Prius 2010 Oil Change Interval Revised? Not yet... (closed)

As a side-note, I can't believe that places charge this much for an oil change using synthetic oil. Synthetic only costs $3 more (+/-) per quart, and there is no difference in the actual procedure for changing the oil. So it should only cost $12-$15 more than a regular oil change.

These dealerships are really taking advantage of people!

Bryan

 

Thats why they have earned the reputation for being stealerships.
I can see it if it took a qualified mechanic or someone with a high level of schooling to do the job...
Some jobs, you take to the dealer, but most you don't.

 

Some... Some...

OTOH..many stores offer oil and filters Free for Life...as in forever. I'm at 130,000 mi in 3 yr 10 mo's and at the rate of 5-6 OC's per year I have yet to pay one cent for any oil or oil filter on my 2005.

 

Thats exactly what smart management at any given dealer should do.

The oil and labor is nil for them and they almost always find other things that need serviced.
The customer has the assurance of knowing all has been looked over by the dealer and can opt out if they intend to take care of the issue themselves.. its a win-win.
And since few dealers do it, it leaves a warm and fuzzy feeling on behalf of the customer to return to do all their business.. whether to buy a car or get more serious mechanic work done.

Any store trys all sorts of gimmicks and schemes to get you into the door because human nature says you'll buy much more than what the feebee was. IMO, dealers are just being silly to take advantage on such a mindless easy job that most people can do.

Heck, I would take my car in if it was free!... and most likely I would get more things done from time to time.

But its a "hassle" to take my car to the dealer and wait and wait and deal with all the balls they are juggling... I'd rather do it in the comfort of my own driveway.

I need some incentive to go to the dealer! All I see is negative unless money is no object and your not worried about some grease monkey overfilling your car with a pressurized pump system that blast it in or worse putting the wrong product in you paid for assuming you won't know the difference.

 

Don't remember the name of the place where I ordered mine from and I'm 1000 miles from home now (in Southern Utah) so I can't look it up. But it cost to much and I had to buy a 24mm socket to fit it also.

 

DeadPhish,

You are certainly right -- there are some good dealerships out there. Yours is obviously one, Dianne's dealership is great, and I'm sure there are more.

And windstrings is definitely right -- I don't know why more dealerships don't offer this service. Once folks get to know a maintenance department and begin to feel at home, they will most likely have tons of other maintenance performed. It's human nature...

Bryan

 

Again, I really hope you have no engine trouble and that you keep your car through the entire warranty period. Take any risk you desire, but please do so after knowing the facts.

Your customer rep is wrong. If he can get a letter from Toyota, addressed to you or to all 2010 Prius owners, in general, that the wording of the Owner's Manual and the Warranty have been changed (or really don't mean what they say), then you can take his word for it. In the meantime, consider the fact your warranty is based on compliance with the basic requirements of maintenance, as state in the Owner's Manual.

Here is the information directly from your Owner's Manual, page 560:

Engine oil selection

“Toyota Genuine Motor Oil†is used in your Toyota vehicle. Use
Toyota approved “Toyota Genuine Motor Oil†or equivalent to satisfy the following grade and viscosity.

Oil grade: ILSAC multigrade engine oil

Recommended viscosity: SAE 0W-20

SAE 0W-20 is the best choice for good fuel economy and good
starting in cold weather.

If SAE 0W-20 is not available, SAE 5W-20 may be used. However, it must be replaced with SAE 0W-20 at the next oil change.

The 0W portion of the oil viscosity rating indicates the characteristic of the oil which allows cold startability. Oils with a lower value before the W allow for easier starting of the engine in cold weather.

The 20 in 0W-20 indicates the oil viscosity when the oil is at its operating temperature. An oil with a higher viscosity may be better suited if the vehicle is operated at high speeds, or under extreme load conditions.
​

If you read this to say 0W-20 is not required, then you have to present the specific situation where another oil is allowed. Here are the options:

1. "IF SAE 0W-20 is not available." This means that you are in a unique situation where that oil is not available and you must change the oil to protect the engine. The very next statement is that at the next oil change 0W-20 MUST be used. If you find a Toyota dealer or oil change facility that doesn't have 0W-20, that means you are at the wrong place. If you MUST use that facility, then say you'll be back in a few minutes and go to an auto parts store, WalMart or any number of stores that carry oil, and buy the 0W-20 oil yourself and bring it back for those folks to use. If the shop carries a filter that fits the 2010 Prius, they'll carry the required oil.
2. "f the vehicle is operated at high speeds. . ." If this applies to you, then you are allowed to use a different oil. But is it any oil? No, the manual allows an oil with a higher viscosity. That doesn't mean moving the low-end number higher (0W-20 to 5W-20), but the high-end number higher -- going from 0W-20 to 0W-30 or 0W-40. Both of these also are synthetics.
   [*]". . . or under extreme load conditions." As with the high-speed option, this also is solved by going to a higher viscosity.
   

