Auto Stop Start in non hybrid

With starter motors - I know Mazda don't use a starter motor - they prime the engine with a fuel charge and in approx TDC, kick off with a hit of spark to fire it into life. There are other technologies in use, including mild-hybrid systems.

Those which do use the starter motor, but the motor is different, with better brushes and bearings etc.

I don't know of any which killed the engine before it was stopped. I've driven a few (though don't recall a Honda) - and they all stopped once the vehicle was stopped - and if it was almost stationary and you put your foot down, it just resumed without re-starting. Some cut or reduce the fuel flow while decelerating.

 

The car I test-drove in 2016 had it. It didn't work initially, but the sales-lady eventually remembered that the engine/gearbox have to be warmed up completely, so we drove it further, and yes, it worked fine. Not quite as smooth as a PRIUS.

Mazda I-stop Explained - Idling Stop - Discover Your Mazda

 

These have been in cars for 15+ years now... This is what GM called a "mild hybrid". Most of them are absolutely terrible. The most recent ones are much better than they used to be. But still extremely annoying to anyone who has ever driven a real hybrid.

 

Here in Europe just about every car has a stop-start system.

With most cars that have automatic transmissions it is activated when you are at a complete stop and leave your foot on the brake and when you lift your foot it starts again. They implement additional electric oilpumps if the gearbox is a traditional automatic gearbox to have oilpressure when the engine is off.

With manual transmissions the system is activated when you are in neutral and take your foot of the clutch pedal. When you press the clutch it starts again.

It is not as smooth as with hybrid vehicles since they start of on the electric motor so the engine has time to start and wake up.

 

The truck I rented when I moved here about 3 years ago had an auto stop start Diesel engine. I believe the technology is required in some areas to reduce pollution from engine idling.

 

never heard of it in toyota

 

Seems like it now exists for some Toyota gassers:

 

I'm for any cross-over, shared concept or idea that makes all vehicles more efficient.

I would speculate the challenge is selling the idea. That is, I'm thinking the audience that would want or appreciate a stop/start technology being employed, ARE the hybrid audience, that are buying vehicles with this technology by default.

Unless the gas mileage boost is significant, most of the full ICE gear heads I know, would be highly against just the concept that their vehicle was turning off, and on, at stops.

But, I still think it's a good thing to see the attempt.
Having owned a Hybrid myself?
I wouldn't be adverse to that technology in a ICE vehicle I owned.
But since we aren't dealing with the vetted HSD system, that includes electric motors at start up and low speed, I guess I would have some concern how a "regular" engine would hold up to the same stop/start stress that a Hybrid is so brilliantly engineered to handle.

 

Was your Civic hybrid a manual car? If so, my Insight worked the same way before I deleted the hybrid system. Now I just key off to coast.

CVTs and automatics aren't designed to drive with the engine off due to no transmission fluid being circulated. The Civic hybrid has no EV mode like the Prius, which circulates transmission fluid by the electric motor if I have my facts straight. Don't quote me on that.

Non-hybrid automatics and CVTs don't have anything to circulate transmission fluid while the car is off, hence why they don't turn off until 0 mph.

 

Start/stop systems are basic mild hybrids without regenerative braking. They are even called micro-hybrids by some.

Many Fords and GMs now have these systems, including the F150 and the tiny diesel in the Equinox and Cruze. The 2017 Malibu we test drove had it. Some of the earliest ones available in the US were the latest Fusion when introduced, the Malibu after the first eAssist was dropped, and one of the Kias.

We didn't get many though because their impact on the EPA test was generally very small. That Kia and Fusion may have had a 1mpg higher rating in the city than the model without it. Now just having these systems gives a bonus to CAFE values. Europe has had them for far longer.

Some people that haven't driven a hybrid find these systems annoying.

Newer systems will do the shut off while coasting.

It made it to production, but not to here.
Fuel-Saving Mazda i-Stop Stalled In U.S. Because Of EPA Tests
The article is from 2011, so we might see it. The US does get their regenerative braking system. Together, the systems make a mild hybrid without a traction battery

Depends on the transmission. Most have the fluid pump on the front end, driven by the engine. Some have it on the back end, where it is driven by the wheels. Then some are designed to be adequately lubricated by just fluid splashing. If a car can be flat towed, the transmission is being lubricated with the engine off.

 

The 2019 Subaru Forester has start/stop. A friend has it and doesn't like it. It is not as seamless as a regular hybrid because it does use the starter motor to restart. He can turn it off but it is automatically re-engaged the next time he uses his vehicle. At the end of each drive it tells him how much money he saved (not much). He purposely uses "rolling stops" more than he used to to minimize engine stopping.

I wouldn't call it a mild hybrid. Some previous Honda models were considered mild hybrids because the electric motor would assist the gas motor but couldn't power the vehicle by itself. Micro hybrid? To me, no electric power, no hybrid.

 

I don't care for the term, but micro-hybrid is an accepted technical one for a car with an auto start/stop system. Add regenerative braking, and you have a mild hybrid.

Assist hybrids are mild ones that do more than the bare minimum to be a mild system. I don't think there is an official, technical definition, because of the vagueness of the term assist. What makes one system an assist and one a mild? Is the division defined by the electric motors power or torque output, or the ratio of that to engines, or something else? Assist hybrid is more of a marketing term.

 

IIRC the "silent start" on the Honda hybrids used about 5x the power that the conventional starter did.

The Camry/Prius never actually shut off completely; you're still running on electricity that must be recuperated by burning gasoline. Unless you're braking, that is.

I key on/off and bump start all the time in the Insight and haven't ever had a problem. As long as you do it on a straight you should be fine.

 

Unless it changed, the i-Eloop system uses a supercapacitor. It also made an improvement on US tests. The package it was part of also included active grill shutters.

It also spun up the engine to a faster speed so the starts inflicted less wear and tear.

Or stopped, or gliding. Even when used, the battery is usually replenished when the engine is running in its efficient range.

 

Just editorial, not trying to be a smart you-know-what:

Who are you addressing? I don't see anyone on my ignore list, you're not quoting anyone, and your's is use of "civic hybrid" (or "civic") on the page.

Maybe the mod's deleted some posts??