Boosting Fuel Efficiency : Kerry: Billions for car industry

Wait a moment here. JFK just last month said in his campaign ads that the rollback would fund his health care initiative. Hope his campaign gets the message straight before the election.

 

Kerry said he would fund alternative energy, provide health care to everyone, increase the size of the military, and balance the budget. He said he would fund it all by eliminating the tax cuts for people with incomes over $200K. He also promised to fund a lot of stuff like schools and fire-fighting and police.

Kerry is a politician. Only a very naive person expects a politician to keep his promises. But since he cannot do any of this without the Congress, he can always blame them for his failure.

My guess is he'll roll back the tax cuts and fund the military, and give some crumbs to alternative energy and health care.

I think the guy stinks. But if he gets elected, at least we'll be rid of Ashcroft and Cheney, we'll have a president who can speak at least one language, and we can start regaining some of the respect America once had in the world.

 

As Bill Maher said...Tax and spend is better than don't tax and spend.

Though I'd prefer don't tax and don't spend myself. :mrgreen:

But remember, people...the Republicans do still control the House and Senate. They might lose the Senate, but they won't be losing the House. Kerry isn't going to be able to repeal the tax cuts and radically change spending habits unless Congress is under complete Democract control.

In other words, we're gonna see stagnation. But I say it's better than one man (the President) getting what he wants without the natural checks and balances of power.

 

Well, if we didn't need Mideast oil, we wouldn't be over there fighting an oil war in Iraq. The billions spent there could be better spent in developing alternative energy and teaching American car makers how to build hybrids. Bio-diesel and methanol are the fuels of the future because they are readily available from America's vast, productive farmlands. Build a bio-diesel/electric hybrid Prius and America is free from the tyranny of the OPEC. Learn to cleanly gassify American coal and again, we are free. Develop a battery that can power the hybrid to a greater degree and can be recharged with solar panels on the roof of the car and again, we are free. These projects are not really the province of government, but since American car makers are so short-sighted and beholden to Arab oil interests, government may have to take the initiative.

I remember when the first JFK set a national goal of going to the moon before the end of the 1960s. Here was a great technological undertaking that was successful because the people believed in it. Don't you think that energy independence can be an even greater project with even greater appeal?

 

I don't think we're fighting an oil war...more like a revenge war to make good on the goals of a certain President's daddy. If this were really about oil, then Bush would have dropped embargos on Libya and Cuba, allowing American companies to deal in the oil there.

 

So, how much did this stupid little war cost us anyways? Plus, there are no way of keeping idiots from bombing places and killing people. Look at Bush.. he's one.. and we made him our president. Terrorist will come and go. We should have never spent soo much money on such a little issue.

What if we were to spend that money on making our independence from the oil companies. How much money? I'm sure if we gave a fraction of that money to Ford.. they would have been able to build several good hybrid systems by now. Curently they are leasing the technology from Toyota. But, the money comes from there pocket. If the Goverment were to give them a huge sum to invest in advanced hybrids... (alternative fuels are still a waist of time... more like.. they are too many steps ahead) Ford would be producing more hybrids. They would be able to produce them for a fair cost too, since the money didn't come out of there pockets.

then again. maybe it wouldn't have changed anything.. but it's nice to dream. :mrgreen:

 

It may be right that this is a revenge war, but that one was about oil for sure so I don't know if it makes much difference.

I think that a key part of straightening this mess out is to raise the price of gas. Not to throw money around to car manufacturers or to hybrid buyers. It's artificially low now anyway, especially when you consider the cost of wars, environmental protection, and fighting terrorism that are paid for from other sources. If gas cost $6/gal, you'd see lots of hybrids on the market and on the roads PDQ.

 

My father once came up with an idea. there are 52 weeks a year.. and 50 states. For a week, raise the gas price in each state. We would have to learn to deal with high gas prices for a week. Well.. actualy the prices would be doubled for a week. This extra money would go to a purpose we approve. So every so often, we would vote on a purpose. These would be listed. So the item #1 won.. well.. the item that came in 2nd.. would be next to get fixed.. and the item in 3rd would be third.. the rest would be voted on later.

But the main point is to make people learn to conserve fuel for a week. You would know when the week is comming. And it would only hapen for 1 week out of a year for each state.

I think this is a good idea to get us used to conserving fuel. We really wouldn't have a whole lot to complain about. Either we conserve, or don't drive for a week.. Which some will apply that habbit to their lives.. and some will just complain.. but that's the way it works. It will do some good.. and the money raised would go to a purpose we approve. :mrgreen:

 

The price of gas is headed up again, thanks to the inept and corrupt Russians and their infighting over Yukos. We can also thank the Chinese and Indians, who have now decided they also want to live like we do.

I believe that we need to make energy independence a NATIONAL priority - similar to the effort put into WWII or the 1960s space program. The one thing this nation seems to lack is a national direction, a goal that is embraced by all to the benefit of all citizens. The greed fostered by the Reagan years, when everyone was led to believe that we can all be rich and gotta-get -mine attitude has ripped this country apart. The most sinister thing to come out of the Reagan era was the end of the graduated income tax. Class warfare doesn't openly exist -yet- but there is no sense of national direction.