The maintenance schedule is what it is. If the engine needs repair and the required oil wasn't used or wasn't changed according to the schedule, the only out you will have is to present proof that the oil at each time you changed it was in good condition. This may work with 5W-20 or 5W-30, but if 0W-20 is used and the oil is changed according to the maintenance schedule, then the warranty will be honored.

 

Must tell you, I'm finding this whole matter rather odd. Six days ago (incl U.S holiday) we were alerted of 'evidence' (from one U.S. dealer) the '10 Prius OCI is extended to 10K miles.

As of today - still no definitive answer. Either way.
To many this is no insignificant matter. And to some their 5K is coming up soon.

So what's the deal Toyota? This seems to be rather simple. Either the information and document the South Florida dealer exhibited is wrong or right. Period. Let's end the speculation.

Not to cast stones on Doug's Toyota USA Group, but this seems to be a simple issue to resolve:
-Call the Dealer's management to determine where they obtained the specific information.
-Contact the responsible Company Executive in charge of Toyota/Prius maintenance requirements to get clarification.

It's either right or wrong or premature and under consideration. Am I missing something here?

 

a priori --

Good analysis. I checked with Toyota Customer Service and was told emphatically that the oil change interval on the Prius 2010 has NOT been changed. So anyone that chooses to delay the oil change is definitley putting their warranty in jeopardy.

I think the Toyota fliers that are shown in the OP are from a marketing/sales brochure that is intended only to encourage pre-2010 models to use synthetic oil. There is no direct mention of the 2010 Prius.

And my dealership purportedly uses a "synthetic blend". I think that is 25% synthetic; they are behind the curve on this one. Since I have several months to go before I will need my first oil change, I will check it again then and maybe they will adjust. Acoording to one web site, dealerships vary all over the place on what they require. I like the idea of taking my own oil in and having them do the labor.

If some readers aren't aware of it, 0W-20 oil only comes in synthetic form and if one checks the top of the oil filler cap it states "0W-20" ; that is more confirmation of what one should use.

If one were to use a different weight oil and had an engine failure, I learned that Toyota would have prove the oil caused the problem - and that's never been done. On the other hand you may need oil samples from the engine to prove it was not the cause. So why bother with all this legal hassle when for a few bucks you can just use what is stated in the warranty schedule. Then all one needs are the receipts if a problem comes up.

 

Some things probably need to happen in the background before Toyota can announce this.

They need to make sure the dealerships have synthetic 0W20 on hand. As many have stated in this thread and in others, some dealership only have regular oil and don’t have 0W20 viscosity. Also, some dealers will be very unhappy about this (cut in half the number of times you go to their dealership for oil changes).

I’ll stick with the word from the TMS team: “patienceâ€. Anyway the first 5,000 miles oil change will still need to be done. So the question is whether the next one is at 10,000miles or 15,000 miles.

 

Can you site any concrete example other than perhaps a
racecar,where an engine failed because the owner used
a similar grade of regular oil rather than synthetic?But back to
the point,you believe that the warranty is shaky if one
doesn't use 0W-20 and change the oil every six months?
Call 800-331-4331 and ask for a supervisor.Ask the supervisor if Toyota has ever dishonored a warranty due
to a customer using regular oil or a synthetic of a slightly
different grade.You might be surprised at the answer.

 

The question isn't just about engine failure, it is about having engine repairs covered under the warranty -- whatever the problem. As far as Toyota is concerned, we don't have to go very far to define the problem. It was the class action lawsuit against Toyota for sludging. Toyota honored warranties in very shaky circumstances and then re-wrote the book, literally, to require higher frequencies in oil change intervals. I don't think there will be a second time.

You offer an intriguing proposition, and I think I should make the call to see what Toyota may say. I assume you've done just this and received an answer you have found comforting or acceptable. Perhaps I'll have the same feeling after the call?

