Bloody Politicians

:angry: Agreed!

 

I just heard this on the all-news station I listen to out of Chicago, but they worded it a little differently. They said the US Chamber of Commerce was considering switching ALL cars to a mileage-based system. They did say it was because hybrids don't buy enough gas, however.

I think it's interesting that people say hybrids don't do anything for air pollution or to reduce our dependency on oil, yet somehow we are responsible for the federal Highway Trust Fund running out of money?

:blink:

 

I'd be much happier if they just added a $1 tax to gas prices. Let everyone pay for it based on how much gas they use. Not only would we (hybrid owners) pay less, but it might help push more people to use hybrids.

What they are proposing would do the exact opposite! Any gas savings someone might see would likely be wiped out by extra taxes.

 

In the upside down world of politics, this makes perfect sense. Punish those who try to save fuel, lower emissions, and reduce imports of crude, and reward those who drive a giant - especially GM branded - SUV.

 

That's a ridiculous proposal and one that will never fly. Tax those who save fuel??

How idiotic.

Ken

 

Keep an eye on this. "They" may not directly tax hybrids...but I sure can see an "alternative minimum tax" on cars. This could be in the form of registration fees, or import fees, or "road use" taxes based on mileage.

And Maytrix, I know the Prius uses less gas, but it still uses gas and I DON'T WANT ANY MORE BLOODY TAXES....that is NOT the answer and you must have a bottomless pit of money...I don't.

The gov't will NOT use that extra dollar to clean the environment...it will be used for even more entitlements...i.e. buying votes.

 

I wish I had a bottomless pit of money, but as of today, I'm still searching for it.

I like the thought of raising gas taxes, for 2 reasons.

1) It would be minimal for those that get good fuel economy
2) It would be another step to get people to move towards more fuel effiecient vehicles.

Just look at what Katrina did - a lot more people started to use alternative means or look at hybrids. It will take something like this (raising of gas prices) to get most people to make a change. An extra $1 per gallon only means $10 or so more for us Prius owners. If that's going to break anyone's bank, then they probably shouldn't own a car.

If a $1 tax increase was put in place, it would need to clear what it was to be used for. If they need more money to fix roads, I'm all for it coming from gas prices, since that's directly related to how much someone drives.

 

What I don't get is, why hybrids? I seem to recall plenty of economy car options in the 70's 80's and 90's that represented a higher percentage of car owners than hybrids do now. I don't believe that hybrids are really any kind of a problem in the exploitation of the citizens incomes for money to blow like lottery winnings.

IMO, the government can go pound sand. Better yet, let's require every one of 'em all go serve some time in the Middle East for their oil war.

 

Why blame the 'politicians'? It sounds to me like the US Chamber of Commerce (i.e. "Big Business" is promoting the tax.

 

The political machine is not doing anything new by increasing the tax/revenues on alternative fuel vehicles. I drove a propane dual fuel truck for years. I paid an annual state propane tax based upon the number of mile I drove each year. More I drove, the more they wanted. It was an efficient and clean burning machine but I couldn't catch a break on any type of real saving with the way the fuel tax was implemented. The same concept/law will probably be put into play soon with higher taxes hitting those who drive the most. Better start writtng my representatives and senators!!!!

 

This particular proposal isn't going to use the money to clean the environment, but I'm not sure it's going to be used for "buying votes..."

From everything I've read, this is for the Highway Trust Fund... what the government uses to maintain our highway system, fill in potholes, maintain and build new bridges...

This particular tax isn't pure evil... but it's a necessary evil...

Think of it this way. Without more tax money gonig into this fund, our highways will continue to deteriorate... more potholes, more damage to our cars that we drive on those crumbling highways, and more frustration due to delays for unending construction.

That's what the gas tax pays for... another problem is that the tax on gas is not indexed for inflation... as time goes on, the trust fund will shrink as inflation hits us harder... indexing based on inflation would ensure higher gas prices, of course, and that's not popular for those that drive guzzlers...

the theory has always been that the more gas that you burn, the more you use our highways, and the more damage you do to the roads... thus, a gas guzzler that gets 10 miles to the gallon will weigh more and cost more to maintain...

... but changing to a system that charges for miles driven is a step back... it can ONLY benefit drivers of bigger vehicles, and unfairly gives them a deep discount, even though they are likely to do the most damage to the roads.

 

The idea is that hybrids burn less gas than a regular car for the same number of miles driven, so hybrids pay fewer gas taxes... so they need to compensate and tax us for driving a more efficient vehicle.

I don't like the idea, but I understand where they're coming from...