An increase in the gas tax has been proposed by many for some time. Even Dick Cheney pushed this during the last campaign, but it was ignored. In spite of complaints about it from many, it would be a 'progressive' tax since those that choose to drive the big SUVs would pay more than the poor schmoo driving an Echo or Accent. In most cases, the SUV owner has a higher income than the econobox driver.

 

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Kerry is promising money for the car industry to get votes in MI, OH and PA. Whats happened to the billions already given to GM, Ford and DC?
Where did that go and what did we get for it?
On another matter, I would recommend considering making the gas guzzler tax permanent, annual and broaden the scope. As an example, if you buy a Bentley and pay $2500 in GG tax its a one time fee yet the car will be licensed for years at 10 or 12MPG. Take the EPA mileage average and tax the difference between increasing annual goals. Example: Our current MPG is 21MPG, if the goal is 28MPG tax any vehicle $100/MPG below the goal. That way gas itself is not taxed but the people who use the most pay for it. The efficient motorist gets rewarded.

 

I agree that taxing gas guzzlers is a good idea, but that doesn't discourage them from being driven once they're bought. Raising the price of gas simply reflects the fact that it's a very valuable resource. When the price accurately reflects the value then the free market will find all sorts of ways to economize on its use.

 

$1.5 billion in federal money has already been spent helping the big three develop hybrid vehicles.

Supercar Project

Why is it that we can't buy the 72 MPG Ford Prodigy or Daimler Chrysler ESX3, or the 80 MPG General Motors Precept? Because the big three have a much higher profit margin on their pickup trucks and SUVs. In addition, they don't want to set a precedent for building high efficient vehicles because it questions the fuel efficiency of all their other vehicles. Fortunately for us, Toyota developed their own hybrid vehicle after being denied participation in the Supercar Project.

 

GGtax

deh2k: You'll note that my previous comment recommended consideration of making the gas guzzler (GG) tax annual. This would mean that every year a car gets plates, renewal or otherwise, it would be subject to the GG tax differential as compared to our goals. If people want to drive gas hogs, make'm pay. The true or total cost of gasoline is not reflected in the pump price. So why does the government allow gas hogs to exist? Because it employs thousands of citizens working in car plants that make thousands of $ per vehicle. Remember, auto workers vote too. Profits attract resources.
Also, the idea of a "free market" would be great if we had one. As an economist, we are far from it; note trade credits and subsidies for agriculture, export, etc. A pound of sugar in the US costs 24cents; world price is about 8cents. Why? Because the US has a tariff on imported sugar to protect the sugar companies. A true free market exists only when government actions do not exist.
And thats my soapbox for the day. Regardless of opinion, please remember to vote!

 

Gas guzzler tax did exist during the 1972 gas crisis and , I believe, during the Carter era. The howling was tremendous and eventually got them removed. In corresponding with some Europeans on Echofans.net (back when I had my beloved Echo) , they said that some countries tax on the basis of engine displacement. For that reason 1.0 liter engines were the norm in Europe and Japan and the 1.5 liter model was considered a 'sport' model. This method of taxation is probably good, since it encourages smaller, more efficient engines. Why do people think they need a 4.0l v-8 to power cars that are only slightly heavier than a Prius? Given the inaccuracy of the EPA testing, using their numbers to set a gas guzzler tax would be open to all kinds of legal wrangling, so the displacement tax would be more likely to stand. And yes, this should also be tied in to yearly registration fees.

 

Oil in Cuba??? Think again! Cuba's got nothing but sugar and tobacco. And it's a tourist destination if you like the Caribbean (hot and humid).

Give money to Ford or any other U.S. company and they'll stuff every last cent of it into the pockets of their top executives.

This would set people who live far from their state's border against those who live near a border. The latter can just cross to the neighboring state to buy their gas during that week. No. I agree with the person who suggested a $6/gal gas tax, immediately, and for everyone. (And, BTW, a minimum wage law that actually pays enough to live on so people can afford to get to work.)

I also agree with an annual gas-guzzler registration tax.

But none of this is going to happen because big business owns our legislators, the president, and the contender.

 

There may not be much oil now, but that's not the point. Companies are exploring in Cuba and drilling for oil, since just about anywhere with prospects is getting a look. So companies are looking, but not American companies.

 

Cuba=sugar cane=fantastic source of ethanol. There is 'oil' in the fields of Cuba.

 

But not enough of it to make any difference to anyone, compared to the potential for ethanol (or biodiesel) of America's vast farmlands. Besides which, the actual energy profit in ethanol is a disputed matter. Factor in the energy cost of growing the cane, and the energy cost of distilling the alcohol, and we're not exactly talking Saudi Arabia here.

 

Well my point certainly wasn't the sugar cane...it's just that anywhere they has any potential is going to be explored, and Cuba just so happens to be one of those places. Makes sense, after all, since the Gulf of Mexico was such a huge source of oil, and there are new findings in Trindad, I believe.