What I know is what the Owner's Manual and Warranty require, and I'll stick with that so as to avoid a fight should the need arise. I like the idea of less frequent oil changes, using a synthetic oil, but I don't do oil changes myself, any more, and I'm not likely going to start now, so I won't be grabing samples to send in for a UOA.

Still, you have a different comfort level with this, and you are welcome to it. Until there is a change in written policy, I won't vary from it. (Even if the answer I get during the call is: "Do what you want, just be reasonable.")

 

Not quite.

Toyota did NOT honor warranties of vehicles maintained "by the book" using the old service interval, and crap North American oil. The design of some Toyota motors encouraged sludge to form, and the end result was the class action lawsuit

Oddly enough, the same motors used in the rest of the world didn't appear to have sludge issues even run 12 months or 10,000 miles. But they were filled with EU spec ACEA oils, not crap North American spec oils

As a result, Toyota universally lowered the oil change interval for North America: 6 months or 5,000 miles

For something like a Tundra that holds 7.5 quarts of 0W-20, that gets pretty expensive

 

Thanks for the correction, Jayman. You are right on this.

I recall talking with our dealer's service manager about this. He was absolutely certain that most of the damaged engines were NOT serviced by the book, but that Toyota "gave in" in many cases. He thought a lot of it was simply to try to save face and not alienate a large number of customers.

The end result, as you note, is much the same -- the OCI for us is now shorter. The other significant change is moving the recommended oil to a synthetic that will be more uniform and of a higher quality.

 

I would love to have a wee chat with your service manager about that topic!

If it was a clear case of owner neglect (Three year old vehicle, no evidence of even a single oil change) then the class action suit would have gone nowhere. It's well established that some Toyota engines are prone to sludging

Since Toyota isn't allowed to specify a better oil for the North American market, they instead have an oil change interval 1/2 that of their EU market vehicles

An aunt and uncle of mine had a Toyota Sienna minivan, one of those with the sludge-prone motor. They lived in Palm Springs during that time, and he ran Mobil 1 15W-50 year round.

He usually changed the oil and dealership filter once a year, but the oil would usually have 15,000 miles on it. Over five years, no trouble at all

So, a motor that everybody claims to be prone to "sludge" may only be prone to sludge in North America, or if operated under severe conditions. It's pretty easy to find a sludged up motor in Winnipeg: stop and go city driving at -40 in winter, is pretty hard on a vehicle and very hard on a motor oil

 

I don't know if dealerships will be so upset about this change if it manifests. For the service department, it would mean less potential oil changes but for sales, a 10,000 mile interval is a great selling point. Plus, pre-paid maintenance becomes less of a value. More of a value to sell, less of a expense for the dealership to execute.

As a potential owner, I'm hoping the interval is increased. I'd think if you had a newbie walking on the lot, being able to tell them The Prius goes 10,000 miles between recommended oil changes would be huge. It's also very much in keeping with The Prius's being a green car. That's far less consumption of Oil and Filters over the life of the vehicle.

It's not a deal breaker for me if it isn't adopted. Once outside of warranty I could adapt, adopt whatever interval with which I feel comfortable. But it sure would be nice if through the years of warranty the interval was officially 10,000.

Outside of all this, is what is being debated throughout this thread, which is what actually IS best for the vehicle. Most seem to feel 5000 is too soon for a full synthetic. I certainly wouldn't risk warranty just to go 5000 additional miles. So it's simple...until it's official, it's nothing.

 

Well I was hoping not to have to change my oil at the 10,200 mile mark but I guess I will have to.

Seems a real waste of good oil to change it so soon. Its like drinking a delicious cold beer than throwing half of it away when your down to half of the mug.

alfon

 

Perhaps it is a bit more like watching someone just tip the mug and poor the rest of your beer out on the ground -- right in front of your eyes.

I feel the same frustration, but I still have 2,900 miles to go before I hit 10,000, and I'm hoping to receive official news (no disrespect to the OP) by then of a change to the OCI.

 

I followed my own suggestion and this time I asked for
a supervisor who informed me that Toyota would not
honor the warranty if 0W-20 oil was not used as you
correctly pointed out.The six month and/or period is not set
in cement,but I feel that Toyota is overdoing this oil
maintenance schedule to line their pockets as well as the
oil companies.I'm going to request a formal explanation
in writing as to why 5w-20 synthetic or regular oil is
insufficient for normal driving.Is this engine like the old
german luger that used to jam because of adverse
weather?Are the engine tolerances that fine as to
permit more friction and wear from a heavier oil? Hard
to believe in a four cylinder engine.