Does anybody else think the PiP is overpriced ???

Off hand, anybody who has the money and does not buy the car

There will almost always be many more people who do not buy an item, than those who do. If you are looking for justification for your actions, I'm sure you will find some.

Do you feel all better now ?

 

If you are looking for the best value then buy a stripped Corolla or Hyundai and drive it until the wheels fall off then get another. Anything more than that is spending money above and beyond what is needed to get from A to B.

Personally I enjoy the technology of the Prius and it's actually a more comfortable car than anticipated. Getting great mileage is fairly effortless. I have a PIP reserved, not sure if I'll use the spot with so many plug ins coming in the next 2 years but with the tax credit I don't think it's the worst value out there.

 

You can't compare a base PiP with Prius II, because it has many more features standard like Nav,backup cam, heated seats(which even Prius III does not have) etc. I would compare it with 2012 Prius III and add a few hundreds more for things like heated seats etc. Then the price difference comes to around 6K after the federal rebate(not including any CARB rebates or other state incentives or HOV access).

I personally did not buy the base PiP(even though I booked one) because I could not get any other state/CARB rebates to make it affordable to me plus I would have to pay for shipping it to my home.

Above all if I could AFFORD to swing it, I would have definitely bought one not worrying about its payback because its "investing in our future". Just imagine how we would be feeling today if Toyota killed the Prius because not enough people bought its early generations.

 

At the time that Toyota priced the PiP, the Dollar was on a 5-year slide down against the Yen. So, that fact I'm sure influenced the pricing. Recently the Dollar is up against the yen. The Dollar hit a low of around 76 Yen. Today it is 81.06.

 

And yes, batteries are expensive. Look at the price difference between a Cruze and a Volt. Lose a seat, add a few hundred pounds of lithium, and double the price.

Good things and new things are expensive at first. It needs help to get going, and eventually the price drops as the technology progresses and volumes increase.

 

There is a difference between the value not being worth it and not being able to afford it financially.

 

With a 6K difference I definitely see value in the base PiP. I did not buy it cause I could not afford my monthly payment going up by a 100 bucks.

 

The market will determine if the PiP is overpriced. If Toyota can sell them, it's not overpriced.

Tom

 

Yeah, I think it's overpriced.

But I also think all new vehicles, or purchasing a new vehicle is always a luxury purchase.

You can always go cheaper. With used, or public transportation, or a bicycle. If you can afford a brand new vehicle, you have expendable income.

I think the better wording, is not to ask "Is the PiP overpriced?", but to ask "Is the PiP a good value?".

Then you can apply personal criteria. How much is each visit you DON'T make to a gas station worth to you? How much is the idea that you are polluting the air around you that much less with every drive you make worth to you?

You can expand from there, to concepts and political and social opinions, worldwide opinions concerning fossil fuel and finite supply and dependency.

All these things and more I probably haven't even thought of can be factored into whether a PiP is a good "value" to the individual.

I don't think anyone buys a Prius of any sort, if they don't care about something beyond the simple vehicle and the "cost". You just want a comfortable utilizable hatchback? If cost of the vehicle vs. Comfort and ammenities are your primary motivating factor? You'd end up with many of the competitors.

Toyota is selling the concept as much as the real product. Is there a premium being charged to be able to plug in? Is there a premium being charged to go green? Is there a premium being charged to go to your garage and unplug your vehicle and electrically head off to work in the morning while your neighbors are firing up their ICE's and heading off to the races? Certainly.

I don't think anyone would deny it. Even with the relative great success of Prius, Hybrids, Electrics, Plug In's....(ALTERNATIVES) are still the minority. If you want to join the first wave of any of these fronts, you'll pay a premium.

Take away the full electric reality of The Leaf...and it's little more than a Versa on steroids. The Prius C...looks a lot like my Honda Fit..., The Volts "tin" isn't much more than a Chevy Cruze, and the Prius, Prius V? They have their arguable standard counterparts as well.

Nobody buys any of these vehicles if cost. vs. what you end up sitting in, is the ultimate standard of evaluation.

The personal reasons people "Value" the purchase of a Pip, or Prius, or Volt are numerous and diverse. How could I, or anyone speak to all of them? I think you can look at the Prius and say it's a $21,00-$22,000 vehicle and make an argument that it is, or should be...

But you can look at HSD, and all that includes, that doesn't exist on any other class of vehicle, and conclude that The Prius and counterparts could be priced much, much higher.

It comes down to what you personally value. Do we BS ourselves? Yes, I think to an extent we do. We all do. People pay 100's of thousands of dollars for vehicles that are small, cramped and uncomfortable, that's main attribute is burning fuel at high rates, and the ability to go from 0-60 in less than 5 seconds. Is any "Super Car" a good value? Well unless your rich uncle left you a race track, I'd say no. But evidently to many people 0-60 as fast as possible is a criteria that creates personal value. For others? 50 mpg, and low emissions, creates personal value.

Is the PiP overpriced? Yes, like a Ferrari, like all luxury products. It's simultaneously overpriced and a great value...depending on what you want.

 

Maybe where electricity is dirt cheap (or free) the PIP makes sense, but here in NY it doesn't make financial sense. Here's my numbers....

Here in NY- after taxes, delivery charges, yada, yada... electricity is $0.20/kWh (that's 20 cents per kilo watt hour).
Toyota says the PIP draws 12 amps @ 120 volts for three hours to charge a depleted PIP EV battery. That's 1.44kWh per hour for three hours- total is 4.32kWh consumed to charge the battery. At $0.20/kWh x 4.32kWh it costs $0.86 (86 cents) to charge the battery. Full charge gets you 13 miles in EV mode. $0.86 divided 13 mi comes out to $0.066 (6.6 cents) per mile.

Regular Gen III Prius gets 50mpg, at $4/gallon for fuel it comes out to $0.08 (8 cents) per mile.

At $0.014 (1.4 cents) per mile saved with the PIP- You'd have to drive over 350,000 miles to recoup the $5000 extra cost over the regular Prius. And that's not including the cost to replace the PIP EV battery when it dies.

For most areas- it just doesn't seem possible to even break even with the PIP vs the regular Prius.


PS- I don't buy the feel good line- "well you're not burning fuel cause it runs on electricity" thing either. My local power plant gets weekly tanker barge deliveries of fuel oil to generate electricity. So fossil fuel is still being burned by EV owners. Mater of fact- we just learned yesterday that our local electric supplier has been granted a one month rate increase of 1.5% to offset increased fuel costs to produce electricity.

 

revhigh,

look at interior features ....

the Prius Plug-in base has nearly identical features to the 2012 Three

PiP base is $33k on sticker
2012 liftback Three is $26.5k..

that's $6,500 difference cost before TTL

by the numbers, EPA energy cost / year is
$1000 for PiP
$1110 for Prius

$6,500 / $110 = 59 years roughly to make up energy cost savings.

very basic analysis, but gives an idea.