Are we BETA TESTERS ?

I like to think of myself as an unofficial Toyota Prius component specialist. The next item to test will the updated NAV software :lol:

 

We are clearly not beta testers.

The 3 generations, 7 years, and 250,000 vehicles now, Prius is the real thing. The technology is already well proven.

What else is there to test?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(john1701a\";p=\"52326)</div>

hypersensitivity to warp drive

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Charles Suitt\";p=\"52299)</div>

no, No, NO!!!

I totally disagree.

We are Priites!
Um, or is is Priatans?
Priians?
Priorkers? :wink:

 

Priusisianites

 

I like the term "Priatan." Although "Priatanese" isn't bad either. Hmmm... too much time on my hands!

 

some of all the computer code used in the auto industry could use tweeking at times. And most of the manufactures just ignore minor problems unless the NTSA get's invloved then it's recall time. Most just replace modules whereas Toyota reprograms the modules. Don't ever kid yourself all the other manufactrues are watching the Prius like a hawk eye's a rabbit in a field. The mandated change to the CAN network in 2006 is just an indication that all this is coming down the pike for all manufactures. Reprogram instead of replace. As such I do think that at a base level we are beta testers to a certian extent. What level the others will take it to we'll have to wait and see. If reprograming a module or computer is proven to be economical and no hue and cry erupts from the buyers then this will become the norm.

 

In other words, we are in the UPGRADE phase now.

 

SP1 or is it SP2 or 12 I'm not sure anymore. Now the question is can some hack re-write it to get more power or better low speed torque or any of a dozen other things. Have you found the USB port on the main computer yet?

 

I'm still leery of CANbus and LIN from the process control side. Can these issues be fixed? Sure, given enough "real world" feedback. Should these issues have been fixed before the "real world?" Well, that would have been nice. As far as changing operating parameters, you don't have to wait for CANbus. Remember how the earlier GM cars and trucks had removable PROM's, so you could order a high performance PROM from Hypertech and just plug it in? With OBD2, you order the programmer from Hypertech or another company and plug it into the diagnostic port under the dash to flash new operating parameters. There is good hacking information at http://obddiagnostics.com/obdinfo/info.html . I'm sure Hypertech and others are working on CANbus. The primary advantage to CANbus - so they say - is to "network" all the devices so they share the same physical comms. This really cuts down the size, weight, and complexity of the wire loom if it doesn't have to carry individual component connectors. With CANbus, DeviceNet, ControlNet, HART, ProfiBus, etc, the biggest issue can be timing and unresolved software errors. That stands to reason, right? Rather than having an individual sensor indicate "bad" and throw the system into Limp Home mode, an error can now propagate throughout the system and cause an ABEND: The Red Triangle Of Doom. Since all new cars have or will soon have CANbus, expect to see more of these issues.

 

As you point out about Canbuss Toyota is now at the forfront of it by using it on the Prius again making us beta testers as such. Hypertech etal dosen't hack the newer systems do to liability, due to the ABS system being in the main computer. As such about all they do now is the diesel side of the NA market.

 

we are not beta testers...

i have beta tested several computer software programs and the Prius is no where near that level.

The Prius has not had a major flaw revealed. it (so far... knock on wood!!) hasnt suffered any critical issues. now part of that reason may very well have to do with the fact the new model is well NEW... also limited rollout... still under 100,000 nationally. bigger numbers will reveal major defects faster.

look at the upcoming recall of the Honda accord. but its a flaw that has been on the streets for nearly 3 years and covers 550,000 vehicles. those larger numbers helps to push flaws up to the surface quicker.

so problems?... ya probably... if we didnt, we would be very unique and special indeed if not plain lucky. but beta testers??? no way... not even close.

 

I would pray no vehicle out there is so "raw" that you are truly a Beta tester.

That said, it really shook my confidence when my month old Prius expired on me. Ironically, my local dealer received the TSB about a week before it happened and had not had time to bring me in before the breakdown.

A lot of vehicles have TSB's, and AllData should be proof of that. Let's differentiate between "annoying" TSB's and "critical" TSB's.

My 2000 GMC Sierra had tons of TSB's, mostly related to customer complaints about squeaks, rattles, and other noises. Also poorly-fitting trim, which my GMC had in abundance.

OBD2 introduced us to a lot of software-related issues (Misfire, lopey idle, hard start, etc) caused by a specific calibration. The newest version of the calibration usually cured the specific complaint. OBD2 was not networked, so that didn't enter into the picture.

With CANbus on the scene, developers have to consider the issue of timing across the network, and how to gracefully handle timing and device conflicts. If a device gets stuck in Jabber and floods the network, you're in serious trouble. The only time a device should prioritize is if it has specific assigned right to do so.

As an example, in the Industrial world with Foundation FieldBus, you designate one and only one device on the segment as the backup LAS (Link Active Scheduler). The LAS has priority over the other devices on the segment and can function as backup if communication is lost with the central ECU.

I would hope that something as critical as the braking system and the accelerator system has this degree of reduncancy.

It's essential the dealer has proper understanding of the complexity of these new bussed device cars. One should expect a fairly rapid and steep learning curve as manufacturers understand how networked devices truly behave outside the test lab.

Quick feedback from dealers helps to minimize real-world issues. A local dealer who refuses to invest the time and effort to properly understand our cars not only does a disservice to the owner, but also a disservice to the manufacturer.

 

remember when chrsyler mini vans were all the rage??

well i know one person who didnt have much of an opinion on them.

probably stems from the fact that his brand new vehicle died on him 3 times. and each time it was when he was crossing the Tacoma Narrows bridge.