I honestly think that if they are going to tax us, they should continue to tax those who use highways more, and do the most damage to the roads by driving bigger vehicles that rip apart the road...

 

I agree... the tax should stay with gas... that way it will continue to be an encouragement to car makers to continue to improve their fuel economy.

Moreover, gas prices not only is directly related to how much someone drives, but is also related to the amount of damage a car does to the road.

 

A tax on hybrids is foolish. Definitely mixed signals going on there. But the proposed tax seems like a use tax based on miles driven, not necessarily a tax on hybrids. I will never support any tax that will penalize an efficient vehicle (Prius) more than it would a big SUV or Hummer.

That said, I support a new $1 GAS TAX ON ONLY ONE CONDITION. If ALL OF THE REVENUE from the new tax was used to get our cars off of gas. It should be used to Research ALTERNATIVE/RENEWABLE CLEAN ENERGY, such as hydrogen-powered vehicles, electric-only vehicles, or any technology leading toward cars that do not consume petroleum-based products. If we give the government an extra $1 per gallon, they will spend it on wasteful things. We must CRAFT THE TAX LAW so it assures that the extra tax is actually working to advance cars to the next generation of energy sources.

I agree that increasing gasoline taxes would raise fuel prices to a level that would cause people to think about vehicles with newer technology, such as hybrids. It would encourage auto manufacturers to improve efficiency. The tax revenue would go to those who are developing improvements.

Perhaps the tax needs to start at 25 cents per gallon and phase in over 4 years up to the $1 per gallon level, maybe starting in 2007. People would begin to make plans for their next vehicle knowing that fuel will be more costly. Automotive manufacturers would begin to make incremental changes like modifying camshaft profiles and gear ratios to maximize fuel efficiency instead of acceleration, followed by long-term changes like hybrid and/or hydrogen technology. Perhaps we can refine this idea some more, but I really like it if we can use the tax revenue to advance the current state of the art (get our cars off of gasoline dependency).

 

Sounds like another bunch of intelligent handwaving by committee to look good to the constituents. As if there's enough gas efficient cars on the American roads to tax.

After all, it's not-using-gas destroys the roads, not mass * acceleration = weight.

 

Sounds like the same quality thinking that brought us cold fusion and New Coke.

 

After the profits reported by the oil companies, how can any government committee recommend higher gas taxes without feeling embarassment and shame?!
I don't believe higher taxes are ever the answer.
Enacting a special tax on hybrids would be a slap in the face to those of us who are trying in good faith to use less gas and pollute less. Our government would be sending us the message that it just doesn't matter what we do when it comes to gas use, either way they'll find a way to take my money.
It's like, why even try to do something considerate? Might as well buy a hummer and take off the emission control devices and drive around.

 

Sid....gotta agree with you. Just found an incentive program from the great state of Texas. http://www.tceq.state.tx.us/implementation/air/terp/ld.html The program provides around $2000+ per car to manufacturers who sell hybrids in Texas. I was really hyped up on this at first, thinking I would be the one to get the $incentive$, but nope. Just the people selling the vehicles to us will receive the incentives. Bummer....gonna have a talk with my friendly Toyota dealership tomorrow about this program...might have some negotiation value when buying a hybrid from them...

 

I don't understand where they're coming from. Hybrids represent the same type of vehicles I mentioned before. I seem to recall the 70's when those little Datsun B210's, Honda CVCC's, and Toyota Corollas that used to get 40 plus miles to the gallon while driving alongside 12 mpg beasts like the Ford LTD's, Lincoln Continentals, and Chevy Caprices.

Fast forward to the 80's, and the CVCC gave in to the Civic, Datsun became Nissan, and they had the Stanza, The Mazda GLC was on the roads, Ford had their Euro derived Festiva, which later was replaced by the Festiva. Chevy had the Sprint, Geo came online and gave us the Metro, Suzuki came stateside with the Swift. The Koreans brought us the Excel.

Most of those models soldiered along through the 90's. Daihatsu came and went, as did the Subaru Justy. The Festiva gave way to the Aspire, and Kia brought us the Rio.

All of those cars represent a far broader choice in vehicles built soley for the purpose of sipping fuel, and were FAR more prevalent than the number of hybrids on the roads today. Sorry, but I must repeat that hybrids are NOT the cause of their shrinking coffers. Hybrid cars are simply being used as an excuse to justify yet another money grab from the "peasants." The current fuel tax by the gallon system is fair. The more you consume, the more you pay.

If the government is having problems balancing their books, there's plenty of wasteful spending that can easily be reigned in, and funding reappropriated for legitimate uses. My wallet is NOT the governments piggy bank.