$3 and up at pump in '07?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jkash @ Dec 29 2006, 12:54 PM) [snapback]368253[/snapback]</div>

Prices here in New York are climbing right now, up to $2.56 at one gas station near my house.

Harry

 

With all due respect, Jeff, what am I supposed to do with this information?

It isn't like I can take any action. I already own a Prius.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jkash @ Dec 29 2006, 09:54 AM) [snapback]368253[/snapback]</div>

Setttle? Well, maybe for a short while, until people get used to it and they can raise them again. I predict that $10-a-gallon gas will be a subject for nostalgic reminiscences in a decade.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Dec 29 2006, 12:27 PM) [snapback]368270[/snapback]</div>

They don't really say what "settle" means. I assume it's for the summer? Phasing out MTBE means ethanol will need to be added, which in the short term (next couple years) is not cheap, so that will add a bit to the price. It's hard to say what the short-term fluctuations in oil prices will be, but overall I'm guessing we'll be hitting $10/gallon in about 7-10 years, not quite as pessimistic as you, but still more so than the average consumer. It all depends on the mid-east. Hopefully we'll be transitioning from petroleum to cellulosic ethanol by then (and some bio-diesel), but it'll still be the beginning stages.

 

Gas is already starting a slow climb here.

$3.50 a gallon? Hey, we had that in 2006 already. In fact higher than that.

I won't be surprised if there is a short $4 or close to spurt in 2007.

It will come back down again, but go up even farther in 2008.

$5 a gallon by 2010.

I hope Toyota has there plug-in by then or at least announced the release of one by 2013.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Rick Auricchio @ Dec 29 2006, 02:23 PM) [snapback]368267[/snapback]</div>

You could drive less, or carpool, even take transit, ride your bike, or walk.
You could turn down the thermostat, put on a sweater, maybe add some insulation to your house.
You could buy locally grown produce, and work on growing your own.

Most things will get more expensive as gas prices rise, and most of us will consume less as a result.

There are many things you can do. Buying a car is not exactly the one and only requirement for reducing your impact.

 

I'll be putting in vegetable beds. Probably mix some in with the flowers too.

We always had a garden growing up. My Dad has continued to maintain a good sized garden. A lot of tomatoes, peppers, even artichokes. My mother has done lettuces and herbs. They also have a lot of fruit trees. They don't buy orange juice at the store. Instead they squeeze one or two oranges each morning. The tree bears enough of the year to get by.

I don't have the yard my parents have, but I'm glad I bought a house rather than a condo or renting an apartment. I have land. I can plant whatever I want. (Because I chose an older neighborhood without an "association" that dictated what I could and could not grow in my yard.) I have a lemon tree. I'll probably add an apricot in the front. I've got a planter planned out for the vegetables and places to add a few more here and there. I think some are quite ornamental. I see no difference between having to plant and replant vegetables and having to plant and replant annuals. And there's no rule they can't live together.

I'll never be able to rely solely on my garden. Even my parents can't do that and they have substantial fruit trees and garden area.

But I can certainly cut down on the amounts I buy in season.

And nothing can match the taste or freshness of what you grow.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TonyPSchaefer @ Dec 29 2006, 02:52 PM) [snapback]368307[/snapback]</div>

I paid $2.31 9/10ths today. The really good news was he only took just over 4 gals. which equates to 56.4 MPG. Way to go Prius! Hopefully I'll have 2 Prius's sometime in '07 if the $$$ are right.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hyo silver @ Dec 29 2006, 12:12 PM) [snapback]368323[/snapback]</div>

All good points, especially about all goods and services costing more as fuel costs rise.

We do drive the Prius much more than my wife's 1995 Volvo, so that helps. Transit is out of the question in our rural area. We have always kept the house cool, and I try to buy local produce whenever I can. (Being in California helps a lot with this.) No chance of growing produce this close to the ocean, but we do have a big rosemary bush. (I'll never use all of that.)

Here in California our fuel prices have been high for over a year because MTBE was outlawed. That's good, because there are many instances of groundwater pollution from MTBE.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Rick Auricchio @ Dec 29 2006, 04:56 PM) [snapback]368370[/snapback]</div>

This is what I find ironic.

