Battery polarity

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by Nooner, Aug 29, 2019.

  1. Nooner

    Nooner Junior Member

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    Hi guys - yes another idiot here! 2008 prius with around 130,000 miles.

    My battery died on me last week after long trip from UK to Spain (it died an hour from home). I had it charged by road assistance and finished my trip. It worked for a few days but then died again. I knew it was about 4 years since I last changed it, so I took the battery out and took it to the same shop that I bought the old one from. I bought the same battery as before, with the same code and spec/dimensions etc.
    I just completely missed that they had reversed the terminals so positive was now in the negative position and vice versa... you know what happens next.

    When I started the car nothing happened. Complete silence. No bang, no smell, no smoke. Nothing. But the car was completely dead.

    I quickly realized what had happened, tried to put it right but of course nothing happened and the car was still dead. I took the battery back and got a new one.

    I tested all the fuses under the hood, steering wheel and in the trunk. The only one that had definitely blown was the ETCS fuse. The weird thing is, I've read hundreds of people's experiences on here where the DC DC 100amp fuse blows when this happens - but in my case, visually at least, it is in perfect condition. The same goes for the 120amp fuse in the trunk and the inverter fuse next to it.

    So anyway, having replaced the ETCS fuse and put in the new battery, nothing happened. Completely dead as before.

    So then I checked all the fuses again and this time noticed the Dome fuse had blown - I'm not sure if I hadn't checked it properly first time round or if it blew in the process of trying to start the car. I replaced that and tried to start the car again. This time it whirred and the open door made the car beep. Some of the interior lights now work and the horn beeps. Unfortunately, the engine light also came on and stayed on. I've checked all the fuses again and all seem to be working fine.

    Now I'm lost. Is there a way to test the 100amp fuse with a multimeter?
     
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    Yes, you can put an ohm meter on either end to check continuity
     
  3. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    And check the 12v, to be sure it wasn’t damaged
     
  4. Nooner

    Nooner Junior Member

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    Thanks, I'll see if I can check the 100amp fuse. I already switched the 12v battery, it's a new one in there now.
     
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  5. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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  6. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    Regarding the 100A DC/DC fuse, start by measuring voltage across the battery charger when the Prius is READY. If you get 13.8VDC then that fuse and the DC/DC converter are operational. If you don’t, then one or both have a problem.
     
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  7. Nooner

    Nooner Junior Member

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    Thanks for the help so far.

    I tested the battery, although not in ready mode because I can't do that. It measured at 11.3v at first, then went up to 12.3 when I tried to turn the car on.

    I tested the ohm on the main fuse but couldn't get a reading, which I presume means it has blown? I tested its voltage and one side was steady at 12.2v whilst the other side ranged from 0.3-1.5v. This was the same as all of the other little fuses in that rectangle box. I have no idea if that means it's blown or if the fact it's giving me a reading means it hasn't.

    Here's an image of the fuse. From the photos I've seen on this site, this looks nothing like the others that have blown. The discoloring on the top part is actually more visible on the photo than in real life. It's that part that's giving the low volt reading.

    fuse.JPG
     
  8. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    When you measure voltage at a fuse, both sides should measure the same voltage. If one side is much lower, the fuse has blown.
     
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  9. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    Sure looks blown to me. And your voltage readings confirm that as @Patrick Wong said.
    173189_fuse.jpg
     
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  10. Nooner

    Nooner Junior Member

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    Yeah I think the readings give it away. I'll get it towed to Toyota on Monday and will keep you informed on whether or not there was any further damage.
     
  11. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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  12. Nooner

    Nooner Junior Member

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    To be honest my wife is just about ready to kill me. A simple battery changed has already cost us days in time, money and possibly our car! I'll get a quote and if it's under a couple of hundred euros I'm happy to just pay that right now. Gonna de devastated if the inverter has gone too!
     
  13. Nooner

    Nooner Junior Member

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    Disaster!

    The inverter is blown too. Amazing how something so simple can destroy a car. Quote from Toyota is around 3500 euros in total. Strangely enough the car is driving fine with a lot of lights on the dash and the hybrid battery not in use. Anyone know how long this might last before the car loses all power and cuts out?
     
  14. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    1. I am assuming that you have replaced all blown fuses and the blown fuse links depicted in your photo in your post 7 above. If you notice that any systems are not working (for example, interior cabin lighting, clock, MFD etc.) then you probably still have some blown fuses that have not been replaced.
    2. If the car is "driving fine" then it can be made READY. While the car is READY, measure voltage across the 12V battery, and report that measurement.
    3. If the voltage measurement is ~13.8VDC, the inverter is working.
    4. If the voltage measurement is much lower than that, the DC/DC converter in the inverter has failed.
    5. Should you confirm that the inverter needs to be replaced, I suggest you buy a used inverter on eBay or from whatever sources are available to you, and ask your local dealer to install it or else figure out how to do it yourself if you can do so without killing yourself. You potentially can be exposed to high voltages when removing the inverter orange cabling. Or find an independent hybrid specialist and ask that servicer to install a used inverter. The price of a used inverter in the US typically will be a few hundred USD.
    6. If you are considering DIY, there are several posts about how to replace the inverter and you can also obtain factory repair manual info at the Toyota Europe website. https://www.toyota-tech.eu/
     
    #14 Patrick Wong, Sep 6, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2019
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  15. Nooner

    Nooner Junior Member

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    Thanks for this. The dealer said the inverter was burnt and would definitely need replacing. He has no idea how long the car is going to run for but he advised me to do what you said - buy a used inverter and have a mechanic install it. They won't do it unless they get a brand new part from Toyota. I've had a look on ebay and the prices for a used one are actually really good I'm just not sure how easy it's going to be to find a mechanic who's going to want to do it.

    All broken fuses have been replaced for a cost 234 euros.

    There's not a chance I would do it myself, it's way above my capabilities. I will test the battery though.

    Has anyone got any experience of the inverter being destroyed but the car still running? Even my fuel consumption on the short trips I've done are the same as before.
     
  16. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    I again suggest you perform the test #3 above to confirm the inverter needs to be replaced.
     
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  17. Nooner

    Nooner Junior Member

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    The battery was 12.6 when car not running and 13.6 with the engine on. Now I'm stumped. On the dashboard the lights are the red triangle, the yellow hazard sign and the vsc light. There are also a couple of red lights on the consumption screen - a battery one and an exclamation mark through a car.
     
  18. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    sounds like a shady dealer. ask them for the codes they pulled
     
  19. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    The inverter is not the problem, if you measure 13.6VDC when READY. You need to retrieve the diagnostic trouble codes to determine what is going on.

    Since your dealer demonstrated technical incompetence with regards to diagnosing your Prius, I suggest you get Mini VCI so you can retrieve the DTC yourself.

    The warning icons on the MFD may point to a problem with the high voltage traction battery.
     
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  20. Nooner

    Nooner Junior Member

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    I'll order one of those and see what it brings up.

    Really strange situation with the dealer. He told me the inverter was totally burnt and it would cost around 3500e for them to replace it. But then he said to me that I should go to a scrap yard and I'll pick one up for less than 300e.

    I've just done a 60km round-trip with the car and it's driving as well as ever. The consumption is good and everything on the energy info screen shows that the battery seems good and in full working order.

    It's a head scratcher. I'll see what codes it throws up and let you know.

    Thanks again.