in my life, 5 were American Union made. And they all presented problems that I've never experienced in three Japanese made vehicles.

You bought your Prius for all the right reasons. Buying a vehicle "just because it is union made" is a exceptionally poor reason to buy a vehicle. Union made aside, does the vehicle actually well fit your wants and needs in a vehicle or are you wanting to buy it only because it is the only union made hybrid? Do you even need or want another vehicle? Are you in an auto industry union or an unrelated trade?

Are you facing any kind of union peer backlash for having bought a Prius?

Good luck working out the guilt trip you're riding.

 

No. As far as I know Toyota treats its employees fairly and does not abuse them. For me that is essentially what a union is for, to protect the workers from abuse or exploitation from their employer. Since Toyota does not abuse or exploit their workers, I'm fine with them.

 

My father retired from GM, as did several uncles, cousins, and one grandfather; none of them had sterling comments concerning unions or the UAW. It was a cost of being employed. I worked there for a few months. I saw many cases if sabotage and outright abuse committed by some employees. When they were reprimanded, the union stepped in and protected them. That was wrong, and my dad knew it, yet was powerless to change the 'mentality'.

He even broke the 'rule' when he bought a 1971 Toyota wagon for the good MPG! (His Olds got 9 MPG and the Corolla scored 25)

 

I can understand how you are torn. However, unions have probably done the most good for the big union bosses...they are the ones that benefit the most from all of the deals. Yes, the workers have more stability, etc...and most of us wish we had something guaranteed to us when we retire...

...but all of this comes at the expense of the companies that use Union labor. Let's face it, it is very expensive in the long run, because they are still paying for all of the retired workers. So these companies have to spend more for labor and have less for things like R&D...that is why Ford and GM still have not come up with a hybrid the even remotely resembles the Prius.

This is one of the main reasons that Union made, American cars are expensive for what you get. Some may seem less expensive, but that is because the Asian automakers have to pay large tariffs on their imports, and as proven over and over, the Asian made vehicles (Toyota, Honda, etc.) are just better made...less money to the unions = more money into the vehicle.

So, guilt aside - if the Prius was made using union labor it would probably be $5-7k more!

 

It was my turn to buy a new car, gas is going up, and I have owned 'American Made' cars/trucks and 'Asian Made' cars/trucks. Based on my experience, since last century I might add, the Toyotas I have owned are the best built, highest quality vehicles you can buy for the money. I'm on my 4th brand new Toyota since 1980 and not one of them has had a mechanical failure. I can't say that about the 14 (yes, 14) pages of repairs I have had on my wifes new Dodge Caravan in one year. And my wife, yes I love her, bought another new Dodge Caravan. Bite lip, bite tongue, keep mouth shut. :angry: Oh and yes, the Fords, Chevys, and other Dodges I have owned over the years have always seem to know when I had a little extra money saved up.

So to answer the question, I didn't even think about buying a union car. Well, I did but the answer was no.

 

Unions have their place in the early industrialization phases of a country, or in industries dominated by low-skill or no-skill workers exploited by corporations. Walmart and agricultural workers are good examples.

The auto insustry does not apply IMO, and like most other political institiutions the unions have decayed and become corrupted over time, making them even less of an attraction.

Bottom line: I have NO wish to support $65/hr GM blue-collar workers (wages + benefits) with my $100/hr physician salary (wages + benefits).

 

I have seen the effect of unions in healthcare and I am more than happy to support a non-union company. I believe that the day when unions were beneficial has gone by. Now they just further increase the cost of product and promote maintaining sub-standard employees.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(gas hater @ Jul 9 2006, 02:18 PM) [snapback]283479[/snapback]</div>

Your premise is incorrect. Every Prius made so far has been union made.

The ICFTU (International Confederation of Free Trade Unions) is the international body made up of free trade unions (i.e., labour unions not controlled by a government).

JTUC-RENGO is the Japanese affiliate of ICFTU,

JAW is the Japanese Auto Workers federation that is affiliated with JTUC-RENGO.

The 273,000 members of the Federation of All Toyota Workers' Unions is an affiliate of JAW.

The workers at the Japanese plant where the Prius is made are members of the Federation of All Toyota Workers' Unions.

So sleep easy, knowing that your car is union-made.

 

No, No and furthermore NO!

Unions had their day in this country but if you want the to support the unions you are supporting part of the problem. I've been self employed for 21 years and I don't get any Union benefits nor do my employees. I treat them far and pay 75% of their health care. I don't need a Union to tell me how to treat people.

I don't mind if is made in some type of organization, but it does not have any influence on my choice to by a Prius. It's a technical marvel and an extremely great car.

---Kent

 

Hi All,

I really do not think Unions are the issue so much as a Union that is regionally industry wide. In that situation there is no competition to the Union. That is there is no free market of labor.

This extremely powerful situation that GM's Union has allows it to get out-of-balance rewards for its members work. These rewards come from some-where. In the present situation that "some-where" seems to be the where-with-all to weather the storm of inovation. Even Ford is having a problem here. From the go-along-to-get-along situation that exists in the big-three, this is great until another company finds the where-with-all to apply modern technology to cars.

You could see this all happening to GM in the 80's and 90's. They divested Delphi. They got rid of the technology oriented board member - H Ross Perot. Did they not own a division of Hughes too? They crushed the EV-1's. Why? To pay the bills. The bills that come from out-of-wack rewards to employees.

GM has the research (PHD's) to come up with new car paradigms to address modern issues. Just look at what they have done with the FC Skateboard. Although its debatable it addresses modern issues, its one hell of a technological tour-de-force. They were also ahead of the curve in Hybrids in the 1970's and 80's. They are ahead of the curve in Hybrid buses. GM just cannot afford the masters level development army to make it happen for cars. The year-to-year stuff can turn-over just fine with the engineering techs and craftsmen, bachelauriets, and a few masters level managers.

So, I think the question is mute. I do not have an issue with buying the Prius from non-unionized Japan, as I do not have any hope that the present state of affairs will allow American car company execs to allow American engineers the oportunity to make a paradigm busting Prius-like vehicle. And a Prius-like vehicle is the neccassary tool for my commuting situation.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(gas hater @ Jul 9 2006, 09:32 PM) [snapback]283583[/snapback]</div>

How is his wage relevant? Do you have any idea the costs and time incurred to become a Doctor and the amount of time it takes most doctors to reach that pay scale?

I personally hate unions today. All they are is a way for employees to force employers hands and get higher wages or other demands met. In most cases, I've never seen them as anything more than extorionists.

Give a choice at one point of working at a supermarket that was non-union or one that was union, I chose the non-union.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(brandon @ Jul 9 2006, 05:24 PM) [snapback]283485[/snapback]</div>

Cheers! I agree!