Our fuel prices were higher than the rest of the US and we're told the added cost was because they had to ADD MTBE.

Now that it's outlawed and our prices are still highest across the country, we're told the added cost is because they have to NOT add the MTBE.

Liars. They're all liars.

 

All the while Cheney, bin Lauden, The Bushies, and The House of Saudi will be laughing all the way to the bank.

I say let it rise and "people" like GM's Lutz and Wagoner will all choke on the Tahoe and Surburban and the H2's. Too bad that Mr. and Mrs. W-04 will suffer but they made their choices too.

Think I'll call my Dealer and order our second Hybrid in the morning.

 

Why do I always get the feeling that a significant % of the members of this forum would be DELIGHTED to see gas go sky high? Yeah, we bought our Prius as a hedge against that and also as a "right thing to do" from an eco perspective. I understand all the arguments to the effect that only very high prices will lower consumption and ultimately force more research regarding alternative fuel, etc. etc. But that argument always leaves me a little cold. If you're middle class on up, the argument comes easy. If you are driving a gas guzzling PU truck struggling to make ends meet and you need the truck to keep your job -- well things are a little different. And there are millions of folks in this situation. $5 gas would hurt them extremely badly. I have family and friends in this situation so I try not to get too smug with my government pension and a little disposable income. It's a real dilemma and I don't know what the solution should or could be. I'd just hate to see hard working class folks brought to their knees because politicians were too moronic to do the right thing during the 70's oil embargo.

 

The American lifestyle has shifted dramatically in the past 50 years. We have decided that we have to live far from our jobs, necessitating long commutes; We have decided that we have to drive cars four times as big as necessary for our actual transportation needs; We have decided that we have to live in houses two or three times bigger than our parents lived in; We have decided that we have to own a car big enough to tow the boat for that once-a-year vacation; We have decided that it would be a violation of our right as Americans to be forced to conserve or recycle or take public transportation; and now that the squeeze is on we refuse to give up anything and return to a more sustainable lifestyle. And we've decided that we have to spend trillions of dollars on war, but we refuse to pay for it honestly with taxes, so we borrow from the rest of the world so our economy is dependent on people we really don't like, and who don't like us, and any time they decide to pull out we're screwed.

We've dug our own hole and we've nobody to blame but ourselves. And even if we exterminate the Iraqis and import refugees from the world's genocidal wars to work the oil fields and ship all the oil here, there still won't be enough.

So complain all you like about where the price of gas is going, but the gas ain't gonna listen, it's just going to keep getting more expensive regardless of who likes it and who doesn't.

Of course, we could switch to EVs and renewable electricity, but it would be a violation of our basic rights as Americans to have to plug in our car overnight and be limited to a couple hundred miles of driving per charge.

Is it any wonder if some people have contempt for us?

 

(preaching to the choir here)
I have to agree w/some of daniel's points.

I see too many people driving insanely large and heavy (5000 lb.+) gas guzzling SUVs such as Expeditions, Yukons, Tahoes, Suburbans, H2s, etc. around where I live, most of whom clearly don't need such a vehicle. It's obvious they don't care about other drivers, our dependence on foreign oil or pollution either. Seems like the American public complains and moans when gas prices reach $2.50+/gallon yet other countries have MUCH higher gas prices and are able to cope.

Although I don't like high gas prices either, but maybe they should go up to the $8/gal or more (I hear it's that high now in the UK) so that people really are forced to conserve and buy more sensible vehicles.

 

Not that there's any connection, but prices (profits?) can't follow junior forever. The trends in this graph will have to diverge soon or oil profits will take a dump. Unwritten corporate law states that sometimes ya gotta stick it to your friends sooner or later.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Dec 30 2006, 02:42 AM) [snapback]368531[/snapback]</div>

That's right ... several spots here in south O.C. are over $3.00 and why whine about it ... much of the world pays a bigger chunk O change than many of us. Bring on peak oil & the paradigm shift !!

 

Many of us DO have to live far from our work because there is no suitable work with decent pay near our homes, and housing near work is unaffordable.

Now the other things we HAVE to have (sarcastically) are cellphones (one for every member of the house, including the newborn), high end laptop computers (instead of last year's model of a desktop), TVs in every room of the house with accompanied DVD and sattelite receiver with premium channel package, etc.