Automating Pulse and Glide / Mod

My thoughts would be a sort of macro. Back when I used to hack online games, we would use macros for repetitive training methods, or getting a botting program to repeat certain movements or press certain keys.

I haven't the slightest clue of how it could be done, but it would be similar to cruise control. Assuming you're going to be pulsing and gliding for a good distance, just as you would would turn CC on and "set" your speed, you would basically just record the positions of the gas pedal.

IE:
1. Turn cruise control (or w.e would be used for the recording)
2. Push "Record" (or "set" or w.e)
3. Pulse from, say, 34 to 40
4. Glide down to 34
5. Push "Set" (or "Stop" or "Record" again)

The macro would just need to loop itself. Pulsing up to 40, gliding to 34. Etc etc.

There should also be a way to "Resume" in case the driver were to need to brake or what not. Essentially press "Resume" and it would get back up to the speed the macro recording started, then it would just continue repeating the macro of pulsing and gliding.

Edit:

Didn't read your post entirely. =X Hadn't realized what you said was very similar to my post. Sorry

 

Great idea if you can make it work.

By "throttle" it sounds like you're actually referring to the accelerator versus engine throttle. The Japanese hypermilers have reported a pedal position of 38-40% (as reported by the CAN bus) to be optimal for pulsing. I'm not sure how practical that is, however, for most of us. I am constantly making making subtle (or occasionally not-so-subtle) adjustments in pedal position depending on speed, terrain, following traffic, and HV battery state of charge. I am not driving in the typical conditions of the Japanese drivers (who have exceeded 100 MPG in a tank), so there really is no one sweet spot for me.

Some have used cruise control to pulse: 1) Set it at, say, 35. 2) Glide to a speed of your choosing above 25 MPH (at which CC deactivates on its own). 3) Resume CC. But the problem is not whether it's aggressive enough; it's too aggressive, sometimes pushing RPM to 3000 or higher, well above optimal efficiency ranges for the ICE. And the 25 MPH cutoff is another limitation for me. I plan my routes to take best advantage of low-speed P&G where I routinely glide down to speeds of <25MPH.

Now, if you can figure out how to tie it to some direct or indirect indicator of ICE loading (e.g., RPM or injector timing) with some sort of CC-like control, then you might really be on to something.

 

Interesting idea. Can't be an easily done thing given the intense
scrutiny, attempted hacking/work-arounds that the Gen II
HSD/control algorithms has been subjected to over the years

On the electrical side, the go-pedal sends at least 2 signals which
are constantly monitired and compared not just for position but for
rate of change. I suspect it would be very difficult to finesse a false
signal stream. As I understand it, garbage in and the ICE shuts down
as a safety measure.

As to the cruise control, small differences between the set speed
and speed when re-engaging result in the computer trying to make
up the difference very quickly, with RPMs typically going well past
2800 RPMs and fuel efficiency drops off dramatically. IIRC, it does so
starting at ~2400 RPM. For this reason, before I re-engage the CC,
I accelerate podially -- ?? manually ?? -- to just above set speed.

FYI, here is a previous thread that pertains:
http://priuschat.com/forums/gen-ii-prius-modifications/53700-throttle-glide-postion-button-mod.html

Although not reflected in the in the thread, I was having a PM
discussion with Hobbit on the topic. From him I came it have an
inkling of the complexities of the go-pedal electrical system/signals.
He thought that a mecanical arrangement would be a real kludge,
and unlikely to be truely workable.

Separately, I wonder what has become of Hobbit, lo these many
months without a post. I miss him, and I pray that he is all right.

 

That's what I was thinking also. Someone (Hobbit?) said IGN 14 is good for efficient pulsing. I find it relatively easy to hit IGN 14 except when it's very cold out it would be pegged around 12 no matter what I do with the accelerator (I haven't tried flooring it - don't think that would save any fuel). Anyone with similar experience?

 

I can't contribute any technical expertise here, but I have wanted this for years. I have wondered how Toyota never thought of this, or whether they never applied it to avoid cannibalizing their other hybrids.

Well you all have my support on this

 

perhaps it would not be legal.

 

I was contemplating this same idea on a long road trip I just took.

So, no way to connect a laptop to the prius and control the throttle?

Then you could write a simple program to do it.

 

I'm sure Google could tell you how to do it.

 

I always thought it would be a good idea to make an automated system that works by adjusting the cruise control. The driver would set a desired speed on the cruise control like normal and when the car started pushing the engine faster than is efficient (as it tends to do going up a hill), the system would detect this and lower the cruise control set point until the injector pulse length is back into optimum. When the car slows down and there is some head room, the set point can be adjusted back up until either the pulse length is too long again or the operator set point is reached.

Adjusting the cruise up and down should be as easy as intercepting the wires from the cruise control stock. The hard part will be reading the set point. If the cruise control data is available on the OBD port, it could be pretty easy.

Another benifit is if the whole thing goes wacko all you have to do it tap the break or otherwise disengage the cruise control.

Not exactly P&G, but it sure would help the MPG. Just a thought. If you implement it, I would like a free unit as a finders fee; I'd even participate in the testing.

 

I like to pulse on my own, I just want there to be a glide button. This is slightly different than neutral, since the glide still gives a little battery oomph to push the car along, as most of us know.

I can only assume it's not as easy as this, I'm guessing you guys who know what you're talking about (in direct opposition to myself :-D) would have thought of this - is there anyway to fool the computer regarding percent of gas pedal depression? A glide is definitely a very small but fixed range with the pedal, it seems as though a button telling the car it's at 7-10% (or whatever it is) could do the trick(?).

 

Messing with the Go Pedal output could have Legal issues.

I see no reason other than the above why it cannot be manipulated inexpensively.
A few months ago there was a thread on the subject which informed that there was a device available which could change the TPS vs Output curve, unfortunately the cost then was around $400.

 

Yea, I was thinking of this as well. Do you think Google hacked it themselves or do you think Toyota gave them the source code for the ECU.

Clearly if they can make the thing drive itself, than making an auto pulse and glide cruise control should be easy.

 

I've been thinking about a mechanical system mentioned by the OP, to keep the systems in glide mode. It would apply just enough pressure via a bicycle shift cable to the accelerator to get it in glide. I'm still really new to driving the Prius, but it seems a little tedious to use your foot to apply that correct amount of pressure when desired. I'll report my results and design if I try it out.

 

you could throw it into neutral.